something went wrong

[vulcandeathbuny]

so I been reloading using the same components for a while. I bought some once. fired brass and started reloading it the same way I always load my brass. I loaded a few and went to shoot, every primer blew out. I thought I had made an error. so I went back to the loading table and did it again. tis time I lowered what I normally would load by 15% still it blew the primer out. I calibrated my scales and they were ok. . any suggestions is the brass I bought defective

 

[frankenstein406]

loose primer pockets?

 

[vulcandeathbuny]

I guess so. some of the brass deformed when I waspriming it. I threw those out.

 

[rcmodel]

First, it would help immensely to know what caliber you are taking about.

And second, what the exact load was you are using.

The part about 'the brass deformed when I waspriming it' leads me to think you were smashing primers in cases with crimped military primers without removing the crimp first.

But until you fill in the blanks, I would hate to hazard a guess.

rc

 

[jcwit]

Sounds like those were "once fired" many, many reloads ago.

 

[vulcandeathbuny]

the brass was lake city was not military cramped . the caliber were 60 grain223 and300aac. 125 grain.thanks for all the replies and help.

 

[oldcelt]

Cannot understand how brass would deform when priming. I would look for a more serious problem. Pistol primers???

 

[243winxb]

the caliber were 60 grain223 and300aac. 125 grain.

Very confusing. Remove the crimp on the primer pockets.

 

[ljnowell]

powder type, charge weights, etc? You are making it quite difficult to help you.

 

[gamestalker]

Well, you've certainly made some type of error, but it's difficult to evaluate what went wrong without a better presentation of the facts.

Start over and explain with better detail what the load consisted of, powder charge weight, what powder you used, and what primers were you using, as well as any other specific details of the load and components used. Lowering the charge by 15% doesn't tell us anything. Without knowing the type powder, or the charge weight you were using?

And might I suggest next time you begin to experience a catastrophic failure trend, that you stop right there. Then take the remaining cartridges home and pull the bullets, begin checking your powder charges to be sure they are, what they should be.

Is it possible that you used the wrong powder by error?

Do you re-zero the scale with each new reloading session?

Is it possible that you might have used a pistol primer rather than a rifle primer, either intentionally, or unintentionally? This is something I intentionally tried years back. I quickly learned that pistol primers aren't capable of standing up to the higher pressures of a bottle neck case, which is typically more than twice as much.

GS

 

[vulcandeathbuny]

ok it was 2 different loads.
first load.
223 hornaday max 60 grain projectile. powder varget 22 grains. primer tula.223


second load.
300 aac
hornaday 125 grain projectile. powder imr 4227. @ 15.5 grains.

once again thanks for all the help. been reloading about a year. and about a1000 loads and this is my first problem.

 

[medalguy]

If you have Lake City brass and the primers were NOT crimped, I'd bet a dollar to a doughnut the brass is not once fired. That could very well account for the loose primers.

Also, what do you mean "deformed when priming it." How were you priming it? On the press, off the press, what kind of tool? Deformed how? I can't figure out how you could possibly deform brass while priming it. We need details.

 

[vulcandeathbuny]

I was using a lee hand primer. and the brass would be warped horrible where it was in the shell holder. it wouldn't stand straight up on the table and it looked like the leaning tower

 

[Lost Sheep]

I was using a lee hand primer. and the brass would be warped horrible where it was in the shell holder. it wouldn't stand straight up on the table and it looked like the leaning tower

Before the brass was primed, would it lean in a similar fashion?

After the brass was primed, and leaning over, did you check to verify the primers were fully seated? (They should be a little BELOW flush) I know, with a year's experience behind you, you probably already know to check these two, but I have learned not to make ANY assumptions about what has been checked before I start making conjectures.

Were there any chambering problems with the loaded ammuntion? You might try chambering a few of these "once fired" before processing them, then trying them immediately after sizing. It might provide some clues.

Lost Sheep

 

[Lost Sheep]

ok it was 2 different loads.
first load.
223 hornaday max 60 grain projectile. powder varget 22 grains. primer tula.223


second load.
300 aac
hornaday 125 grain projectile. powder imr 4227. @ 15.5 grains.

once again thanks for all the help. been reloading about a year. and about a1000 loads and this is my first problem.

Do I read this right?
Chambering: .223 Remington
Bullet: Jacketed 60 grain Hornady (V-Max?)
Propellant: Varget
22 Grains
Primer Tula Standard?
Firearm: ___________________
Hogdon's web site suggests 25 to 27 grains

Chambering: .300 AAC Blackout
Bullet: Jacketed 125 grain Nosler? BT
Propellant: IMR 4227
15.5 Grains
Primer Tula Standard?
Firearm: ___________________
Hogdon's web site suggests 16.5 to 17.7 grains

The same problem cropping up with different projectiles, different firearms, different propellants. But the problem cropped up with brass (of different chamberings) bought from the same seller? Suspect the brass. Or the scale. Or the loader.

Put a REALLY ACCURATE micrometer on the brass, bullets, everything, before and after loading. Double check the scale.

Do you have access to a chronograph? Are velocities off from expected?

Good luck. Keep us posted, please. And please tell us the firearms used. Do you have any other firearms you could try these in? (But don't ask to borrow mine.)

Lost Sheep

 

[vulcandeathbuny]

both firearms are ars. I didn't consult the hodgons website. I used hornaday 9th edition.and my loads are on the puny side so that's what threw me off. as far as double checking goes . I do. no I don't have a chronograph. and no they weren't leaning before. the wraps caused by the shell holder is causing it to lean.

 

[climbnjump]

Do I read this right?
Chambering: .223 Remington
Bullet: Jacketed 60 grain Hornady (V-Max?)
Propellant: Varget
22 Grains
Primer Tula Standard?
Firearm: ___________________
Hogdon's web site suggests 25 to 27 grains

Yes, but Hornady 9th Ed lists 21.7 to 24.9 gr for Varget and the 60 gr V-Max (WSR primer).

Chambering: .300 AAC Blackout
Bullet: Jacketed 125 grain Nosler? BT
Propellant: IMR 4227
15.5 Grains
Primer Tula Standard?
Firearm: ___________________
Hogdon's web site suggests 16.5 to 17.7 grains

I think this was also a Hornady bullet. If so, the same manual I mentioned above lists 14.4 to 18.3 gr for IMR 4227 for a 125 gr SST (WSR primer).

So yeah, we still need more info...

 

[JohnhenrySTL]

Are you positive you were using the proper shell holder and primer tray? Was there more resistance and challenge priming this brass than during your past thousand rounds? My Lee primer tray hates to prime brass
after it has cycled through my sig 716. So much so, I have been forced to learn to clean my primer pockets. But I still do not believe my auto primer creates enough force to hurt brass. I think you should take us through a detailed account of your reloading, case lube, resizing methods, crimping, any one thing
can deform brass. Best of luck to you either way.

 

[gamestalker]

I'm as well concerned, as deformed brass the result of a priming operation doesn't really sound very likely, if even possible? Is it possible that your cases are coming out of the sizing die with excessive resistance, thus pulling the head down in the supported areas of the shell holder, that's if the case heads wouldn't just completely be pulled off with that amount of extraction force.

Another thought, and I mention it because I've seen it happen more than once, is low pressure, or below start charge loads. Their are a number of strange pressure symptoms, including primers getting blown out of the primer pocket most of the way, blown and, or, severely leaking primers, signs of gases blowing back down the shoulder, or down the case. Collapsed shoulders and bodies are also excessively low pressure indications. Just some more information to try and help you identify the culprit.

Pay close attention to what the press and brass is doing during each step so you can maybe identify when that case head is being deformed, it should be fairly easy to spot that much cam over and resistance using a hand held priming tool, or even a press operated one.

Good luck, and be safe. Try to remain open minded, even though you have a year under your belt, don't let it cloud your judgement concerning this hobby. You can get hurt in under a second!

GS

 

[steve4102]

Some addition clarification is needed.

What exactly do YOU mean by primers "Blew Out"?

Did they blow right out of the case and end up in the trigger group of your ARs?
Did they stay put, but the firing pin punched a hole (pierced) them?

Or did thy just back out of the case a little bit?

Once Fired LC brass with no primer crimp is possible, but only if the brass was purchased new and reloaded once. Not to many handloaders would buy "new" brass then load it once then sell it.

That leaves two possible conclusions, 1) The brass DOES have a crimped primer and you are not recognizing it. 2) the brass is many times fired, not once fired and may be worn out.

A picture of the brass/primer would be helpful.

Your 300 Blackout is LC brass as well? I did not know LC made Blackout brass. If I am correct here, then your Blackout brass is formed from a 223 case and may indeed be many times fired as well and also worn out.

A picture of the "deformed" brass would be nice. I'm with the others here and I can't imagine a Lee handpriming tool mangling the case head. They are soft metal and have been known to break, no way this toll has enough power to mangle a case head.

 

[Comrade Mike]

Did you forget to lube the cases when resizing and perhaps deformed the rim when pulling the case out of the die?

Your loads also seem on the light side, perhaps so light that the primer isn't being reseated by the bolt face?

 

[ATLDave]

I had the same thought as Comrade Mike, although that wouldn't explain anything about the brass "deforming" during priming. One of my loading manuals - Hornady perhaps(?) - has a good section in the non-recipe part of the book that discusses primers routinely being unseated and reseated during the firing process, and that the reseating may not occur with very light charges.

On another topic, I've loaded a decent amount of LC brass that came from Berry's (back when things were in stock) that was not crimped and was represented as new.

 

[steve4102]

Your loads also seem on the light side, perhaps so light that the primer isn't being reseated by the bolt face?

Exactly my point for asking this in post #20. If his primers are just "backed out" it's a Low Pressure situation, If he means they actually "blew out" of the primer pocket, then it's high pressure.

What exactly do YOU mean by primers "Blew Out"?

Did they blow right out of the case and end up in the trigger group of your ARs?
Did they stay put, but the firing pin punched a hole (pierced) them?

Or did thy just back out of the case a little bit?

 

[oldcelt]

Primers Tula standard, Standard what? Asuming things were done within the guide lines of hand loading and the guns in good condition I would think it is a primer problem. I use a Lee hand primer often and in no way can I exert enough force to deform the brass.

 

[vulcandeathbuny]

they view completely out the primer pocket. a few ended up in the magazine and one got hung up behind the extractor. and thefollowing round would not chamber properly. had to put in the magazine and pull the charging handle back. the OAl was correct. so is that causes by high or low pressure . one more thing, the primer once retrieved looked fine