Savage rifles ... the most accurate out-of-the-box ?

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jski

jski

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I have 2 nephews who are into long range shoots. And based solely on what I've read, I made the bold statement that Savage produces, 2nd to none but expensive custom jobs, the most accurate "out of the box" rifles on the market. Now this is primarily based on one factor in particular, the barrel nut for precise headspacing, and on 2 other lesser factors, the accu-trigger and the accu-stock.

Problem is in some recent articles in RIFLE magazine, one about a .30-06 Model 110 and the other about a 6.5-284 Norma Model 111 showing about 1 MoA. The .30-06 with a 180 gr. bullet had 2 MoA.

What's the consensus about the Savage claim to accuracy?

BTW, yes, I aware of the perils of making bold statements not based on experience. Just couldn't resist.
 
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Maybe over 5 years ago that claim was pretty shared on the interwebs. But I'm afraid that isn't probably the case.

Savages are up there. But the competition is so tight that any blanket absolute statements are very arguable.

Tikka, Bergara, weatherby/Howa, Ruger, and winchester are all producing great rifles in the same price range as Savage offerings that are shooting sub MOA on a somewhat consistent basis.

I would put a Tikka against a Savage. Maybe. Probably. Yeah sure. Haha
 
Savage has never had the most accurate rifle out of the box. I've had a few, none were bad, but none were any better than anything else. But it is good advertising.

Savage developed a unique method of manufacturing rifles that greatly reduced the need for precision machining and assembly. Most notably the floating bolt face and barrel nut. This allowed Savage to build a very accurate rifle at a significantly reduced price compared to other designs.

It also meant that you almost never get one that has poor accuracy. Other, more traditional rifles will always be at least as accurate as a Savage IF the parts are machined and assembled correctly. But over the years both Remington and Winchester in particular have had QC issues and they let some poorly manufactured rifles out the door. I think it is fair to say that the odds of getting a bad rifle from other manufacturers were better. Or at least used to be. I don't think I've ever heard of a really poor shooting Savage. It isn't that Savage has declined, but other manufacturers have gotten better.

In recent years better manufacturing machines have greatly reduced the costs of making most of the other brands and has eliminated the poor QC. There have been some modern designs that have also contributed to make some other brands more accurate.

The enclosed action on rifles like Tikka, Ruger American, Savage Axis, TC Venture, and others make for a stiffer action. And since they can't be loaded from the top these rifles require a detachable magazine which also contributes to better accuracy. Getting the stock to fit well around the internal magazine was always one of the challenges to an accurate rifle.

Savage deserves credit for the "Accu-stock" idea. But I don't see them pushing that nearly as much anymore. But the Ruger American uses the same principle. Traditionally a stiff, well fitting stock was necessary for exceptional accuracy. The metal "V" blocks used on these rifles allows them to shoot great even in a cheap, flimsy plastic stock.

Right now if I were looking for the most accurate out of the box rifle under $1000 my money is on Tikka. Under $500 the Ruger American Predator.
 
I wouldn't say most accurate out of the box, but for the money, they are very, very accurate. When you can buy a rifle off the Walmart shelf for under $300 that will shoot better than most of us can, hard to fault that. Add in that the barrel nut makes for easy swaps, it's a win-win.
I always recommend them to beginning target shooters; topped with decent glass, they will take you a long way into exploring rifle accuracy before you need to step up the $$$ ladder.
 
entropy said:
I wouldn't say most accurate out of the box, but for the money, they are very, very accurate. When you can buy a rifle off the Walmart shelf for under $300 that will shoot better than most of us can, hard to fault that. Add in that the barrel nut makes for easy swaps, it's a win-win.
I always recommend them to beginning target shooters; topped with decent glass, they will take you a long way into exploring rifle accuracy before you need to step up the $$$ ladder.
Click to expand...

I agree with this 100% My first big bolt gun was a Savage 10T, it has proven to shoot better than I can muster at my current skill level. I also agree... I got a good one, but competition is pretty tight, and certainly ever manufacturer kicks out a substandard rifle or two, it happens. I would add that the Savage is far easier to work on than the Remington 700, I don't know enough about the others to comment.
 
Alright guys, you all have convinced me that the barrel nut is a unique advantage. Savage never had the 1, 2, or 3 lemons out of every 100 manufactured rifles that Winchester or Remington had ... until they bought more advanced machining equipment.
Savage developed a unique method of manufacturing rifles that greatly reduced the need for precision machining and assembly. Most notably the floating bolt face and barrel nut. This allowed Savage to build a very accurate rifle at a significantly reduced price compared to other designs.
Click to expand...
Sounds like a better design to me.
 
I have a 12 FV .223 Rem that shoots moa out to 150 yds with reloads and a Model 40 Varmint Hunter that shot a 20 rnd string @ 100,18 can be covered with a nickel and the other 2 were flyers caused by the shooter (me),

Both of the rifles have the accu-trigger, which are decent but have a little creep but smooth and both have shot very few factory ammo.

In reloading the ammo for both I find very few of the cases need trimming, which I relate to the head spacing of both rifles and I necksize only.
 
I have a Stevens 200 and an early Axis. Even with the not very good but much better than the total piece of crap stock on the Axis the Stevens was very accurate right out of the box. Even with the ill fitting and very flexable stock the Axis was too. I bought them for the actions and planned on building new stocks for both which I have done. There was a slight improvement in accuracy with both builds. It's much easier to use that accuracy now that the stocks fit me and I don't have to make myself fit the stocks. I did some trigger lightning on the Stevens which is easy. I finally replaced the Axis trigger with a Rifle Basix as the Timney trigger was out of stock every where when I decided that replacement was the only solution to what I wanted. The Stevens is no longer available and was only mentioned because it's just a Savage and The Axis now has the accutrigger.

There are several other rifle brands that compete in their price range now that weren't on the market when I bought these that have a good internet reputation for accuracy. I would do some research before I made up my mind due to the large choice now available if I were in the market for a new rifle. There is also the looks factor and Savage always scores at the bottom in most although not all comparisons for me.
 
The Savage rifles based on the 110 action are good rifles without question and usually quite accurate.. Are they generally more accurate then all of the rest of the bolt rifles on the market and equal to all of the hype that has been lavished upon for the last 10-15 years, I don't think so. I think the real bonus in buying a Savage is the ability to swap barrels with a few simple hand tools, made possible by the cost cutting features designed into the rifle.
 
jski said:
Problem is in some recent articles in RIFLE magazine, one about a .30-06 Model 110 and the other about a 6.5-284 Norma Model 111 showing about 1 MoA. The .30-06 with a 180 gr. bullet had 2 MoA.
Click to expand...
This is the most important part of the post, IMO.

The TLDR version is, so what? Saying a particular rifle shoots poorly with a particular round is like chastising a marathon runner who performed poorly on a specific event even though he was wearing shoes.

You can take five different rifles, all made by the same manufacturer, manufactured on the same day, at the same plant, to the same specs, in the same caliber, and it shouldn’t surprise you to find that one rifle shoots best with load X, while another rifle shoots significantly better with load Y.

Now, if the rifle in question shot 2 MOA at best, after being put through it’s paces by a competent hand loader - that would be notably bad. But with random factory ammo, or even match grade factory ammo... It means next to nothing.

I’ve only ever shot one Savage and, while I think they’re generally fine rifles, I certainly don’t have a dog in this fight. But the above is true for all rifles and all ammo.
 
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I’m pretty sure Accuracy International ships their standard models in a box. You can take them out of that box, mount an optic, feed it match ammo and then proceed to outshoot most other rifles. Pretty sure the average AI will handily outshoot the average Savage.

Just ignore that price difference...
 
jski said:
I have 2 nephews who are into long range shoots. And based solely on what I've read, I made the bold statement that Savage produces, 2nd to none but expensive custom jobs, the most accurate "out of the box" rifles on the market. Now this is primarily based on one factor in particular, the barrel nut for precise headspacing, and on 2 other lesser factors, the accu-trigger and the accu-stock.

Problem is in some recent articles in RIFLE magazine, one about a .30-06 Model 110 and the other about a 6.5-284 Norma Model 111 showing about 1 MoA. The .30-06 with a 180 gr. bullet had 2 MoA.

What's the consensus about the Savage claim to accuracy?

BTW, yes, I aware of the perils of making bold statements not based on experience. Just couldn't resist.
Click to expand...

T/C Encore barrels swap also & can shoot with any standard mfg.
But that's just too easy.
Mfg. equipment & a barrel nut doesn't give any mfg. an advantage or does it? It doesn't even make it shoot
better but it is still an excellent rifle. Just like all the other gun makers..
I only own one Savage now & I think it is a model 11 in 7-08 & so light it is great for this worn
out body to carry deer hunting.
My wife used to have a Savage in 270 caliber & she loaned it to a very good friend who had
fell on hard times, long story short it never shot worth a crap after that & believe me I can make
them shoot if it isn't terminal so I found it would shoot 90 grain reloads very good at 100 yards.
But that was all it would shoot. She decided to trade it & disclosed the temperament to the trader.
He said he was going to change the barrel, which made me think he was just blowing air,
& just as I went to get it I noticed the barrel really could be changed but to late. Forever learning &
never coming to the knowledge of the truth!
 
As others have said, the Savages are typically as accurate as anything else out of the box, not any more so. What else they are, however, is more sloppily built for bolt play, and less reliable in feeding when they are pushed hard. A guy can restock a Savage for better fit, put in a better trigger for control, and even put on a better barrel, but the action will always be what it is - just ok. The Savage target action is a great option for single feed benchresters, but for other target games, or hunting, there are many equal or better options on the market.

All of that sounds negative, so I will say, I have 7 Savage rifles and 3 Specialty pistol Strykers, and they all shoot lights out. But when it comes down to serious precision, I do not reach for my Savages - I reach for custom actions.
 
Well it depends. But, I had a savage lrp 6.5 creedmoor that was well below 1/2 moa with handloads. Was so so with factory stuff
 
The lower end savages are a great shooting gun for the money but if you want to talk about really remarkable accuracy out of the box look at the target and varmint models like the bvss, f class, LRPV, ect... They are not cheap but these are some amazing shooting guns.
 
I would say Savage rifles ... accurate AFFORDABLE RIFLE out-of-the-box. I have/had 4 Savages, all shoot well. Barrel nut and floating bolt head are forgiving designs to achieve accuracy with ease on manufacturing without tight tolerance controls. They work well but still need good barrels to deliver accuracy and Savage factory barrels are good for the price. There are more accurate rifles out there, but pricy, and there are better barrels but cost you more than a Savage rifle.
 
I have had two Savage rifles, a Stevens 200 in .243 and a Savage model 10 PCF in .223. The Stevens with it's Tupperware stock and 100 lb trigger pull would shoot MOA with factory ammo and probably would have been sub MOA with hand loads but I didn't reload at that time. The model 10 was junk even with it's long heavy fluted barrel, AccuStock and Accu Trigger. I bought it to shoot in F class target rifle category. In FTR you have to hand load each round, not from the magazine. I couldn't get it to load laying the round on top of the magazine and trying to get the round inserted into the chamber by hand was almost impossible, the chamber is so far forward you can't get the nose of the bullet into it. The best it would was shoot 3 inch patterns at 100 yds with hand loads, factory ammo was worse. The Accu Trigger is a joke and just a gimmick, it's pull was no more adjustable and lighter than the trigger on my Remington 700. Needless to say it found a new owner.
A friend of mine builds F Class, Palma and service rifle competition rifles. He throws the barrel nut away on the Savage rifles he rebarrels, says it is the sorriest mounting system for accurate shooting. It is used only as a cost cutting measure for Savage. Am I only down on Savage, no, that Stevens 200 was excellent even with the poor stock and trigger. I've had Marlin, Remington, Ruger and others that were just as bad and worse and conversely, much better.
 
George Dickel said:
He throws the barrel nut away on the Savage rifles he rebarrels, says it is the sorriest mounting system for accurate shooting. It is used only as a cost cutting measure for Savage
Click to expand...
What does he use if he throws the barrel nut, the sorriest mounting system, away when he rebarrels?
 
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