Semi-auto 7.62 recommendations?

[H2O MAN]

dmancornell ... looks pretty good. And the MK14 is badass.

Thanks! I'm happy with how it turned out.

dom1104 my plan is, to follow H20 man around post SHTF and pick up his M14 from the curb when he decides to dump it for a rifle that doesnt weigh 17 lbs


This is my plan and I am sticking to it.

The MK14 pictured weighs 10 lbs. unloaded without the sound suppressor and optics...









.

 

[rbernie]

I have owned a bunch, from FALs to CETMEs to Saigas and M1As and AR10s. If I wanted such a thing again, I would unreservedly get a Saiga and convert it back to AK form. The mags will be more expensive than any other option (altho not much more than AR10 mags), but I find the Saiga to be easier to run and far easier to actually carry around in the field for a length of time (as opposed to simply lug from the car to the shooting line) than any of the other options. I can equip a Saiga with an excellent quality side-folding stock and a quality optics mount for far less money than it would take to do the same for any other 7.62x51/308 semiauto.

The CETME/PTRs have the advantage of cheap magazines, at the expense of the worst ergonomics of the options. The FALs and M1As are the traditional responses, with reasonably priced mags and acceptable ergos (excepting the M1A safety), at the expense of bulk and expense.

My Saigas have been as accurate as any other option, and quite robust.

 

[Robert]

As much as I respect rbernie's opinion I'd go with a FAL. I love mine and do not find it to be all that heavy, but then again I am 5'9" and 230ish. The FAL will never deliver sub MOA but I find mine to be more than field accurate and that is a win for me.

 

[rockit]

RRA LAR-8, 20" bbl, 9#, MOA accuracy.

 

[eye5600]

and when empty makes a superior club.

Of the rifles under consideration, the M-14 is one of the few on which a bayonet is actually usable.

 

[RedLion]

^^^^that must be a real SHTF scenario that you're planning on using a bayonet!

 

[CnRnut]

can't believe it hasn't been said. mini 30, done.

:banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

[Average Joe]

If you mean 7.62 x39 then SKS, If you mean 7.62x51 then go with an M1A.

 

[nrthwoods]

I think most all of these weapons can accept a bayonet...

 

[Gunther]

HK-91 and a DPMS AP-4 308, at least thats where I landed

 

[GunTech]

The FALs and M1As are the traditional responses, with reasonably priced mags and acceptable ergos (excepting the M1A safety), at the expense of bulk and expense.

What's wrong with the M1A safety? It's completely ambidextrous and about as logical as can be - if the trigger is partially blocked, the weapon is safe. It can easily be set to fire when reaching for the trigger. AFAIC, it about the best designed safety ever from a practical stance.

 

[GunTech]

More M1As:

 

[rbernie]

What's wrong with the M1A safety? It's completely ambidextrous and about as logical as can be - if the trigger is partially blocked, the weapon is safe. It can easily be set to fire when reaching for the trigger.

Reaching into the trigger guard to deactivate the safety, especially while on the move on foot and when likely focusing on things downrange (like threats), does not strike me as the best design and frankly is an ND waiting to happen. It may not be an issue when shooting from a firing line/bench, but in the field? No thanks.

A far better design is one that is utilized while the strong hand is in a firing position but which does not require reaching into the trigger guard to manipulate - an example would be an AR-pattern safety.

 

[wally]

Reaching into the trigger guard to deactivate the safety, especially while on the move on foot and when likely focusing on things downrange (like threats), does not strike me as the best design and frankly is an ND waiting to happen.

How do you figure? The gun is on safe, you have to put your finger on the trigger when its time to shoot anyways, so you flick the safety off by pushing the trigger finger foreword away from the trigger. Then the gun is ready to shoot with your finger in the trigger guard but *off* the trigger. This is the superior solution in all regards, and its ambidextrous for free.

I have to shift my grip to reach the AR safety and the FAL or HK91 is a much larger shift, the Saiga has the worst safety ever.

--wally.

 

[H2O MAN]

The design of the M14 safety is fine, but some people need proper training and practice.

 

[One-Time]

Id say a M14 type as well!

 

[HorseSoldier]

How do you figure? The gun is on safe, you have to put your finger on the trigger when its time to shoot anyways, so you flick the safety off by pushing the trigger finger foreword away from the trigger. Then the gun is ready to shoot with your finger in the trigger guard but *off* the trigger. This is the superior solution in all regards, and its ambidextrous for free.

Do a couple hundred times at a dead run in full kit, and see if you don't have a couple oopsie moments . . .

Fingers inside the trigger guard for anything except pulling the trigger are an accident waiting to happen under real world and dynamic conditions.

 

[wally]

Do a couple hundred times at a dead run in full kit, and see if you don't have a couple oopsie moments . . .

Fingers inside the trigger guard for anything except pulling the trigger are an accident waiting to happen under real world and dynamic conditions.

I don't get it, aren't you taught not to put the finger in the trigger guard *unless* you are planing to shoot? In which case the safety is right there to be removed only at the last possible moment.

If you are that oopsie tired, how do you expect to align the sights? With the M14 the safety can remain on as long as possible.

--wally.

 

[rbernie]

I don't get it, aren't you taught not to put the finger in the trigger guard *unless* you are planing to shoot? In which case the safety is right there to be removed only at the last possible moment.

How you're taught and how you'll react under stress are differing things. It's far too tempting to try to remove the safety while under movement (to cover or concealment, for example) when you're stressed. Doing so with an AR-pattern weapon (or a G3/CETME or a FAL or a Saiga) will not place your finger immediately in front of the trigger inside the trigger guard. Doing so with an M14/M1A will.

You get to make the choice on how you feel about this. I certainly have.

 

[GunTech]

Keep in mind the M14 safety has exactly the same type of safety utilized by the M1 Garand. It's combat proven, and there must not have been any issues since they retained the same system in the M14. We don't have to make conjectures - we have real life experience.

Personally I like systems that work properly like this. I am reminded of the Safety on the Mauser 98, which when applied, blocks the shooter's sight picture. This is a great example of a system where the user is directly effected by the system. In the case of the M14 (and Garand) if you move you finger to the trigger and it's blocked, you know the rifle is safed, and you have to unsafe the weapon to pull the trigger.

 

[H2O MAN]

Those poor bastards armed the M1 Garand during WWII must have experienced multiple "oopsie moments" when they were stressed.


General Patton let the world know how he felt about the weapon when he bestowed accolades on the Garand.

The M14 has a safety that is basically identical to the one used on the M1 Garand and it works without "oopsie moments".

 

[rbernie]

We don't have to make conjectures - we have real life experience.

Correct. And I have talked to many WWII vets who have first hand experience at how dangerous these safeties really are. Many that I have talked to told me that they often didn't bother to engage the safety at all, since taking the weapon off safe required an unnatural motion.

It's combat proven, and there must not have been any issues since they retained the same system in the M14.

The safety design of the AR (much less that of the FAL or the G3) has far greater bona fides if judged by either length of service or numbers in service. Moreover, there has not been a rifle adopted as a standard arm by any military within the last, say, fifty years that includes a safety integral to the triggerguard.

There might be some reason for that.

Personally I like systems that work properly like this.

And that's terrific. If you like it - you should use it. I do not like that form of safety, and therefore I favor other platforms.

The M14 has a safety that is basically identical to the one used on the M1 Garand and it works without "oopsie moments".

That's a fallacy that you accept. That does not make it so.

 

[robmkivseries70]

Egad, buy a winter safety and actuate it from outside the trigger guard.
Best,
Rob

 

[JpSnareGuy]

DPMS LR-308. Well at least I like mine. This rifle is not barrel heavy in the least when ""set up". But I do have a Nightforce mounted on it as well so I guess that balances it out. NF scopes are not light either. If you handle one with nothing on it then I could see it being a little unbalanced. This rifle is ACCURATE too. With the JP trigger upgrade, it is a beast. I do have to admit it is def. not a light rifle though. It depends what you want to use it for as well.

 

[H2O MAN]

I'm glad the M14 safety works so well because I really don't care for the AR, FAL or the G3.