School me on Moon Clips

Rockrivr1

Rockrivr1

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Joined
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Massachusetts
I've moved forward with a 1951 S&W Pre 26 in 45acp and will be taking delivery shortly. Now that I have the gun I'm looking on the kind of moon clips I should be getting. The last time I tried to use a moon clip I bent the crap out of it. So what's the deal? Should I get half moon or full moon clips? Is it possible to load/unload moon clips by hand or should I invest in a tool to help make it easier? There not cheap so want to make sure I'm doing this right.

Thanks
 
I've never used half moons, so won't comment. A full moon would require a little less manual dexterity to stuff a cylinder, of course. You don't explain how you bent yours, but as they are usually pretty springy it would have taken some force, I expect. Loading by fingers alone should be easy, but do get a tool such as this one to unload. It's cheap and just about unbreakable.
 
I have run into clips that are really tight, and it's not hard to accidentally bend them. Generally, though, I've found that with the right technique (holding the edge of the clip vertical on a hard surface while rotating a cartridge into it, keeping everything perpendicular) I never damage anything anymore. I do prefer a looser clip, though, and have never found an undamaged clip which was too loose.

I don't use any of the loading tools, but I do use one for unloading. Mine is homemade, from a piece of tubing which closely fits the case diameter. A small cut on one end allows each case to be twisted out of the clip, and then the cases slide into the tube. Once the clip is empty, the cases are spilled out into the tumbler. (I don't have a picture of it, but it's basically this: https://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Arm...keywords=moon+clip+tool&qid=1699551145&sr=8-4)
 
 
Last edited:
.45 clips are thicker and stiffer than the ones made for revolver rounds. I have not bent one. Ranch Products are ok and I also have some Wilsons that I caught on sale.
I have the tube type "demooner" and when my hands got arthritis I added a clipping tool like so:
1699552553505.png
www.revolversupply.com

Supplies for the Revolver Enthusiast

A patented tool for loading moon clips. Moon Clip loading tool
www.revolversupply.com www.revolversupply.com

If you are going to shoot it a lot, the BMT would be worth a look but I decided the single loader above was good enough for me.
 
I'v got the one 38 special showed from Amazon for my Smith 1917. Works great. I think mine came with a couple of moonclips. Over the years iv acclimated probably 50 or more clips from gumshows mostly. Don't think I ever got a bad one. They just work. Best deal I found was 20 for 10 bucks at a show a couple of weeks ago.
 
BMT Mooner/De-Mooner. It's better and faster than any of the tools mentioned so far.

TK Custom full moon clips that are the correct size for the brass headstamp. Get the stainless steel ones and you can just toss them in the wet tumbler with the brass. I demoon and deprime the cases first. For 38/357, different makes of brass have different rims, rebating, grooves for the same cartridge because not all those dimensions have a specification in the SAAMI or CIP standard. https://tkcustom.com/pages/faq-s I use Starline brass, so I get the clips for Starline brass but I can choose another if I want my clips tighter or looser. For 45 ACP, the brass isn't grooved and the recess on the rim is specified so there is just one size clip.

TK sells half-clips for 1917's. I can see the appeal to some of being period-correct and functioning with original pouches. Why they originally issued half moon clips instead of full isn't as obvious. It could be because full moon clips were more prone to bending, or it could be that the pouches were a greater protuberance and thought to encumber the soldier. Scott Reitz, former LAPD, has said that speedloaders were once prohibited in the LAPD for the express reason that they made an unsightly bulge on the officers' uniforms when they stood for inspection. Instead, he was issued metal speed strips because they were flat. Later, speedloaders were allowed. Some people prefer strips today for a similar reason -- they feel speedloaders or full moon clips are harder to conceal or make an unsightly bulge. I carry moonclips in my pocket on studs to prevent them being bent. I've never bent clips in carry in 5 years since I started the practice. I've only ever bent them dropping them in a reload and then stepping on them. I want a TK moon clip saver, but I'd need a lot of bent ones to justify the price. I fix them with a hammer and anvil but they're not perfect.

If you shoot much at all, it's worth it to buy 50 or 100 clips or so. TK does discount them several times a year.
 
I had a couple of 625s and discovered that the geometry of the .45ACP full moon clips allowed me to easily load the moon clips by hand. Just put my index finger through the hole and push the rounds in. I used a knife blade as a prying tool, I know shoot me, to de-moon. Simply leveraged the blade flat against one round to pop out the next one. The last one I just snapped out with my finger. I sold the BMT device because it really slowed me down. Then again I have tough fingers.

This does not apply to .38spl or 9mm clips. They're squeezed in closer and tighter. Some tool is reguired for them.

TK Custom for me. I use the blued ones. Cheaper and I've been lucky in competition not to have any stepped on.
 
Half moon clips carry flatter than full moons do and during WW1 I'm sure soldiers could fit more rounds in their pockets and pouches using them than full moon clips. The only thing lost using them is reload speed

There are also third moon clips which hold two rounds, Ranch use to make a version that was straight, no curve allowing for the flattest possible carry, but it seems they stopped making them.
 
I have three 9mm revolvers, two 45acp, and a 40 S&W.

All but one are made for moon clips.

I don't usually use the moon clips, though. I use them on the Ruger Sp101 in 9mm because the chambers are a little tight and the brass sticks a little. Also, the Ruger clips are easy to use with your fingers.

The other semiauto caliber DA revolvers I have are all easy to use without moon clips. You don't need them for the gun to go bang, and if the brass drops out easily they really serve no purpose for a range trip, IMHO.

TK Custom are the ones that I have the most of. They work fine. If I'm going to load or unload more than one or two, the tool was a wise investment of $10 or whatever.

45acp is a very nice revolver cartridge. I enjoy it very much! :)

Smith And Wesson Model 625

Smith And Wesson Model 625

 
S&W introduced the full moon clip in 1917 along with the half moon clip. The full moon clip was a complicated affair with springs and it was decided by the Army to utilize the 1/2 moon instead. Much simpler, it stored easier, it packed easier, it shipped easier.

Here is the patent for the full moon clip.

IMG_1201.png


Two ways of packing the loaded half moon clips,

IMG_2228.jpeg

IMG_2227.jpeg

And the machine used to load the half moon clips,

IMG_1432.jpeg

I have never seen one of the original full moon clips, nor a photograph.

Fast forward about 1/2 century. S&W devises the second iteration of the full moon clip, the star shape we are most familiar with. The factory has no intention of producing these. Instead, Ranch Products in Malinta Ohio is approached and asked to make the little clips. They agree. S&W supplies all the specs and drawings for the manufacture of the clips. Ranch Products is still making them, and to the original specifications.

Other companies make a similar shape but try to “improve” it. Some companies simply buy from Ranch Products, rebrand the clip and charge more for it. I use Ranch Products exclusively, probably have 4-500 and try to keep them all loaded.

.38 Special said:
I have run into clips that are really tight, and it's not hard to accidentally bend them.
Click to expand...

If the clips is made to S&W specifications, it should not be tight.

westernrover said:
Why they originally issued half moon clips instead of full isn't as obvious.
Click to expand...

See the above explanation.



Tools to load and unload the clips are easily bought or made. I modified a set of water pump pliers to squeeze two rounds at a time into the clips. The tube mentioned above to unload them works well. I have made dozens.

Full moon clips are the fastest reload available. They also keep your brass together. Can they get bent? Sure, I think I have had a dozen or so bent because a Range Officer at a match stepped on them. I know an arm on one snapped off and the clip was replaced by Ranch Products.

If you have any questions, ask them! Someone on this forum will have an answer.

Kevin
 
StrawHat said:
S&W introduced the full moon clip in 1917 along with the half moon clip. The full moon clip was a complicated affair with springs and it was decided by the Army to utilize the 1/2 moon instead. Much simpler, it stored easier, it packed easier, it shipped easier.

Here is the patent for the full moon clip.

View attachment 1179134


Two ways of packing the loaded half moon clips,

View attachment 1179131

View attachment 1179132

And the machine used to load the half moon clips,

View attachment 1179133

I have never seen one of the original full moon clips, nor a photograph.

Fast forward about 1/2 century. S&W devises the second iteration of the full moon clip, the star shape we are most familiar with. The factory has no intention of producing these. Instead, Ranch Products in Malinta Ohio is approached and asked to make the little clips. They agree. S&W supplies all the specs and drawings for the manufacture of the clips. Ranch Products is still making them, and to the original specifications.

Other companies make a similar shape but try to “improve” it. Some companies simply buy from Ranch Products, rebrand the clip and charge more for it. I use Ranch Products exclusively, probably have 4-500 and try to keep them all loaded.



If the clips is made to S&W specifications, it should not be tight.



See the above explanation.



Tools to load and unload the clips are easily bought or made. I modified a set of water pump pliers to squeeze two rounds at a time into the clips. The tube mentioned above to unload them works well. I have made dozens.

Full moon clips are the fastest reload available. They also keep your brass together. Can they get bent? Sure, I think I have had a dozen or so bent because a Range Officer at a match stepped on them. I know an arm on one snapped off and the clip was replaced by Ranch Products.

If you have any questions, ask them! Someone on this forum will have an answer.

Kevin
Click to expand...
I bought a couple packs directly from S&W recently and they were stamped "TK."

They were tight loading and VERY tight unloading- I managed to bend one.

Since I had no intention of carrying or speed loading my 1917, I just skipped the clips altogether eventually. Ran great without them, empties fell right out or at worst flicked out with a fingernail.

Some of the Colt 1917s were through-bored so you must use clips, but the S&Ws are stepped and can manage without.
 
Last edited:
Jim Watson said:
I have seen reports of Smiths with deep chambers requiring clips to hold headspace for ignition.
Click to expand...
I don't doubt it- there was a war on and perhaps the inspectors didn't check the cylinder boring that closely. But I believe that was a War Dept. requirement so that the gun could still be fired in an emergency with 1911 ammunition. Colt instituted step boring pretty quickly during their production at the prodding of the Army, though I suspect they were using up through-bored M1909 cylinders early on.
 
Jim Watson said:
.45 clips are thicker and stiffer than the ones made for revolver rounds. I have not bent one. Ranch Products are ok and I also have some Wilsons that I caught on sale.
I have the tube type "demooner" and when my hands got arthritis I added a clipping tool like so:
View attachment 1179090
www.revolversupply.com

Supplies for the Revolver Enthusiast

A patented tool for loading moon clips. Moon Clip loading tool
www.revolversupply.com www.revolversupply.com

If you are going to shoot it a lot, the BMT would be worth a look but I decided the single loader above was good enough for me.
Click to expand...
This. This gizmo is a really useful mooner. It requires different center arbors for different calibers/models of moons. Forty-fives generally snap in easily enough; some other calibers can require real leverage.
Forty five moons were always available at gunshows for maybe two for a buck. It was amazing how expensive other moons are.
A demooner it money well spent. A late buddy, who could dead lift 500lbs, always wanted to demoon with his fingers. He bent/sprung a bunch of moons. Either make one, or even get the stamped steel ones. The tube tools are caliber specific; the 9 won't work on .45s, and vice versa.
The double loop thing at the end of the above tool will work as well.
StrawHat said:
S&W introduced the full moon clip in 1917 along with the half moon clip. The full moon clip was a complicated affair with springs and it was decided by the Army to utilize the 1/2 moon instead. Much simpler, it stored easier, it packed easier, it shipped easier.
Click to expand...
StrawHat, news to me, wow. Never thought the full moons dated that far back, nor that they were that complicated initially.

As regards using pistol calibers without moons, the answer is 'maybe'. I've a 325, and the Ti cylinder doesn't headspace the cartridges very well. The Ti cylinder in my 986 experiences the same problem, so it may be an alloy cylinder thing.
Pistol calibers in revos are entertaining, thanks for all the info.
One last thing; IMHO, revolver caliber moons don't work nearly as well as the ones for shorter, pistol caliber rounds.
Moon
 
243winxb said:
Hate moon clips. Buy 45 Auto Rim brass.

https://www.starlinebrass.com/45-auto-rim-brass
Click to expand...
Yeah, I've done this, too. Have had some ACPs sneak into the AutoRim brass, then run through the press. That brass then ends up stuck in the sizing die; have to unscrew the decapping pin, to drive it back out.
I've ended up just using the AR brass for the lighter loaded 325 ammo.
Moon
 
All of the blued S&W 45 ACP revolvers were bored correctly so the 45 ACP cartridge could be used without clips of any sort. The clips were simply for extraction, something against which the extractor could push. It was not until the stainless series that SOME of the chambers wee sloppily cut or cut deep by design.


Colt chose to cut their cylinders improperly. The Army caused them to replace cylinders. Most were swapped out but there are a few still out there.

Kevin
 
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