Shooting with a young Marine

[Blackfork]

The CFO of a company I do business with asked me to take his nephew, a Marine who is going to Iraq in August, out to the range to shoot a little. I was happy to oblige.

I started him off on .22 Ruger Mk1 target pistol, (with gongs and falling plates) for some front sight/trigger technique work. Turned out he had only shot a pistol once before in his life. We shot .22, went to .45 (Sig 220), back to 9mm (Sig 226), then even a little Luger, (1938) for a historical touch. I switched pistols back and forth and had him shoot them all several times and then shoot some longer sustained strings. I'm sure we shot 200 rounds @ 5 shots per string.

Then we went over on the rifle range and shot a Garand. He knew what a Garand was but had never seen one in person or shot one. We talked technique and sights, stripped it, worked on his bench technique, dry fired a little and then shot. He shot 40 shots at 100 and 200 yards. Big fun. No misses. He said even his Drill Sgts hadn't shot Garands as far as he knew.

Then he shot my pampered and weighted AR15 CMP (backup) rifle. Compared to an M16 it is a well-built and behaved gun. We shot several positions and I showed him how to use a hasty sling, plus I put on a jacket and sling and shot a sitting group for him at 200 and demonstrated Natural Point of Aim.

From there we went to a stock civilian M4 carbine. We were shooting M855 out of 30 round mags. He shot about 250 rounds at 100 and 200 from several different positions while I talked to him about what was going on. I had him shoot a little left-handed while we were at it, and moved the sights ten left, ten up, so he would get a feeling for windage and elevation controls. He says his unit will carry the carbines in Iraq.

Besides shooting we dug bullets out of the berm, took apart a M855 and shot the primer and burned the ball powder, watched mirage and trace, and talked tactics from MOA and reloading to shooting a walking lead.

He seemed like an OK guy. Fit, heathy, young, motivated. I'm sure he is a terrific soldier. I invited him to come back and shoot again if he got home again before deployment and could get time off from his girlfriend.

Every soldier I have ever met outside a competitive venue just needs trigger time and instruction. He had been through Marine basic, which is a pretty good foundation.

The CFO asked me what he needed. I told him to get him a good pair of binoculars.

 

[Texfire]

Sounds like a good day shooting, always nice to hear about someone sharing their enthusiasm for shooting.

Tex

 

[bdutton]

...demonstrated Natural Point of Aim....so he would get a feeling for windage and elevation controls. ...needs trigger time and instruction.

So... it sounds like this new marine needed additional instruction on the fundamentals of marksmanship. WHY? :banghead:

 

[BADUNAME13]

It sounds like this guy was a 'boot Marine'
-Just out of boot and hadn't gone to SOI or MCT.

You can be a Marine, and shoot badly.
Not all Marines are Experts, you have Sharpshooter, and Marksman (Pizza Box)

Boot Camp is a MINIMUM level of training, you arn't even shown how to take the extractor off the Bolt there. Your training will increase in your first Platoon.

-Although I know POGUE types who havn't done a rifle Qual in 3-4 years...

The Corps is like anything, you get out what you put in.
(Although he SHOULD of known ALL the basics of sight alinement, and Natural point of aim... sounds like he didn't pay attention to his PMI.)

 

[kevin davis]

my son has been in the marines for almost four years. since boot camp, i do not think he gets any range time in more than every three or four months, and then only for about 60 rounds and about an hour at the range. i get more time than him and a lot more rounds, and i shoot better too. i am disgusted that he and the others do not get range time weekly.

 

[Lew]

I'm in the Air Force, and I don't get to practice flying an F-16 very often... Understand that there are a wide range of duties in the military, and not all are at the tip of the spear.

Edit: I don't know the situation of either of the marines mentioned; I'm just offering an objective comment.

Cheers.

 

[Freelance Tax Collector]

I don't get to shoot nearly as much as I'd like. The shoots that we do I feel are ineffective, but on the other hand, I also understand how difficult it is to run a live fire MOUT course.

The difficulty of shooting on my off time on a regular basis also doesn't help. To this date, I'm still not very clear on how to get my own firearms legally kept on base (I know about the whole check it into the armory deal). Probably the best thing for me to do would be to keep them in a storage unit, but a. that's too expensive, and b. it's too risky. Fact of the matter is, even though I am a Marine infantryman, at this point in life it's just not practical to shoot on a regular basis.

 

[glockman19]

Blackfork,

Good mentoring. Everyone sould have a guy like you to learn from. Noce variety of firearms too.

 

[K5mitch]

Freelance Tax Collector:

I'm not sure about the differences between air force and marine bases, but when I was in the dorms I kept my firearms in the armory on base. I had three stored there; benelli nova, taurus .357, and a marlin .22.

I had to get a letter from my commander saying that he was aware I was storing firearms in the armory and granted me authority to do so. I removed the bolt from the benelli and the marlin, and utilized the hammer lock on my taurus. I've heard horror stories of people's stored firearms being used without their consent, so I took measures to prevent it. Our armory wouldn't accept firearms with trigger lock on them so I did the next best thing and removed the bolts, and kept them in my dorm room.

Checking firearms while traveling was easy at the two air force bases I had to do so at. I just calmly told the gate guard "I am required to inform you I have an unloaded firearm in my vehicle. I need directions to the armory, please." I was issued a hand-receipt for my revolver and 20 rounds of ammunition I had both times. Just make sure you follow proper procedures and obey all verbal commands

 

[Smith357]

When I was a Marine Corps grunt back in the late 70s we humped to the range all the time. We were not at war at the time so training was all we did.

 

[buck00]

Boot Camp is a MINIMUM level of training, you arn't even shown how to take the extractor off the Bolt there. Your training will increase in your first Platoon.

Yeah, the point of the original post was suspect. At first it seemed like he was just telling a story about a trip to the range with a Marine... but at times the tone of the post implied the Marine wasn't a very good shot and needed a lot of work.

If your hobby is competitive shooting- sure I'd guess you might be a better shot than many Marines in the safe confines of your local range. But USMC boot camp also teaches one a lot of important things that are far more valuable than competitive shooting.

 

[Kali Endgame]

Personally, I was more worried about NOT being a Safety Violator than shooting right. I'd never fired a gun before Boot Camp. Qual'd Expert in Boot Camp and every year after. Most people are just trying to survive Boot Camp.

I agree that our troops don't get enough range time. CAX is real fun, though.

 

[Freelance Tax Collector]

Here's the skinny... I know the armorers, they were previously members of my platoon. My PLT NCO sent them to the armory because they either get out within a matter of weeks, or because they royally messed up somewhere. I'm not going to trust my baby remington, that I've spent close to $1500 and all the time and effort into making it a tack driving rifle, with the likes of these armorers.

Let me make it clear again- these guys were put into the armory because they couldn't hack it in a line platoon, which if you really think about it, it's better to have them just pass out weapons, do paperwork, and play tic-tac-toe all day than to have to trust them to cover my 6. I've had my laptop computer stolen by one "marine" who decided he needed the cash to get his car out of impound so he could go on a vacation on marine corps time. I had my crap locked up, and this melonhead went so far as to get bolt cutters to cut my locker open to get at the goods. I filed a report with the PMO, and got reimbursed, but 4 years worth of pictures, music, and more was lost.

It just goes to show you that you really can't trust anyone, not even the marines that you trained and fought with. What does that mean in practical terms? Lock your crap up and don't skyline yourself. I've already lost a $1200 computer. I don't plan on losing firearms worth much more than that.

As a more minor problem, I'd always have to shoot factory ammunition. There ain't no way no how I'd be able to buy and store handloading supplies such as powder, primers, casings, or bullets.

In conclusion, don't expect to do a lot of recreational shooting when you join the Marine Corps.

 

[chris in va]

You guys would really laugh over the Air Force training, at least back in 92 when I enlisted. No full auto allowed, only about 70 rounds fired.

That was it for 4 years.

 

[Freelance Tax Collector]

We never shoot our rifles on burst either. SAWs are a different story, but they're not that cool.

 

[K-Romulus]

Can't take the extractor off the bolt? WTH is that about? Is that a Hollywood Marine thing? We sure were doing that back in 1990-91.