Sharpening

[Evil-Twin]

I recently bought a Spyderco Sharp master ( Sharpmaker edit ) system. I've been sharpening knives for 50 years. With this system, it is a no brainer, even for a novice sharpener.. anyone can make an edge using this system, sharp enough to shave. It comes with a CD,, and you can sharpen any edge with it.

 

[jmr40]

Do you mean Sharpmaker instead of Sharpmaster. I googled it and found the former.

I've been looking for something and am interested in learning more. Seems like you are very pleased with this one.

 

[GarySTL]

They work well as long as the angle you want is 20°. I have a Wicked Edge unit for many blades, but depend on my sharpmaker for most of my kitchen knives. Their extra fine rods are a worthwhile addition.

 

[JohnKSa]

It's a good system and easy to use. I've had one for many years.

It's also very good for working with serrated edges as long as they're the "scalloped" type and not the kind that looks like tiny saw teeth. The "tiny saw tooth" type serration can only really be sharpened if you want to spend a lot of time sharpening each individual tooth with a needle file, or if you grind off the serrations and put a plain edge on the knife.

 

[hso]

We have a sticky on sharpening and the Spyderco is a favorite.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=8341

 

[Jackal]

I rather like the speed and ease of my Ken Onion Worksharp. Shaving sharp edges on all my fixed, folder, kitchen knives and my hatches/axes are also hair splitting sharp now. I love how it puts a factory looking edge on everything, after a little practice. I can even do light reprofiling with it.

 

[Evil-Twin]

Sorry sharpmaker is correct... like I said its very cost effective and anyone can learn to sharpen anything in a very short time.. the CD shows you which angle to use.

here is about the best link I can give you to decide if this is for you...

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=sharpmaker+youtube&qpvt=sharpmaker+youtube&FORM=VDRE

I've sharpened every knife in my house with this system

 

[hso]

ET,

There are some folks that can't even seem to get the hang of using the Sharpmaker, but all of the vertical sharpening systems like the "crock sticks" work about the same because they all hold the abrasive surface at the angle and the user need only try to keep the blade vertical as the run down the abrasive.

 

[Zeke/PA]

I've been using the Sharpmaker for several years with great results.
I use the tool for my everyday carries ,for our kitchen knives and keeping the knives of my outdoorsmen friends sharp.
The system does a super job on filet knives.

 

[Evil-Twin]

ET,

There are some folks that can't even seem to get the hang of using the Sharpmaker, but all of the vertical sharpening systems like the "crock sticks" work about the same because they all hold the abrasive surface at the angle and the user need only try to keep the blade vertical as the run down the abrasive.

AS a retired engineer, I know first hand that some people ( like my own brother ) do not have the skills to change a light bulb.
Sharpening has a lot to do with repeatability of the stroke angle...( trying to use a wet stone by hand ) So if you can hold a knife blade vertically, sharp maker will hold the correct angle , every time.
It's like edge sharpening for dummies...

 

[hso]

So if you can hold a knife blade vertically

Not everyone seems to be able to even do that, but most everyone else can, therefore the value of the various "V" stick systems out there.

 

[Smokey Joe]

Sharpening machine...

I get dandy results with a 1 x 30 belt sander I got for 40 bucks at Harbor Freight. I use fine-grain sharpening belts, mostly from Jantz Knifemaking Supplies, www.knifemaking.com

But, I DO know how to maintain an edge angle--I used various hones for years with xlnt results, until my thumbs could no longer hold up to the necessary pressure for more than a couple of knives. (Yes, I too have been sharpening knives for myself and others, for half-a-century.)

Was tickled to death to discover that I could still sharpen, using the belt sander.

Personally I have small use for the sharpening systems that pick the angle for you--some kinds of knives want a tighter angle than others (e.g. a fish filet knife vs. a firewood prep knife).

I DO NOT do serrated knives; don't like 'em, never have.

 

[bikerdoc]

I do both free hand and also use a Lansky system.
Never tried a crock stick system.

Small, round and triangle files work well on serrated edges but like Joe I hate them. If you bring me a serrated knife expect to pay 2x's normal

 

[C.R.]

I have a Lansky and it works well for me. It has taken me a long time to get to where I can sharpen a blade "freehand"using a whetstone takes time to learn,but when you get the hang of it it is satisyfing. You need good lighting and take your time. some jobs you just cant rush through. A leather strop loaded with jewlers rouge puts that final touch on a blade I just use a old leather belt that has somehow shrunken and no longet fits me

 

[Zeke/PA]

Just recently, my Grandson, a Johnson Wahles graduate, asked me about sharpening his set of kitchen knives.
Somewhere, he learned that Japanese water stones were the way to go.
O.K. but, they are expensive and , so I'm told are not long lasting.
I really thought that I could do what he needed with bench stones, mainly, a medium India followed by a hard Arkansas!
I tried my idea on several of our kitchen knives with great success.
I think that a ceramic "steel" might be part of what he needs!
His favorite knife by the way, is a Santaku pattern from Chicago Cutlery!
The high dollar "German" stuff is non- sensical!

 

[JohnKSa]

Small, round and triangle files work well on serrated edges but like Joe I hate them. If you bring me a serrated knife expect to pay 2x's normal

The Sharpmaker system has triangle shaped stones that make sharpening serrated knives no more difficult than a typical plain-edge blade. That's assuming we're talking about the scalloped type serration, not the tiny sawtooth type serration.

If you have to deal with serrated knives, I don't know of an easier, faster system.

 

[Evil-Twin]

I know for a fact that if you use a belt sander, and you see sparks, then you are destroying the temper of the steel. In order to keep that hardness, the blade should never get hot.
If you don't care about the temper then a Belt sander will work... I know I paid a lot of my for my EDC Ken Onion designed Zero tolerance spring assisted folder with S30V stainless-steel with Tungsten DLC coating with Tiger Stripes. loosing that S30V rating destroys the ability to keep an edge.

 

[Longhorn 76]

Seeing sparks does not mean you have ruined the temper of the steel. If that was true, I would have ruined the steel the first time I struck it with a flint to make a fire.

 

[Evil-Twin]

I don't know if this is discussion or considered arguing..
I'm hoping my input will be considered discussion..

striking a piece of flint is not running a belt sander at 600 rpm... ( BIG Difference ) seeing " A " spark, ( flint strike ) is not the same as thousands of sparks... as the grit media grinds off the blade edge.. if you have ever ground any piece of steel you know it gets hot quickly ... like I said, Ive been sharpening knives for 50 years... when heat causes internal stress ( molecules moving very fast ) the temper of set molecules that have been tempered is removed..
Bill aka ET

 

[Smokey Joe]

Sparks...

E-T--IMX, sparks do not necessarily mean any steel is being ruined, sharpening a knife on a belt sander. It mostly depends on the alloy of steel used in the individual knife.

Most tempered-steel knives don't spark much, if at all, when being sharpened on my 1x30. But, I recently came upon a knife blank (unfortunately, with no provenance, so I have no idea of the alloy or tempering, except that it does seem to be tempered) which sparks like crazy when applied to the belt sander. I mean a fountain of sparks--startled me at first.

I guess I'll just make up a handle for that blank and see how it performs in use. Anyhow, sparking varies considerably when the whirling grit is applied to the steel.

As to heat--You mustn't allow a knife being sharpened by any mechanical means, to heat up. I do mine bare-handed, with the idea that if my pink patty-paws can stand the heat the steel certainly can, and when the knife becomes warm I dip it in water to cool, and wipe it off before proceeding. The point of the knife, where the heat can get concentrated, requires the most care to keep it cool. Using this technique, my knives' temper doesn't seem to be affected.

As I say, this is my experience. Your results may vary.

 

[danez71]

A few sparks isn't a big deal but a constant shower of sparks probably is.

Sparks have a lot to do with the type of metal and the oxidation that it has.

Therefore, you shouldn't use sparks as the sole indicator as some metals will spark like crazy and other types will hardly spark. For example, stainless steel will spark less than most (all?) regular carbon steels.


One of our knife makers here should be able to provide better info than I can. I think there is even a metallurgist or 2 at THR.

 

[Evil-Twin]

Again this is just discussion... how temper works and how hard the Rockwell is. It is based on the temper procedure.,,. heat and quench causes the molecules to vibrate it get closer together, lighting them up so to speak, the tighter you get the molecules, the harder the steel. these tight molecules are set to stay tight by the quenching process. Going from hot to cold instantly.
when you apply " Heat " the heat is cause by the molecules moving very fast, and its the friction of movement that causes the blade to feel warm.. without locking the movement in place properly they release and move farther apart making the knife blade softer. Heating up a blade makes it soft... a hard blade will take an edge and keep it much longer than a soft blade, the problem with a hard blade , is it is so tight , internally that it can crack or break much easier than a soft blade.

 

[Zeke/PA]

Hey Twin,
You really should brush up on your heat treating spectrum!

 

[hso]

I know for a fact that if you use a belt sander, and you see sparks, then you are destroying the temper of the steel.

That's incorrect. It isn't that sparks form, but that the amateur overheats the blade. Once heat treated, knife makers refine edges and sharpen on belt systems with a shower of sparks at times. What ruins the temper is letting the edge heat up too much. Leaning into that belt or wheel heats the metal up through friction and if unchecked will change the hardness of the edge. The knowledgeable person stops and starts before that occurs or dips the blade in water as they're on the abrasive belt to keep the heat down.

Those are the facts.

 

[Zeke/PA]

Agreed ! If you choose to use a belt sander though you best be confident of your ability to maintain bevels.
Personally, I think that a belt sander is a very poor choice in sharpening a valued knife blade.
I have a belt sander that takes 6" X 48" belt, a 36 grit of which does a great job on mower blades etc.