Starting to have doubts about the NRA.

[DerringerUser]

I've just been thinking, the NRA usually donates the the Repub party right? But, I've just been thinking, I know they're trying to protect our 2A rights, but they're practically trashing all the others by donating to the repubs. Now, i believe that all of our rights should be cherished. Not just the handpicked ones. That is why i wish the NRA and the ACLU would become affiliated with each other, or at least the ACLU become active in protecting the 2A. Now, i know the 2A is one of our most important rights, but with this idiot in power right now, im starting to think there is a much bigger picture.


So, heres my problem: I would like to protect the 2A as much as i can, but i also want to protect all other rights. If i stop donating the the NRA and start to the ACLU, then i will not be supporting the 2A, but if i keep donating to the NRA, they are giving the money to the very people who trash all of our other rights. I really don't know what to do, can someone help?

 

[ArmedBear]

to the very people who trash all of our other rights

Well, you could start by listing your rights that have been trashed by the Republicans. Just because the Democrat campaign machine keeps repeating this doesn't make it so.

(DailyKos is not a good source, BTW -- use your OWN judgment)

 

[tcgeol]

When the Democrats become a party known for protecting the Second Amendment, the NRA might be major supporters. That is like complaining because NARAL doesn't support the GOP.

So, heres my problem: I would like to protect the 2A as much as i can, but i also want to protect all other rights. If i stop donating the the NRA and start to the ACLU, then i will not be supporting the 2A, but if i keep donating to the NRA, they are giving the money to the very people who trash all of our other rights. I really don't know what to do, can someone help?

I am getting sick of seeing this. Now, I have my share of complaints about the Republican party, but I want solid evidence of this. If you can name several real Constitutional rights that the Republicans are trashing, let me know, because I honestly want to see them. Otherwise, this is ridiculous.

 

[Outlaws]

Being that I am a registered Republican, I can say this without bias....

The Republicans are just as bad as the Democrates....just on different issues. Also, most people on both sides will bash the crap out of the other side, but then refuse ot acknowledge that there is even the slightest problem with their party and policies.

EDIT:
In response to ArmedBear and tcgeol,
Bush can obtain a warrent after the wiretap, but he doesn't want to. Time is not a factor since he is given the bennifit of the doubt and allow the tap first.

 

[Technosavant]

The NRA has a very narrow focus: they are about the 2A, and only the 2A. Complaining about them not backing other rights is like complaining that a little econobox car for commuting that gets great mileage won't tow a camping trailer- completely different purpose for existing.

The ACLU, meanwhile, won't defend the 2A because they know most of their membership chooses to ignore that particular civil right, but to fight against it would be obviously inconsistent (instead of being subtly so, as they are now).

The NRA does support some Democrats, where they are supporters of the 2A. The fact that they do not support most Democrats ought to tell you something about the Democrats' support for firearms rights in general.

 

[Outlaws]

I never said Clinton was okay doing it just for the record, but two wrongs don't make a right....as much as politcal talk shows would like us to think...err...not notice in all the bickering.

 

[ArmedBear]

Also, most people on both sides will bash the crap out of the other side, but then refuse ot acknowledge that there is even the slightest problem with their party and policies.

All that may be true.

Still, before making a big decision, it's good to get your facts down in detail, not just go on truisms from biased sources (not to mention utter freaks) on either side.

 

[1911Tuner]

Politics

On politicians: (Don't recall who wrote it)

"They may promise to govern well...but they mean to govern.
They may promise to be good masters...but they mean to be masters."

 

[ArmedBear]

two wrongs don't make a right.

True, also.

However, if you're going to base your vote on wiretapping, it's good not to be deluded about either side.

 

[GoRon]

If I were you I would abandon Republicans and the NRA.

Give money to the ACLU also.

Then you will deserve what you get.

Hope you like the disarmed socialist utopia that follows.

 

[Sturmabteilung]

Didn't the NRA recently give ron paul a B rating? http://www.shanesklar.com/news_DETAILS.php?news_ID=53

Regarding the wiretapping the president said he has the authority to do that. i didnt see that written in the constitution though. Bill clinton did something similiar when he was the president, remember ECHELON? If you think phone lines are the only thing they are "tapping" you'd be wrong.http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,70992,00.html

 

[buzz_knox]

The ACLU is exceedingly unlikely to ever support the 2nd Amendment. According to their published statement, they decided that they did not like the results of citizens bearing arms, and so decided the right to do so did not exist. That's the same type of argument they attack when applied to any other right.

The NRA may not be perfect, but if you have any interest in preserving the RKBA, they are one of the only games in town.

 

[outofbattery]

The ACLU's official position is that there is no individial RKBA.If you wish to support that line of thinking,feel free to support them but I happen to disagree with their interpretation of the 2nd Ammendment.

 

[DerringerUser]

Well, you could start by listing your rights that have been trashed by the Republicans. Just because the Democrat campaign machine keeps repeating this doesn't make it so.

Well, we can start with habeas corpus down the drain.

 

[DerringerUser]

The Republicans are just as bad as the Democrates....just on different issues. Also, most people on both sides will bash the crap out of the other side, but then refuse ot acknowledge that there is even the slightest problem with their party and policies.

I agree, but i do think Dems are the lesser of 2 evils. I dont like to vote for them for the very reason of gun control though.

If I were you I would abandon Republicans and the NRA.

Give money to the ACLU also.

Then you will deserve what you get.

Hope you like the disarmed socialist utopia that follows.

Im starting to smell a muslim genocide coming if we keep these guys in power. If I keep donating to the NRA im also fearing a nuclear war before i can even enjoy my new rights to bear arms. For the record, i'd choose a socialist society over radiation poisoning or death.

The ACLU is exceedingly unlikely to ever support the 2nd Amendment. According to their published statement, they decided that they did not like the results of citizens bearing arms, and so decided the right to do so did not exist. That's the same type of argument they attack when applied to any other right.

The NRA may not be perfect, but if you have any interest in preserving the RKBA, they are one of the only games in town.

Thats why the ACLU frustrates me. The same logic can be applied to all of the other amendmants, therefore we have no rights with that kind of thinking.

 

[PirateJoe]

Well, you could start by listing your rights that have been trashed by the Republicans. Just because the Democrat campaign machine keeps repeating this doesn't make it so.

are you kidding me? where, oh where, do i start?

lets see, there's the patriot act (warrantless arrests and searches, phone tapping), the military commissions act, suspension of habeus corpus, we're not allowed to leave the country without government approval, approval of torture.

well that makes the 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th, and 10th amendments rendered obsolete by republicans or under republican watch. one could argue parts of the 1st amendment, and the 2nd amendment (though thats more the Democrat's domain).

 

[Stauffenberg]

I'm the first to stand up and tell Democrats to knock it off with their silly conspiracy theories. But, regardless of ideology - wiretapping 5000 Americans in total secrecy with no court order of any kind is a felony violation of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, and he needs to answer for it. His claim that it falls under the AUMF is ludicrous - they asked Daschle for that power in the initial negotiations, and Daschle said it wouldn't pass, so the Repubs took it out. And then they went and did it anyway.

Lose your party lines, guys. This is America. The law is the only king here.

 

[Lone_Gunman]

The Campaign Finance Reform Act absolutely infringes on the First Amendment.

 

[Steve Wynn]

I don't think it's fair to portray the NRA as supporting the Republican party. They support the politicians that support the NRA's stand on firearms legislation...it's just that the majority of the pro gun people are Republican. In Ohio we both Dems and Reps endorsed by the NRA for today's election. If you don't see a Dem endorsed by the NRA, it's because his or her opponent is rated better.

I would be great if we had 3 strong political parties, but in this year's election a vote for a third party is literally a vote for the Democrats, which means a very strong chance of putting in an anti gunner into a seat. We've got some Libertarians running again this year and there is absolutely no chance they'll get elected.

Steve

 

[RNB65]

The NRA is a single-issue organization: Firearms.

The Political Wing of the NRA (the NRA-ILA) does exactly THREE things --

1. It supports certain candidates who have a proven record of supporting gun rights by contributing to their campaign funds.
2. It delivers a solid block of voters for the candidates it endorses.
3. It tries to influence firearms related legislation introduced in Congress and statehouses.

And that' it. That's all it does. Take it or leave it, it's your choice.

 

[bouis]

Thats why the ACLU frustrates me. The same logic can be applied to all of the other amendmants, therefore we have no rights with that kind of thinking.

Precisely. The only proper interpretation of the Constitution is that it means what it says. The ACLU and other leftist organizations push for creative interpretations of plainly written words to forward their agendas.

Read the Constitution:

"no person shall be denied [liberty] without due process of law" does not mean abortion must be legal.

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated," does not mean warrantless wiretapping must be illegal.

"[Congress may] regulate Commerce . . . among the several States" does not mean that the federal government can make it a crime to grow wheat on your own property or build a machine gun.

Etc., etc.

Just because you believe that warrantless wiretapping should be illegal, or abortion should be legal, doesn't mean that it's okay to pretend that the Constitution requires it. Because that opens the door for some black-robed tyrant to conclude that "the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed" means... nothing. And don't think it will stop there.

 

[progunner1957]

The ACLU shows its true colors and they're not red, white & blue

The ACLU is exceedingly unlikely to ever support the 2nd Amendment. According to their published statement, they decided that they did not like the results of citizens bearing arms, and so decided the right to do so did not exist.

The result they didn't like was citizens having the ability and hardware to resist "ordered liberty" AKA socialism and the socialist utopia they envision.

However, they have gone to court in MA and stood up for NAMBLA - the North American Man Boy Love Association, which thinks it's really neat for grown adult males (not men) to sodomize underage boys (men don't sodomize little boys).

So ther you go: According to the ACLU, you have no right to arms and self defense, but an organization of degenerate child molesters has the right to sodomize underage boys.

I hope you'll understand if I decline to donate to this fine group of "freedom fighters."

 

[ETXhiker]

That is why i wish the NRA and the ACLU would become affiliated with each other, or at least the ACLU become active in protecting the 2A.

DerringerUser, you obviously have the mistaken impression that the ACLU is about defending civil liberties. In reality, they are about promoting leftist politics under the guise of defending someone's civil rights. They don't give a rat's backside about your right to keep and bear arms. If you appreciate the fact that we haven't lost the RKBA, thank the NRA.

 

[RNB65]

The only problem I have with the ACLU is their blatant hypocrisy. They claim to be the great defender of civil liberties for all Americans. But if you look closely at the information on their website, you'll see that they carefully cherry pick which liberties and constitutional amendments they are willing to defend. No doubt to fit their own political agenda.

 

[Mr.V.]

The NRA gets my $35 for all their hard work over the years, even though I think they largely ignore important and populous states such as California, New York, Illinois, etc where the our gun-rights are hemorrhaging.