Small Base Dies

[alanwk]

This message is from Lee.s website. What say you? Agree or not.

If you have the Lee Ultimate or PaceSetter die set with a full length-sizing die, you shouldn't need a small base die. Other manufacturers make small base dies on the premise that semi-autos require cases sized to the minimum allowable case dimension for reliable feeding, but in reality, most semi-autos have chambers cut on the large side for that same purpose. The result is overworked brass and shortened case life. If you have any chambering problems with ammunition that has been sized with a Lee full length sizing die, return the die and a couple fired cases to the factory for free adjustment.

 

[Varminterror]

Lee is one of a few companies which use “small base” specifications for their standard die dimensions. It’s a safety blanket for them to know any user, regardless of experience level, reloading for any rifle with a chamber within SAAMI spec, regardless of tight or loose, will be able to produce functional ammunition with their dies.

It’s not necessarily any statement of quality, but simply an acknowledgement, if someone owns Lee dies, they won’t benefit from buying a specially marked small base die from another brand.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

This message is from Lee.s website. What say you? Agree or not.

If you have the Lee Ultimate or PaceSetter die set with a full length-sizing die, you shouldn't need a small base die. Other manufacturers make small base dies on the premise that semi-autos require cases sized to the minimum allowable case dimension for reliable feeding, but in reality, most semi-autos have chambers cut on the large side for that same purpose. The result is overworked brass and shortened case life. If you have any chambering problems with ammunition that has been sized with a Lee full length sizing die, return the die and a couple fired cases to the factory for free adjustment.

I’ve never used a small base die. I have used Lee Pacesetters with the only “problem” being stupid poor machining on the expanders - but then I switched to decapping, resizing and neck expansion in separate steps and the problems all went away. I have reloaded for self-loading and repeater using the same method with no problems.

I agree in general with the Lee statement: self-loading firearms have more generous chambers than single-load or repeaters, in general with some exceptions.

The chambers of most lever action rifles - a repeater, not a self-loader - are most generous and not terribly forgiving so if a small base die were used, that’s where I’d be most likely to use it.

 

[entropy]

Brass is cheap (sometimes free in the calibers I shoot), I use small base dies in calibers I shoot from semi autos, even when I also have bolts in those calibers. The one semi auto rifle caliber I use Lee dies for, I've never had a problem with rounds chambering.

 

[zeke]

Am not experienced with Lee's Ultimate or Pacesetter rifle sizing dies. Have seen several companies cutting smaller dimensioned chambers in semi auto's in the never ending search for accuracy, where a small base die was required for reliable chambering of reloads. Am in possession of a 308 Ar-10 and newer style BLR 308 lever action with such chambers, and have a friend with first version of Ruger ar-15 with minimum cut chamber that also requires sb dies.

Was a prolific scrounger of once fired 223 brass, and have learned to initially sb size them to avoid having to use a sb body die to resize reloads to reliably chamber. Am blaming this on the more common use of Ar-15 short barreled pistols, after resizing a batch of new brass that i knew came from one.

On the other hand, have a preference for Lee rifle dies in lever action calibers specifically because they didn't act as small base dies like the Redding or RCBS dies tried.

There are always exceptions to any generalized statements or standards. But ime, Lee's statement about generously cut semi auto chambers is outdated. Imo, people just need to aware that sb dies exist, if needed in a specific instance. And the usual caveat that am older, outdated and aging out. And have not bought any new dies in at least 10 yrs.

 

[Bartojc]

My first set of .223 dies were Lee. Not sure if they were pacesetter or not or what that even means. THey were definately Lee though. I had an issue getting the resized brass chamberred in an AR. I tried a number of things, making sure the resize die was all the way down, etc. Nothing worked with that die. I borrowed my neighbors RCBS small base die and my issue went away. I then bought a set of small base dies and never had another issue. Maybe the die was bad, maybe I did not know what I was doing, but the small base die fixed my issue. I've never tried to use that Lee .223 sizing die again.

-Jeff

 

[GW Staar]

Just depends. Even factory ammo can be problematic. Case in point. Years ago I was looking for a AR10 clone, and the only one I could find was a camoed Remington SR20 .308 hunting rifle. Well it was just before Christmas and my wife thought I ought to buy it. So I did and bought two boxes of .308, one Remington and one Federal (blue box).

The Remington ammo shot like a dream....very accurate rifle....very pleased. So then I tried the Federal...... Filled the mag, fired the first round, and the second round woundn't chamber all the way. Tried that 3 more times with the same result. Went home and got a box of .308 reloads, (Winchester brass) and had the same experience as the federal. Bought another box of Remington......which fed smooth as glass.

So I bought a small-based die and reloaded some more Winchester using that.....and it fed like butter. So what's the answer to that one? Seems Remington's "hunting" AR was cut for accuracy.....on the minimum specs......factory ammo varied by brand.....RCBS regular rifle dies are not small based.....so they make another S.B. version. Dillon rifle dies vary from that.....ALL their rifle dies are small based according to a Dillon reps reply to a question on Brian Enos. So depends on rifle cut, on factory ammo, on die brand, and maybe more. But since Dillon thinks s.b. is good enough for ALL their rifle bottleneck dies, I don't feel I should be hesitant using RCBS's small base dies. They work well, even on my batch of M.G. LC brass I bought and reloaded. And of course this is just one caliber too. Other's probably vary too.....223, 300 blackout, and others.

The last factor is die quality control....every factory has its bad days.....