shipping 30round ar15 magazine to california

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a LEO contacted me through ARFCOM today and wanted me to ship him the two hk high reliability magazines for sale.

I know it has LEO markings on the mags, but does it make the officers in CA exempt?

How do I legally ship it to him? Should I ship it to the police department? how can I verify that he is a police officer of SFPD (San Francisco Police Department) ?

Thanks all
 
Check the laws. I wouldn't, but then I'm paranoid.

Sounds fishy to me.......Normally "LEO only" type items have to be purchased by their department, not by individual officers. (Purchase Orders, Department Letterhead-type documents etc., etc., etc. Check cut by State/county/municipal treasurer-type.)

I'm sure someone from CA will be along shortly to help.
 
from his reply, this is what he said.

"The mags cost 39 plus tax here in CA then i have to wait forever for the gun store to order them"

word for word
 
You can ship them, just take them apart and send them in pieces. Californians can buy replacement parts for hi-cap mags, while we can't buy the whole mag we can buy all the pieces to replace one that we already have.
 
Ditto 50 shooter's post. Just is much safer on your end. Say he is a liar and not LEO and assembles them, then he has committed the felony and you still have done nothing wrong.

Some departments have to get a letterhead for a shop to order, while a private individual can be "satisfied" with LEO credentials "lower" than needed for an FFL to sell.

I'd go the safe route and disassemble them prior to shipping, and I would not hesitate to sell like that to anyone in Kaleeforneeah.

Justin
 
I wouldn't ship them to him either. Why open yourself up to possible problems.

If he is a LEO he has other sources. Too bad if he has to pay more, at least he's not a serf.
 
Is there any Federal law prohibiting you from shipping them? No? Then why care.? You are a free citizen in a free state. I would think that is California wanted to force their laws on you, you would be a very rich man later.

Unless there is a Federal, or local to YOU law that gets violated, who cares what California likes?
 
I would not sell anything to a LEO that I could not sell to a non-LEO.


this.

Something is wrong about this deal... FFls that do large volumes of sales to LEOs have them in stock. All it takes for him to buy them in a letter from his deptment and he could buy almost anything.

I would bet that the CA DOJ could make your life hell if you were cuagh shiping them in state. They do go after retailers shiping items in, It would not be a strech for them to go after a single person.

edit
I was wondering...

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&group=12001-13000&file=12020-12040

is the the section that covers this type of stuff. Sure sounds like it would get you in hot water.
 
I could be wrong about this .. but I don't think there is anything illegal in mailing high capacity mags to anywhere regardless if they are prohibited. It's the possession and use that are against the law... or so I've been led to believe. I'm not sure if CA is any different, but I've always been told that big companies that don't send hi-cap mags here to NY don't do that because they would be breaking a law, but rather that they won't be party to allowing the purchaser to break a law.
Like I said, I could be wrong.

Also though, I'm not sure if it's the same in CA as it is here in NY where the sale of pre-ban mags of any capacity is perfectly legal , and they are available to the public in stores.
 
if you arent a resident of CA, and there is no law in your state prohibiting you to ship them, and no federal law... i dont see a problem... i dont believe that they would have any legal standing to enforce state law on you...
 
It's the possession and use that are against the law... or so I've been led to believe. I'm not sure if CA is any different

Not here.

The law bans importing one or building one. There's no law against having one or using it (with the rather esoteric caveat that building a new fixed-magazine AR with a larger than 10 round magazine in it is also illegal).
 
Before the ban went into effect I bought magazines for guns I didn't even own, 20 & 30 rnd AR-15, Glock 17/19/21/22, Beretta 92. I already owned a G-21, G-22 and a 9mm upper for the G-22 (making it a G-17). I've since bought a G-19 so it all worked out. My out-of-state brother got the Beretta mags when I decided to standardize on Glock. I still have the AR magazines, but no AR.
 
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First of all, I wouldn't sell #### to a Cali LEO on principle of the law against high cap mags for civilians is infringement of rights.

Second, this may just be some Bloomberg-esque sting by either .gov types or some media people to try to see how easy it is to order illegal stuff from out of state.

It's only one small order, I doubt you'll miss it. I would say no.
 
I recall discussing out of state sales with the owner of a Las Vegas gunshop who would not sell high cap mags to anyone from CA. Apparently (or so the story goes) another gunshop did sell to somebody in CA and the CA AG filed a civil lawsuit which resulted in shutting them down. (No I don't have a link, just word of mouth from the LV owner, IIRC)
 
Uhhh, posting this because it feels more like Cali-bashing here then anything. Again, take them apart and take a picture of them apart in the box before you close it up if that makes you feel better. That way if there ever is a question about it you can show them the pic.

Other then that, read on and be informed...

Magazines

Effective January 1, 2000, SB 23 generally prohibits, the manufacture, import, sale, giving or lending of large capacity magazines (defined as any ammunition feeding device with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds, but does not include .22 caliber tube ammunition feeding devices).

SB23 does NOT prohibit the owership of magazines owned prior to January 1, 2000 nor does it prevent the repair of damaged ones.

If I have a large-capacity magazine, do I need to get rid of it?

No. Continued possession of large-capacity magazines (able to accept more than 10 rounds) that you owned in California before January 1, 2000, is not prohibited. However as of January 1, 2000, it is illegal to buy, manufacture, import, keep for sale, expose for sale, give or lend any large-capacity magazine in California except by law enforcement agencies, California peace officers, or licensed dealers.

(lifted from CalGuns)

I am writing in response to your letter (undated) regarding large-capacity ammunition magazines. You had a number of questions:

Q1: Can you import newly manufactured parts to repair a legally obtained hi-cap magazine?
A1: Yes.

Q2: Are there any restrictions on which parts can and cannot be imported?
A2: No.

Q3: Can you import all the parts of a single hi-cap magazine at once, provided they are unassembled?
A3: Yes.

Q4: Can a California resident travel to another state, purchase a hi-cap magazine in that state, dissassemble it and ship the required replacement parts back to themselves in California?
A4: Penal Code section 12020(a)(2) makes it illegal to import a large capacity magazine into the state of California. If you traveled to another state in order to import a large capacity magazine, you would be guilty of a felony, even if you disassembled the large capacity magazine before returning to California. If you disassembled the large capacity magazine with the intent to use it only as repair parts, you could lawfully bring the parts in to California. In either case, you would test the limits of the law, and be at risk of criminal prosecution.

Q5: Can you replace the magazine body with one marked "For Law Enforcement Only"?
A5: While theoretically you could use such a part to repair a lawfully owned large capacity magazine, most dealers would be unlikely to sell you such a magazine body, unless you were a law enforcement officer.

Q6: Is there any limitation to the number of parts you can replace in a legally obtained hi-cap magazine? (Scenario: if on successive days I replace each individual part of a legally obtained hi-cap magazine, am I guilty of assembling a new hi-cap magazine once the final part is replaced?)
A6: Whether the scenario you describe constitutes repairing or manufacturing a large capacity magazine depends upon the legal opinion of the prosecutor in the jurisdiction where the acts occur. There are 58 district attorneys in California's 58 counties. They could elect to prosecute you for a felony (Penal Code 12280(a)(2)), if they believed that you were manufacturing a large capacity magazine.

Q7: If the magazine body is replaced with one clearly manufactured after 2000 is there any burden of proof upon a California resident that they did in fact replace a worn/obsolete part and did not illegally purchase/import a new hi-cap magazine.
A7: A California resident who repairs a large capacity magazine that was owned before January 1, 2000 does not have any "burden of proof" that the magazine was repaired, rather than replaced with a new magazine. However, it would be prudent in such a case to keep records documenting the purchase of the part necessary for the repair in order to demonstrate that the large capacity magazine was repaired, not replaced.

Q8: Can you use parts designed for a 10-round magazine to repair a legally obtained hi-cap magazine?
A8: If parts designed for a 10-round magazine are interchangeable with parts of a legally obtained large capacity magazine, there is no legal barrier to using them.

Q9: Can you have enough spare parts to assemble a new hi-cap magazine provided they are unassembled and intended for use as replacement parts?
A9: Whether the scenario you describe constitutes posession of magazine parts with the intent to manufacture or with the intent to repair a large capacity magazine depends upon the legal opinion of the prosecutor in the jurisdiction where the acts occur. You could be charged with a felony (Penal Code 12280(a)(2)), if a prosecutor believed that you were manufacturing a large capacity magazine.

I hope that this information was helpful. Please feel free to contact me again if you have any additional questions.
 
Why wouldnt he just purchase them on his own in ca? I know they can.
Actualy LEO are a much smaller market than the general public and such magazines are therefore rarely stocked in most locations.
That could make it difficult to find a good competitive price on available 30 round magazines.

Moraly I would not sell anything to LEO that was banned for the citizens. Sell to another state. That choice is yours though.
 
Q3: Can you import all the parts of a single hi-cap magazine at once, provided they are unassembled?
A3: Yes.

Q4: Can a California resident travel to another state, purchase a hi-cap magazine in that state, dissassemble it and ship the required replacement parts back to themselves in California?
A4: Penal Code section 12020(a)(2) makes it illegal to import a large capacity magazine into the state of California. If you traveled to another state in order to import a large capacity magazine, you would be guilty of a felony, even if you disassembled the large capacity magazine before returning to California. If you disassembled the large capacity magazine with the intent to use it only as repair parts, you could lawfully bring the parts in to California. In either case, you would test the limits of the law, and be at risk of criminal prosecution.
What a brilliant law! Someone can get a disassembled mag into the state,all parts at once, then reassemble it, but if its assembled before you bring it in, it's a felony, 'cause it will magicaly cause you to murder children.I guess evil hi-cap mags miraclously become un-evil when assembled inside the state of California (but only if the parts came in by mail, they remain evil if you bring them in any other way...).California laws, in conjunction wih the USPS fairy, must act as a magical talisman to ward off the evil....
I love how gun laws always make so much sense....:rolleyes:
 
Being a CA resident, If I understand these BS rules correctly, the LEO has to present you with a department letter of some sort.
 
California has a HiCap mag ticket for the FFL to stock and sell normal cap mags to LEO only with a letter head. I am suprised the LEO in question would not be familiar with this. Just send them through his HiCap dealer and no problem. Check Mikes Guns in Montclair CA or Ades Guns in Orange CA. It was several years ago Mike was my dealer and I have seen his permit I suspect Ade has one as well as lots of LEO purchase there. I have purchased guns that came with normal cap mags, Mike stripped off the "illegal" for me mags and discounted the gun to comp me.
If one living in CA purchased 30rd mag parts from out of state to repair a legal mag they currently have then you would want to keep the old parts for sure. Contact the California DOJ firearms division. They can be most helpful. :)
 
Shipping a sword cane to the DPRK is a felony, and the authorities there will charge and issue a warrant for the peon who put it in the box and shipped it. I wouldn't be surprised if mags are treated the same. If the would be purchaser really IS DPRK LE that's even more reason to tell him to pound sand, ala Ronnie Barrett.
 
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