Saving or Protecting Guns From A House Fire?

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The suggestions, as great as they are, are not feasible for the current floor plan of my house. Hopefully, in the near future, I will build a safe-room/storm shelter as an extension to our main bedroom. Being outside, but attached at one wall to the house, should give it a low fire load.

In the interim, I think the best bet would be insurance until the structure is built.

Since I’m not worried about theft, does anyone know if you can insure guns only for fire, heat and water damage?
 
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Frankly, I don't think there is a practical way to come close to guaranteeing that your guns will be protected in a fire. There are too many variables. I am friends with our county fire marshal and asked him what he has seen regarding fire safes and he claims it ranges all over the place. You will see some fires that don't seem too serious that reduce the firesafe and its contents to puddles and then you will see serious fires where the safe holds up just fine. Often, even ammo and reloading components inside are undamaged. I know that the sentimental value cannot be replaced but insurance and a good fire safe are your best bet. Most home owner policies do not cover firearms so you will want to look into yours and purchase additional insurance if needed.
 
I can't speak for others but first I suggest people check with their homeowners insurance or apartment dwellers insurance as many only cover firearms loss up to $5,000. Just be sure you have the coverage you think you have.

My Gun Safe or Residential Security Container (for the hopeless pedantic) sits on a concrete slab in a single floor part of the house in a corner with two outside walls. While it has all sorts of fancy fire ratings if this place burns down there isn't much around it to burn. However, this summer major home renovations are on the drawing boards.

Recently at the job I retired from as new equipment was added we had to remove a few sections of fire sprinkler system. These were new install last year. I had the guys save me several and plan to incorporate them in my home renovations for the gun and reloading room area. These are along the lines of what I have with the Red (155 degree F.) glass bulb triggers. It should be no problem to install 4 of them. Just a matter of running some pipe and installing a back valve and flush valve.

However, I see this as where individual needs can vary so to each their own and what works for them.

Ron
 
I cant type fast enough to describe the home-built safe I installed
(This website times-me out before I can finish)
It involves 10-sheets of type "X" fire-rated sheet rock,
A 100' roll of 48" wide /2" thick fire-wrap insulation, (The kind they use to wrap the duct-work that sits on top of exhaust hoods in commercial kitchens)
1-sprinkler head
60' of 3/8" steel cable with concrete anchors
3- 4'x8' sheets of 3/16" thick plate steel with an alarm system tied to the door

My insurance agent says its the most elaborate safe he's ever seen built....
 
I've always wondered about this (not too much else to occupy my mind!). Most safes are kept in the basement, I know mine is. I also have a small opening in the bottom of the safe to allow the cord for the dehumidifier to enter. In case of a fire, the basement is going to fill with water. The water will weep into the safe, entering where the cord it. I could envision opening the safe and having a few feet of water pouring out - my wooden stocks are going to be borscht, especially the laminated ones. Rust - most likely sine they'll be in there for days of not weeks until the investigation is over and all the debris is removed from on top of them.

My conclusion is instead of being cooked, they'll be drowned instead - either way pretty much unusable. At least the 100's of rounds of ammo stored outside the safe will be prohibited from cooking off since they'll be under water!
 
I asked my insurance company about this and they said they could do 10,000 for firearms, but would require the serial numbers of them all. Never said anything about ammunition replacement.

As for safes, I know that Glenn Beck speaks highly of Liberty Safes. Of course, . . . they ARE one of his supporters, so. . . . . . .

I currently live in an apartment building, so I can't really have a good fireproof safe because I don't know if the floors would handle the weight of it AND a butt load of ammo, too. Fortunately, the entire complex has sprinkler systems in the kitchen, living room and bedrooms, so that is a plus.
 
This has always been one of my biggest fears, a house fire destroying my gun collection I've been working on since I was 14, it would devastate me. I don't mind saying you would likely see me in the front yard sobbing uncontrollably, provided my family and pets were OK obviously.
 
My house fire may not be typical, I live in town and the fire department was there in a hurry. The 90 year old house was a total loss but was not burned to the ground.

My guns were about all that was recovered, due to the efforts of neighbors and club members*. Most of my pistols were in an uninsulated obsolete Treadlock chest type lockup. They were fine. My Plastic M&P was out. It wasn't melted but it was sure rusty by the time it turned up. Melonited stainless steel is resistant to ordinary insults but there is a limit.

My rifles and shotguns were in a locked closet. Nearly all of them were finish damaged by smoke and water but were not hit by flame and I am gradually running them through the shop for refinishing.
Boxes of ammunition, baggies of bulk reloads, and even a can of powder were heat distorted and scorched, but nothing went off. The scorched bottle of Jameson's was fine, too.

Your fire might be worse or longer lasting.

*Neighbors and club members carried out what salvage was possible, concentrating on guns and gear.
Me? I was groaning and whimpering in the front yard all right but with more on my mind than guns; having bailed out the upstairs window and landed on concrete. Then in the hospital and inpatient rehab for a month.
 
This has always been one of my biggest fears, a house fire destroying my gun collection I've been working on since I was 14, it would devastate me. I don't mind saying you would likely see me in the front yard sobbing uncontrollably, provided my family and pets were OK obviously.
I figured it this way. The need to protect things extended well beyond my guns. There are property deeds, my wife's jewelery, passports and other important documents. While it would be a pain to replace much is replaceable but for some items, nope. All of this was a consideration when it came to a gun safe and where it was placed. As I mentioned earlier I figure you work based on your own personal needs. You tailor what you buy be it a RSC, safe or other home security/protection system to your needs leaving headroom for expansion.

Ron
 
I’ve been looking online at safes with fire ratings and getting insurance quotes. One of the things that keep coming up is the distinction between a “safe” and an “RSC”.

What higher standard does a safe have over an RSC?
 
You might think this is sort of a joke, but hook a big cable to the safe and run it outside. Have a chain available and a powerful truck to yank the entire safe through the exterior wall and hope that the "fall" doesn't do too much damage. Otherwise, your guns are toast unless the fire is put out in minutes.

A concrete room (with concrete ceiling) in the basement with a fire proof and insulated door would help, but how do you deal with all the hot debris that falls into the basement and covers the "closet" and continues to cook it for hours even after the fire is deemed "out".

If you can afford it, insurance is the way to go against fire versus theft.
 
When we were looking at homes, high on the list were homes new enough that had fire sprinkler systems in them. Doesn't help in the short term but if you move ..... I bought firearms insurance as there were no family heirlooms to worry about. It would just be a matter of replacement. By the way, a friend of mine did have his house burn down a decade ago and he did loose everything. His family was safe. Insurance saved the day. His biggest loss that he missed were the family photos. Based on this I've scanned all of mine and store digital copies elsewhere.
 
If your worried about fire, the best place for the safe is in the garage. The garage burns down in less than 20 minutes.
If its in a house with a basement it, no matter what floor its on, or if it in the basement its trouble. The house burns falls into the basement and the safe sits there in the embers and becomes a 4 hr or more pig roast. Everything in it burns. Would need a safe fire rated for 14 hrs to protect the contents.:evil:
 
If your worried about fire, the best place for the safe is in the garage. The garage burns down in less than 20 minutes.

That is a good point. Most people have no idea just how quickly a little fire becomes an uncontrollable inferno... minutes.
 
After all I have read, I recommend Sturdy Safe. I believe they have the best overall fire protection and security.

Regarding the safe sitting in embers in the basement, remember that all that water the fire department dumps on the house has to go somewhere. That "somewhere" is going to be the basement. It is likely to have a foot or two of standing water. It likely won't be that bad. A decent safe should structurally have no problems with the weight of any debris, as well. It's really just a matter of how long it's exposed to fire.
 
A safe heated up and then sitting in water for a while is probably going to be pretty bad as it floods with contaminated water.
There used to be a substantial gunsmithing shop here that did a lively business in house fire guns. I was struck by how many more were masses of rust with little or no burn damage than heavy flame effects. Lots of unsalvageable guns of both sorts were leaning in corners just in case they could donate a part to a repairable one.
 
I’ve been looking online at safes with fire ratings and getting insurance quotes. One of the things that keep coming up is the distinction between a “safe” and an “RSC”.

What higher standard does a safe have over an RSC?
First, the forum member I consider on of the experts on this material is 900F who is a sales distributor and has a real good knowledge base on this line of questions.

Next, you may want to give this a read.

Finally and interestingly enough is what was a "safe" in the 90s may be a RSC today. It becomes to some extent a matter of UL (Underwriters Laboratories) ratings and test methods. Test methods mean nothing unless they are well defined and uniform across the board. Similar to how the fuel efficiency and MPG ratings of new cars are derived.

The question is does the end user need a RSC or a safe?

Ron
 
So, as you all see it, . . . my apartment building, with sprinkler system, is a fairly safe place for my stuff to be? Seems that the best way to keep from a huge fire is to surpress it early on.

For those of you with houses, I wonder how hard it would be to have them put in each room?
 
So, as you all see it, . . . my apartment building, with sprinkler system, is a fairly safe place for my stuff to be? Seems that the best way to keep from a huge fire is to surpress it early on.

For those of you with houses, I wonder how hard it would be to have them put in each room?
Yes, that's the way I see it.

For my house I see adding some sprinklers as a good investment, considering I have several sprinkler heads already. Just need to add some plumbing.

Ron
 
If I get into buying a house [in the future], I think I will have sprinklers run in each room as well. Have a strong safe to help protect against theft, but sprinklers for suppression.
 
Did anybody watch the video that was posted by S heaven? In there, they took a concrete lined safe commercially available and burned it at 2000° for a long time. The guns were fine. That is way hotter than most fires according to the video, and the guns were fine. Even the money was fine. So, if you don't have a concrete lined safe, go to work with fire rated sheet rock, multiple layers, and make sure you put some water inside the safe to provide steam to absorb heat.

It is clearly possible to protect your firearms.
 
I think the most important thing most people can do to protect against fire damage is be realistic about fire risks for your area.

I've lived in places where it wasn't especially unusual for fire to rain down from the sky. I remember driving around on one of those days and seeing over a dozen "unconnected" fires...a tree here, bushes there, and so on. This was in a suburban residential neighborhood. Of course the source of this was a major fire about 10 miles upwind that was throwing embers and ash that was raining down setting secondary fires. And you know what? In that area you still see piles of dead pine needles, dead brush, and so on, right up against houses. Those people have every reason to know that kindling around the base of their house is an immediate risk but they do nothing.

People are like that inside houses too. I've seen extension cords that were hot to the touch, cans of white gas (camping supplies) stored in living room closets, people who use their kitchens without any thought or plan for fire, bedrooms built above garages, and more. It's actually amazing that so few houses burn.

My general thought (I can't call it advice, but it's what I try to follow) is to identify the big risks and address them. Minimize electrical loads, have a plan for cooking fires, identify external risks and deal with them (e.g. maintain a sterile/noncombustible yard in fire zones). Do that and your risk of losing a whole bunch more than the guns goes down.

In the long run I think a fire resistant shed well clear of any fuel is the only real answer though.
 
Just keep in mind that you will be lucky to have single-digit minutes to get out.

Get out. Worry about nothing material.
 
Yup.
BTDT.
I won't bore you with the details but when it happened to me, my guns and other belongings were far from my mind. How to get OUT was the sole subject.
 
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