Single Moms, please buy a lead slinger

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jeepmor

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This would not have been an issue if only there was a simple 38spcl on the nightstand. This woman was incredibly lucky. The felon had more chances than I've ever seen reported, but the recent shooting mentioned happened about a month or so ago, and I'm sure this accounts for the attempts at non-lethal force first.

jeepmor


http://washingtoncountyupdates.blogs.oregonlive.com/default.asp?item=243134

Sheriff's deputy shoots, kills intruder in Tualatin
Posted by Washington County Bureau October 22, 2006 13:40
Oregonian Washington County Updates Index Print | Email

TUALATIN -- A Washington County sheriff's deputy shot and killed an intruder early Sunday morning after he broke into a woman's apartment. Shocks with a Taser and bean bag rounds failed to subdue him, and the deputy shot the man as he tried to reach for an officer's weapon, police said.

The fatal shooting is the second involving Washington County deputies in recent weeks, following the Sept. 16 shooting of 18-year-old Lukus Glenn outside his parents' Metzger home.

Sgt. David Thompson, sheriff's spokesman, gave the following account of Sunday morning's shooting:

The man broke into a woman's ground-floor apartment shortly after midnight at the Woodridge apartment complex, in the 11900 block of Southwest Tualatin Road. The woman awoke to find him standing by her bed.

She screamed at him to get out, grabbed her cell phone and ran into her 8-year-old daughter's bedroom at the back of the apartment. The man followed her into the room and began attacking her, but she was able to call 9-1-1, Thompson said. The woman sustained minor injuries, but her daughter was not hurt.

A Tualatin police officer responded to the call, fought with the man and fired a Taser gun to shock him, to no effect. Next, a Sherwood officer arrived and fired bean bag rounds at the man, but they didn't slow him, either.

Finally, a Washington County deputy arrived. When the suspect ran toward the deputy, he also shot him with his Taser. At that point, the man reached inside one of the officer's patrol cars and tried to grab a gun mounted at the front, Thompson said.

The deputy shot the intruder, who slumped against the side of the car and reached inside again. The deputy fired again, and the man collapsed outside the car and died, Thompson said.

Thompson said deputies were still trying to identify the man. It is not known how he entered the woman's apartment. The woman told police she did not know the man.

Thompson declined to release the name of the woman or the three officers involved in the shooting. The officers are on paid administrative leave while officials investigate the incident.
 
It won't do much as the perp was already within spitting range.
Well, she was able to grab a phone and call the police (push 3 buttons in a sequence)...she certainly could have grabbed a gun instead of the phone and pressed one lever on it.
 
I do not think it would have made a difference if she had a gun. I think the mind set of being able to use it is more important.
Otherwise why did she not have one?
 
Ok, mindset, but start involving a child and that maternal mindset can overcome all manner of liberal programming in a heartbeat. This guy managed to stay in the fight despite two "rides" and beanbags, but she was able to resist enough to use the phone? She was actively resisting. Now, had she had a visible firearm it appears as though he might have tried to acquire it, which we can agree would have been bad. So, a more secure location would have been key but mindset may not be the issue some think it would have been.
 
Yes, women should own guns

Shouldn't own a gun if she doesn't have the mindset is hogwash in my opinion. You can bet your butt she wanted something more effective than a cell phone to fight this guy off. What if the police were less timely in their arrival or he got the phone away from her? The police would have been collecting statistcs as is all to common in cases like this. Tell me her mindset would not have allowed her to pull a trigger when she was able to dial 911....while being attacked. Guns are simpler to operate than cell phones.

And that's my plea to single women, guns are easier to operate than cell phones. I'd hope they would never be needed, but this case indicates otherwise. She was lucky, we all can acknowledge that.

jeepmor
 
Ok, mindset, but start involving a child and that maternal mindset can overcome all manner of liberal programming in a heartbeat.
Then why'd she grab a phone instead of a butcher knife?
 
Because the butcher knife was not close at hand. I doubt most people keep a butcher knife next to their bed. A cell phone is a lot more likely.

I wonder if she will be keeping a gun next to the bed now?
 
My wife is a very kind person.

Altogether too trusting, if you ask me. And I also have no doubt that if she or my son were attacked and she were the one who had to defend them, she would not be so kindhearted for the next few moments. So yes, survival trumps "liberal" and "PC" stuff.

The woman was working with the tools she had been told to use. What's our gripe about public awareness? The fact that the "authorities" tell them to dial 911 and wait for the Po-Po. She enacted her plan, dial like she was told to and try to escape the threat. She did both of these rather admirably. She seems to have kept her daughter from being injured, too.

The problem wasn't her mindset. She fought. The problem wasn't that she had no kitchen knife by her bed. She'd been told to have a cell phone. Also, if she had, some here would fault her for keeping a knife where her young daughter could have gotten it.

Her problem was the people who are more interested in collecting statistics than solving the problems of violent crime. She doesn't need some cop or social worker to "counsel her in her time of trauma", she needs a gunny to take her under his/her wing and show her the ropes. Personally, I think she's got the stones to take care of herself if someone shows her how.
 
This would not have been an issue if only there was a simple 38spcl on the nightstand.

No leaving a firearm on the nightstand, She would have woke up to find her attacker armed with her weapon:eek: . The woman would have been raped and killed. With a 8 year old in the house, she need a gun and a lockbox under the bed.
 
She needs to ascertain how he got through her perimeter, resolving that issue first! Foremost.

Then, she could, if she chose, decide to purchase and train with a firearm or some other defensive tool.

Finally, she needs to come up with some plan for child preservation/anti-home invasion.

A cell phone and a couple of good officers saved her life. She is extremely lucky/blessed.

Perhaps she should get a dog.

Lessons to be learned by many/all.
 
She screamed at him to get out, grabbed her cell phone and ran into her 8-year-old daughter's bedroom at the back of the apartment. The man followed her into the room and began attacking her, but she was able to call 9-1-1
Don't know the layout of the apartment, but she ran from her bedroom. She could have gone in the kitchen and grabbed a knife, but she ran into her daughter's room.
You can bet your butt she wanted something more effective than a cell phone to fight this guy off.
If that's the case, why didn't she arm herself after fleeing her bedroom? If the woman had been willing to fight, she would have done it in her own bedroom, or fought the invader outside her daughter's room. Poor tactics to lead the attacker into her daughter's room. Worse tactics to let the child witness the assault.

Sounds more like she was completely unprepared to defend herself or her daughter.
 
Yea, because she didn't have a gun.

Whats a woman going to do to a rapist? I'm not trying to be a chauvenist, but men are genetically bigger/stronger than women. Thats a fact. I don't seriously think this woman felt that she had any kind of advantage after being ambushed in the sanctity of her own bedroom. That certainly doesn't foster a "Come get some!" mentality.

Proposing that she should have grabbed a knife is silly for a lot of reasons.
 
The officers are on paid administrative leave while officials investigate the incident.
what's to investigate? I don't know why everytime a cop shoots a wacko, that he or she has to take a leave while being investigated.
 
Proposing that she should have grabbed a knife is silly for a lot of reasons.


Thank you. Her first instinct was to go to her child and she did just that, deviating could have let him get there first, with possibly tragic results. She kept her wits about her enough to summon the cavalry, and they took care of business. In most cases, it doesnt happen that way, but it did here. Hindsight is 20/20, but with what she had to work with she did ok. Hopefully she'll use this as a lesson and never again be at someone's mercy.
 
Proposing that she should have grabbed a knife is silly for a lot of reasons.
Sillier than grabbing a phone and hoping someone comes to save you and your child?

And sillier than grabbing a gun if she had one?
 
Additional information

Caught some follow up on this story this afternoon.

Apparently this guy kept apologizing to the woman while in the apartment, and told her several times that he was high on mushrooms.

As far as mindset and owning a firearm, I hope that she will change both very soon. She was extremely lucky this time. She can't hope to get lucky if something like this happens again.
 
Firearms are not the universal solution to self defense

Guns are not for everyone. We shouldn't get in the habit of recommending that a firearm meets everyone's needs for self defense. It doesn't.

There are many people out there who could have M240s sited with interlocking final protective fires around their property who would still be victims.

The idea that everyone can muster the inner strength to effectively defend themselves or their family when placed in a life or death encounter is also a non-starter.

If you don't teach someone the proper mindset before giving them any weapon, they will most likely be unable to effectively employ it and you are likely arming a criminal.

Your mind is your primary weapon. Guns, knives, handgrenades and small thermonuclear devices are just tools. Mindset first, then skill with the appropriate tool.

Jeff
 
You guys seem to forget that you as males were raised differently then we women. The protection job was yours and the police not ours. Thats just how society wanted their women to behave.

While you guys may ooh and aww over a woman who is confident in themselves and just so happens carries a weapon they are not the ones you bring home to mom. You bring home women like your mom.

You make statements like why didn't she pick up a gun instead of the cell phone. One good reason is she has a young child in the house and to be quite frank a gun under the bed in a gun safe is useless as is any weapon in a safe when you need it.

Her best bet is a large dog. One that can growl, show teeth and drool at the same time. A rottie, mastiff or a dogo would be great protectors.
 
Sillier than grabbing a phone and hoping someone comes to save you and your child?

Calling 911 if possible should always be done if a BG is in your home. Once the call goes out, even if you don't stay on the line, the dispatcher will have your address and send out a patrol car.

There is no such thing as Rambo and Dirty Harry. A real soldier relies on air support, and fire support. A real cop relies on other officers to back him up. Calling 911 is not a sign of weakness. Assuming you can take on any threat alone, without the help of law enforcement, is not too bright.
 
A few points for her in the future.

1.) Secure her dwelling. If this guy got in without making enough noise to wake her before he was standing over her bed she has a big problem.

2.) I agree with other posters get a dog, a big one. I have a German Shepard that weighs in at over 100lbs. She sleeps downstairs, we sleep upstairs. Try getting past her. If you manage to get past the dog she will have at least made enough noise to wake me and give me enough time to grab the shotgun.

3.) The cell phone on the nightstand was good. I always have mine on the nightstand before going to sleep.

4.) Take a self defense course, take a firearms saftey course, get a gun. Nuff said there.

To the person who posted the gun should be in a safe not on the nightstand I have this to say. A gun in a safe is USELESS when you need it. I keep mine locked away from little hands during the day. However at night the safe is opened, and a Glock goes on the nightstand. I dont want to fumble with a safe when time is a matter of life or death. Also to those who suggested she should grab a knife.....BUZZ.....wrong answer. Not to sound sexist but unless trained in combat a knife in a womans hands only arms her attacker. Guns are a great equalizer knives are not. And judging from the trouble the officers had in subduing the suspect (tasers, and bean bags failing :what: ) I doubt a .38 would have been suffecient. Remember the U.S Army when fighting the Moro warriors (who used drugs in battle as did our bad guy in this story) found multiple hits from their .38 revolvers to be ineffective, thus they adopted the .45acp. Bottom line if you dont plan to use a serious caliber dont bother. Learn to deal with the recoil from a .45, 357, 44mag, etc. You only have one life to protect dont chance it to inferior calibers.
 
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