Saiga 12....I think I caught the FEVER.

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rjrivero

rjrivero

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After having my A$$ handed to me on the shot gun stages by my younger brother rocking his "look-what-I-just-bought-to-kick-your-a$$" Saiga 12 at our last 3 gun shoot, I think it's time to get back into the "arms race."

I just called my Local FFL and threw down an order for a Saiga 12. I've been reading as much as I can on these guns, but have some ground to make up before the next 3 gun shoot.

Before I get the gun in, I would like to hear any of your personal experiences with the Saiga 12 and any pitfalls that you may be able to help me avoid.

Thanks in advance.

RJ
 
A recent search of the shotgun forum revealed 507 threads on the Saiga 12 - I suspect that you'll have plenty of reading. :)

I have one and like it well enough. I don't game with it so my opinion of it is probably going to be different than someone who does.
 
I just secured one myself. After reading all the posts, I went to the range just to spend some "break in" time, which they seem to need. Believe it. First several mags with 00 buck, set on "1", I had some failure to feeds. But you can tell, the gun starts to limber up after going through a few mags worth. Then I set gas plug to "2" and ran heavy field loads of 7 1/2s. Had NO failures to feed on those, so I guess it is starting to get worked in.

This gun has so much available in parts and upgrades. I didn't want to go hog wild until I spend some time with the gun. I have not patterned it. Also not sure that short sight radius is a draw back in a shotgun? Rifle, I can see it, shotgun, not sure.

Like a .22, it will take me a little time to figure out which ammo it likes best. Functioning is my main concern. Not sure that I even consider "accuracy" something that I worry about with a shotgun.

The gun will beat you up a bit. If the weather allows, I would suggest a heavy shirt or shoulder pad. I am still running standard Saiga butt stock. I like it as far as speed to shoulder. But it is hollow and seems a bit questionable on durability, to me anyway. Haven't noticed a post that says the stocks fail after so many rounds? I did fill mine with expanding foam to give a little more solid feel and support, but almost seems unnecessary. Haven't shot it yet with the filled butt stock to see if there is a difference.

My factory mag would not lock in. After a small amount of filing on the mag tab, it clicks and works just fine. Caution on material removal. File small amounts and check fit often. That is if you even have to work the mag at all?

All the best. They are cool guns.
 
I've taken it skeet shooting and have popped clays out at 80 yards consistently. I was rather amazed, now I have the 22" or whatever it is, "the longer barrel".

I have only had a couple of failure to feeds, mine seems to like most any ammo that I run through it. Thinking of all the lead that can be thrown down range with 00 buck is simply staggering. I bought mine because I was afraid that it would soon end up on the DD list like the street sweeper and go for 10X the price.

I have had 0 luck trying to find a sling for mine though.
 
The siaga 12 has it very own forum, siaga-12.com

If your going to rock it, well be prepared to drop 7-800 bones for a converted one, or do it yourself with the good parts, you want a troymix gas valve, any piston does it, and then probably a tapco collapsible stock and any flavor of AK pistol grip, add to that and get a good trigger, finally you'll need to complete the look with a 20 round drum, there is only one to buy, or I should say, one one that works. The MD arms.

So for slightly over 1200 dollars, you too can rock out (actually it's less than 650 if you do it yourself and scrounge for parts)
 
I've found mine feeds the Wal-Mart Federal bulk ammo just fine, but will not fully eject the other bulk ammo. I guess the other stuff doesn't have as much oomph to it, so it doesn't cycle the bolt correctly. The federal stuff make for good cheap skeet ammo.
 
I own/have owned a number a saigas including a number of S12s.

Saigas (and a number of other shotguns) seem to dislike bulk winchester ammo. With the fed bulk mine has run fine from the first shot on gas setting 2.

I was just out shooting some three gun style shooting with my S12 the other day and it reminded me of what a potent weapon it is.

If you are going to shoot three gun (actually I suggest this for anyone who has a S12) I would suggest converting it to a pistol grip configuration. This will give you better balance, ergos, and a much better trigger. Avoid the cheesy pistol grip stock combo from tapco. It offers none of the major advantages of a pistol grip conversion and is a total waste of money IMO. The money is better spent doing it right the first time.

The next best mod one can make (particularly for 3 gun) in my opinion is probably a magazine well. I run a JTE mag well and am well pleased with it. A magwell makes reloads much faster and easier (which means more consistency and no bobbled reloads). Some will say wait for the MD double stacks and a the mag well for them. I saw a lot of that about a year or more ago when I bought my magwell. I am happy I have been enjoying my mag well instead of waiting for a product with no set release date. I also have a drum but I think a magwell is a better setup. An extended mag release goes nicely with this setup.

For versatility and rapid changes a poly choke is a good option. Others have the barrel threaded internally.

One can spend much more on a full out race gun but a very solid performer can be built for around $1000 if you do the work yourself (it is pretty easy do to).

The gun will beat you up a bit.
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I must respectfully disagree. I consider mine to be a soft shooters. My S12s are a pleasure to shoot compared to my 20" coach gun or the various pumps I have. After having them for years I haven't even bothered to put a recoil pad on any of them. I am not a recoil junkie either.

Here is a link to a S12 project that I started about a year ago. This gun is not a dedicated race gun but it certainly is up to use in three gun among other things. http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=473230 One day I'll update that thread with the newest tweeks.

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I'm thinking about buying one instead of an FN SLP Mark 1. Can a saiga cycle brenneke hardened slugs effectively?
 
I'm thinking about buying one instead of an FN SLP Mark 1. Can a saiga cycle brenneke hardened slugs effectively?
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Mine can. If the gun cannot cycle slugs on setting one it has a serious problem. The biggest advantage to the aftermarket plugs is that they make changing the settings much easier. There had been some lively discussion over on the s12 forum to the effect that the gun fixer plug really is not a solution to under gassed guns. If people have cycling problems it is typically with light loads because the gun is under gassed. Even the two gas hole "vodka specials" would run high brass loads.
 
Thanks for the advice, everyone.

I ended up picking one up yesterday. New in the box iz-109. With the help of the folks at Saiga-12.com I went ahead and profiled the bolt to allow easier loading on a closed bolt, polished the bolt, polished the rails on the bolt carrier and took it to the skeet field today. I picked up a couple boxes of Winchester Skeet/Field at Wal-mart and the gun cycled wonderfully!!!

The only problem with the rifle is the fact that the sights are not in line with the barrel. Apparently I'm not the only one with this issue. I'm going to drift the rear sight and then re-shape the dovetail.

All in all, a much "smaller" project than I had originally anticipated. I'm a happy camper. ;)
 
All in all, a much "smaller" project than I had originally anticipated. I'm a happy camper.
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Avoid shooting converted guns at all costs then. I have had a couple of people who thought they were happy with their stock S12s shoot one of my converted guns and it was only a matter of time until they restored their own guns to the platforms intended design.

Its like driving a mustang that you think is pretty cool and then taking a Porsche out for a spin, suddenly you realize what you are missing.
 
Don't get me wrong, this Saiga is going to be a 3 phase project.

It's just that phase 1: Getting the gun to run is a much smaller headache than I had first anticipated.

Phase 2 is going to be making it 922r Compliant.

Phase 3 will be a surprise, even for me as I figure out what accessories I will put on this gun.
 
I own several and think they are teh best fighting and comp gun, period. No tube-fed auto can compete except when stages are designed to pay to the limited advantages of a tube-fed design. Keep in mind: life is Open Class.

My best advice is to check out forum.saiga-12.com. It is the epicenter of all things Saiga.
 
Buy one, do some work to the gas system (new gas plug, make the port bigger) trick it out as much as you can, and it will be the baddest mo-fo on the block for sure. I do like the tube style magazines for quick reloading, but I bought a few 20-rd drums which makes up for that.
 
Buy one, do some work to the gas system (new gas plug, make the port bigger)
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Why mess with the gas system unless you need to? You may also want to read up on what the various gas plugs were designed to do and what they will in fact do. To me an after market plug is probably worth it simply so you can readily adjust the settings by hand.

trick it out as much as you can
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Personally I'd stick to just making useful performance mods but to each his own.
 
don't even bother shooting 7 1/2 bird for the first 400 rounds, Make sure you adjust your gas setting aswell.
 
don't even bother shooting 7 1/2 bird for the first 400 rounds
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Again I would test this one your gun. Saigas can vary gun to gun. I've owned more than own that ran loads like that just fine from shot one. The one thing I have seen on most saigas and a number of other guns for that matter including 870s is problems with winchester bulk ammo at walmart. The Federal bulk has done fine in every one I've seen.
 
I own 13 "traditional" shotguns, but today I caved and ordered a Saiga 12. I just have to see what all the fuss is about. :evil:
 
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