xXxplosive
Member
Will somebody please check Issaac-1 for a wine bottle.....
Sound Good Gun Laws you would support?
- Thread starter Isaac-1
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The school in Sandy Hook blatently did not provide protection for the children and as a result they were harmed. So where did the blame go? On the gun.
If there had been proper security at the school (inside & out) maybe the shooter would've never been able to do the damage he did.
For some reason, they feel it's always easier to blame the gun.
If there had been proper security at the school (inside & out) maybe the shooter would've never been able to do the damage he did.
For some reason, they feel it's always easier to blame the gun.
Pointshoot
Member
The politicians and bureaucrats working in government do not grant the People their God given inalienable rights which are recognized by the US Constitution. The American people grant limited authority to conduct our affairs in certain areas to some in government. And, the people can withdraw that limited authority from them.
People need to spend less time watching t.v. and more time learning about the history of their country and the nature of a Constitutional Republic. Since they have ignored these subjects for over 50 years in the 'schools', you'll have to show initiative and educate yourself.
If we understood this, we wouldnt feel the need to come to those whose salaries we pay in government, for permission to exercise our own rights.
People need to spend less time watching t.v. and more time learning about the history of their country and the nature of a Constitutional Republic. Since they have ignored these subjects for over 50 years in the 'schools', you'll have to show initiative and educate yourself.
If we understood this, we wouldnt feel the need to come to those whose salaries we pay in government, for permission to exercise our own rights.
All one has to do is to look at the services provided by the NRA, e.g., firearms training, youth programs, competitions, law enforcement services, etc. to understand the diligence to and respect of lethal weapons given by this organization. Therefore, what you are suggesting is already being done.
The anti-gun establishment’s mind is closed. Open dialogue with the fence sitters is needed. Most are apathetic to guns and only tune in when a crisis occurs. That’s why the left has an edge; exploiting a crisis for the maximum emotional gain.
Throwing the fence sitters a bone in the form of new gun laws is not the answer; education is. However, we don’t have a charismatic leader, the power of the presidential pulpit, or the unbiased support of the media.
The best we can do at this point is to continue to pressure our representatives to protect our 2A rights and to slowly chip away the negative connotations that guns are bad.
The anti-gun establishment’s mind is closed. Open dialogue with the fence sitters is needed. Most are apathetic to guns and only tune in when a crisis occurs. That’s why the left has an edge; exploiting a crisis for the maximum emotional gain.
Throwing the fence sitters a bone in the form of new gun laws is not the answer; education is. However, we don’t have a charismatic leader, the power of the presidential pulpit, or the unbiased support of the media.
The best we can do at this point is to continue to pressure our representatives to protect our 2A rights and to slowly chip away the negative connotations that guns are bad.
we are not amused
Member
My view of reasonable compromise is that we repeal only half the gun laws, and make buying guns and ammunition tax deductible.
jcwit
member
Lots and lots of ridiculous ideas and suggestions on both sides.
Lupinus
Member
A law repealing all previous federal firearms regulation and preventing further firearms regulation.
Happy?
WHY ARE WE FOCUSING ON HOW WE CAN SCREW OURSELVES SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO?
Happy?
WHY ARE WE FOCUSING ON HOW WE CAN SCREW OURSELVES SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO?
hogshead
Member
Purging the gun owners ranks of anyone who would consider any compromise would be a good start.
Isaac-1
Member
Well I guess this thread has turned mostly pointless, it was my hope that we might come up with some sound good gun laws, ones that might even be helpful in some way, but instead this thread has been mostly filled with the usual rants, and calls for impeaching elected officials. I feel extremist views like having guns available in vending machines hurt our chances to keep or even regain some of our 2a rights. My suggestion for a hotline that private party sellers can call has been attacked as guilty until proven innocent, I don't see it that way NICS is already here, I see it as allowing people to be responsible gun sellers. Would you want to be the guy that sold a gun to that normal looking guy that just had a restraining order sworn out against him before he goes and shoots his wife and kids? Or would you prefer the option of calling a safe NICS hotline with his name and SSN and get him "cleared" just in case first, really that is all it would take Name and SSN, yes/no (maybe even allow the No SSN, but add more info, no tracking of seller, just a simple can this guy legally buy a gun?) Will it stop the guy from getting a gun, probably not, but at least I would not loose sleep over knowing I was the guy that supplied the gun. The point here being ability to access a NICS check without involving an FFL, and their fees.
Lupinus
Member
It didn't turn pointless, it started pointless.
The very premiss that we should sit around thinking what rights we will gladly give up, what idiotic and useless laws and restrictions we will gladly impose on ourselves, is pointless.
Screw that. And screw offering ANYTHING to them on a silver platter.
How about instead of wasting energy rolling over and pissing ourselves like a skittish puppy, we move the discussion towards actual solutions to the actual problems? How about we put energy into getting more of our rights back?
The very premiss that we should sit around thinking what rights we will gladly give up, what idiotic and useless laws and restrictions we will gladly impose on ourselves, is pointless.
Screw that. And screw offering ANYTHING to them on a silver platter.
How about instead of wasting energy rolling over and pissing ourselves like a skittish puppy, we move the discussion towards actual solutions to the actual problems? How about we put energy into getting more of our rights back?
Isaac-1
Member
From the start I said ideas for Law that would not infringe on our 2a rights
Lupinus
Member
They perhaps you shouldn't advocate such.
No more likely than selling your car to a drunk that went out and killed a mother and four kids running a red light. What part of "Will not be infringed." is it that you do not grasp. No matter what you concede it will never be enough until it becomes a total ban. The left won't stop bitching about health care until they have a single payer government provided system.
Well said. I'm not interested in a "feel good" attempt at appeasement. How about instead of appeasement (because it's not compromise), we spend our time educating others about how utterly useless gun control laws are? By the way, how about asking some of our New York members how "common sense, compromise, etc" worked out for them?
Isaac-1
Member
Ok, last message and then I am done with this thread, I am not suggesting Compromise, compromise is partly agreeing with the Anti's I suggested laws that would not be compromises, but could be sold to the public as feel good laws. Nothing here stops us from educating the public, or working on improving things otherwise.
As to the point about the drunk, no it is more like asking the guy that you think may be drunk of taking a breathalizer test before driving off in the car your about to sell him.
As to the point about the drunk, no it is more like asking the guy that you think may be drunk of taking a breathalizer test before driving off in the car your about to sell him.
Lupinus
Member
Maybe we should worry about educating the general public or making them feel good with meaningful things that don't infringe on our rights?
Noooooo, can't do that. We want to be liked!
Noooooo, can't do that. We want to be liked!
ApacheCoTodd
member
Stronger - much stronger penalties for the commission of a crime already on the books when committed with a firearm in the possession of the criminal. Or - a zero tolerance sentencing requirement.
chipcom
member
Here's my reasonable law:
Those proposing laws to give away our rights should be shot into space.
Those proposing laws to give away our rights should be shot into space.
Pointshoot
Member
+ 1
As for charges of 'extremism' - - -
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice." - - - -
As for charges of 'extremism' - - -
"Extremism in the defense of Liberty is no vice." - - - -
gunsandreligion
Member
Feel good laws that waste millions of dollars? What kind of idea is that? We are so screwing ourselves with debt and government spending already. Feel good laws are all laws banning firearms. We arent only fighting the degradement and abolishment of our constitution, we are stopping worthless spending that will restrict without stopping crime. If gun owners had any reason to believe that bans would help crime, we would support "reasonable restrictions". However, ignoring history, crime rates, other countries, and common sense in a effort to make others feel good is stupid and dangerous.
I know how you're thinking.... You've got a bag filled with a Million Dollars and there's a gang of people chasing after you. So, you think... I'll throw away a couple $100. bills to throw them off.
But the problem is, they will come after you again because they now know that they can always get you to throw them a bone.
We're not going to pay off anyone for the use of our God-given rights. The Govt. has No Right to infringe upon them in the first place.
But the problem is, they will come after you again because they now know that they can always get you to throw them a bone.
We're not going to pay off anyone for the use of our God-given rights. The Govt. has No Right to infringe upon them in the first place.
22-rimfire
Member
The thread is pointless here at this time. Wait until the legislation is submitted to both houses of Congress and we go from there.
I am not an unreasonable person, but to volunteer infringements at this point is ridiculous. As I recall Issac, you have posted similar things in the past and probably got the same reaction.
You mentioned selling a drunk a car.... I would. I would not encourage him to drive it until he was sober however.
Let's just move forward and see what develops. It is entirely possible that no bills will pass in both houses of Congress and this is a lot of wasted "compromise" talk.
I am not an unreasonable person, but to volunteer infringements at this point is ridiculous. As I recall Issac, you have posted similar things in the past and probably got the same reaction.
You mentioned selling a drunk a car.... I would. I would not encourage him to drive it until he was sober however.
Let's just move forward and see what develops. It is entirely possible that no bills will pass in both houses of Congress and this is a lot of wasted "compromise" talk.
Isaac-1
Member
Ok, I know I said I was done with this, but I don't see what part of "IDEAS FOR GUN LAWS THAT DON'T INFRINGE OUR 2A RIGHTS" are INFRINGEMENTS?
Lupinus
Member
Oh, I don't know, that your proposal would infringe on our rights?
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