Stopping cylinder 'Ringing' ?

[jstein650]

I've owned many revolvers. I've tried everything to reduce/eliminate the 'ringing' scratch from the cylinder stop. I've polished them to a mirror finish, yet I've never managed to eliminate, or much really reduce the ringing effect of the cylinder stop from scratching, permanently, the cylinder. Any secrets out there I'm missing?

 

[ColtPythonElite]

Never shoot them.

 

[jstein650]

My God... NOW I know... to think I've spent all these years in the dark...

 

[Jim K]

That is not quite enough. Not only never shoot them, but never operate them. Take a gun home from the store, wrap it in oiled cotton wool and store it in a locked box in a safe to which no one has the combination. Then it won't ever get that "ring".

Seriously, some guns, like S&W revolvers, are designed and made to have the cylinder stop drag. It does no harm except to remove blue in that area. Some other guns, like the old DA Colts, were timed to have the bolt (cylinder stop) drop in the leade, but the bolt springs are strong and will peen the leade. Even so, it would take centuries for the bolt to seriously wear the cylinder.

In any revolver that I know of, there is some marking of the cylinder from the cylinder stop. If the gun is timed so that the stop drops only when the notch is in the exact position, a rapidly turning cylinder will skip the stop or the rising bolt will be chipped or chip the edges of the notch, worse conditions than if the stop is allowed to drag and ride up into the notch via a leade.

Jim

 

[fastbolt]

In S&W DA revolvers the "ring" which runs between the cylinder stop notches is called a "stop track", and is caused by the ball of the cylinder stop rising and touching the cylinder as it rotates. It's normal and is inherent in the design when it's properly functioning.

 

[Kp321]

You can minimize the ring on a Smith by never rolling the cylinder by hand. When closing the cylinder, cock the hammer and lower it carefully rather than just rolling the cylinder to the next notch. Cocking the hammer will lower the cylinder stop for at least part of the rotation.

 

[Jim K]

Yes, on some guns very careful handling will minimize that "ring". But why would anyone spend a lot of time trying to reduce a slight amount of wear that does no detectable harm. I recall one poster who fired his 1911 type pistol and was so upset at seeing wear on the frame rails that he asked if he should return the gun to the factory for rebluing. Same thing.

If ordinary wear on a gun bothers folks, I cite my original reply about the safe and cotton wool.

Jim

 

[GRIZ22]

IIRC I saw on his website Grant Cunningham polished a ring on the cylinder of a GP100 to smooth the action as much as possible. Of course this made the ring much much obvious.

 

[5-SHOTS]

That is not quite enough. Not only never shoot them, but never operate them. Take a gun home from the store, wrap it in oiled cotton wool and store it in a locked box in a safe to which no one has the combination. Then it won't ever get that "ring".

Seriously, some guns, like S&W revolvers, are designed and made to have the cylinder stop drag. It does no harm except to remove blue in that area. Some other guns, like the old DA Colts, were timed to have the bolt (cylinder stop) drop in the leade, but the bolt springs are strong and will peen the leade. Even so, it would take centuries for the bolt to seriously wear the cylinder.

In any revolver that I know of, there is some marking of the cylinder from the cylinder stop. If the gun is timed so that the stop drops only when the notch is in the exact position, a rapidly turning cylinder will skip the stop or the rising bolt will be chipped or chip the edges of the notch, worse conditions than if the stop is allowed to drag and ride up into the notch via a leade.

Jim

Yes, on some guns very careful handling will minimize that "ring". But why would anyone spend a lot of time trying to reduce a slight amount of wear that does no detectable harm. I recall one poster who fired his 1911 type pistol and was so upset at seeing wear on the frame rails that he asked if he should return the gun to the factory for rebluing. Same thing.

If ordinary wear on a gun bothers folks, I cite my original reply about the safe and cotton wool.

Jim

Amen to that. I used to own three revolvers (see my signature) and all developed a nice ring because I handled them and fired them (and dry-fired them alot...). They were stainless steel revolvers.
I'm very surprised that my .22L.R. Weihrauch HW9 ST Target Trophy, which is blued, after 3600 rounds (and many many handling and dry-firing) barely shows that ring. It has a very resistant blueing, I have to admit.

 

[MartinS]

"Any secrets out there I'm missing?" Buy jewelry, leave the guns for us.

 

[Jim NE]

It's unavoidable.

With vintage guitars, old nitrocellulose lacquer finishes are desirable, but they crack a bit over time. Those cracks, if minor, are an indication that it's a real NC finish, and therefore don't devalue the instrument. That's how I would view that cylinder wear.

Smith and Wesson says in their new revolver literature that they test fire them at the factory, so it's likely you'll see a ring, regardless.

It's my experience, however, that some single actions don't get much of a ring. But they eventually will. And stainless revos will have rings that aren't as noticeable, if it bothers you that much. Good luck.

 

[CraigC]

Depends on what we're talking about. Reposted from another discussion:

"Firstly, SA's and DA's are different and I will address them separately.

SA's:
A traditional single action (basically anything but a Ruger New Model) that has a half cock notch 'should' be well-timed from the factory and not ring the cylinder. The bolt should rise into the leede, not before it. If it rises early, it should be fixed. Most new guns are properly timed and I do not own one that isn't. A traditional SA that is properly timed but has a ring has been mishandled. All one has to do to take care that your cylinder is never ringed is to never lower the hammer from the half cock notch. Doing so causes the bolt to rise between the leedes and then when the cylinder is turned, the bolt drags on it. Always draw the hammer all the way back to full cock before lowering it. Properly handling a single action will guarantee a lifetime of use without ringing the cylinder. 19 of my 26 single actions are traditional types and only a couple of those that I bought used have a cylinder ring, presumably from mishandling.

A Ruger New Model is designed for safety, ultimate reliability and ease of mass production. Very little of the hand fitting required for proper timing. So the bolt (latch in Ruger-speak) will always rise early to guarantee proper function. There is also the issue of no half cock notch. Since the loading gate releases the cylinder to rotate, you can close the gate at any location in the cylinder's rotation. So even if properly timed, you would have to make sure you always closed the gate with a bolt notch over the bolt. This can be fixed but most don't bother, even on expensive custom guns.

DA's:
DA's are subject to two rings. First is the timing ring. This ring is identical to the one SA's get due to poor timing. It is usually very wide and distinct. In my collection, only my newest S&W has this ring. A late model 629MG that, ironically, has been professionally tuned. The bolt rises about halfway between notches. The rest of my S&W's are properly timed and the bolt does not rise until it is over the leede.

Most Ruger's will have the heavy ring from an early rising bolt. I'm not familiar enough with Colt DA's to comment on them.

The second ring is usually quite faint and caused by closing the cylinder when the bolt is between notches and then rotating it to lock. One would have to take care to always close the cylinder with a bolt notch over the bolt and rotate it to that notch to prevent the ring. Most don't bother, including myself."


A traditional single action like this one should never ring the cylinder and it takes ZERO effort to accomplish this. Note that the bolt rises into the leede.



On New Model Rugers, it is unavoidable:

 

[deadeye dick]

The Ruger manual states that you should align the chamber with the barrel as much as possible before closing the loading gate to avoid that problem. Howie

 

[Rule3]

Are you guys talking about "turn lines"? never heard it as a "ring"?

If the gun is test fired at the factory you are bound to have a faint line on a brand new gun.

 

[evan price]

Long Long Ago a wise old revolver shooter (my dad), when I asked him about the ring and what to do about it, gave me this advice-
"Son, that just means you shoot it instead of looking at it."

So, if my desire would be to collect "Safe Queens" New In Box and zip-tie the hammer down and never do anything but look at them...yeah, I'd worry.
'Bout like those guys that spend tens of thousands of dollars restoring and modifying a street rod, but then trailer it to every show, never fire the motor, and just sit and look at it.
Useless art, nothing more.

 

[CraigC]

My traditional SA's do not have turn lines. They are also not safe queens. They are not babied. They are carried in the field, blooded and shot often. A turn line on a DA or New Model Ruger is a sign of use. A turn line on a traditional single action is not a sign of use, it is a sign of mishandling.

IMHO, turn lines on DA's are inevitable and I think that a great many revolver shooters only have DA's and ass-u-me that ALL revolvers are the same. They are not.

 

[RealGun]

You could get a MIM cylinder stop softer than the cylinder.

 

[jstein650]

Thanks guys for the responses.. and wisecracks I'm not gonna sweat it. Good info. I wasn't aware that the originals had a different bolt operation. (btw, them's purty CraigC!) There was one maker though - although it might have been a custom thing - where a stainless revolver was done in a slightly duller finish, but the the drag ling (I've always called it the 'ring') was polished bright, as were other areas, like the pins and screws. Made for a very handsome piece, and basically hid the ring line.

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

A turn line on a DA or New Model Ruger is a sign of use. A turn line on a traditional single action is not a sign of use, it is a sign of mishandling.

IMHO, turn lines on DA's are inevitable and I think that a great many revolver shooters only have DA's and ass-u-me that ALL revolvers are the same. They are not.

+1

 

[kvtcomdo]

Don't use it and you will accomplish your said goal.

If used it will ring; unavoidable as previously described.

 

[Jaymo]

On another forum, I have seen an old (1937, IIRC) letter from S&W to an FFL that addressed this very subject.
S&W told the dealer that you WANT it to have that ring, as it shows that the revolver is working as it was designed to work.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

I have seen several gunsmiths take enough off the bolt stop to eliminate this "problem". You don't have to take much off and as far as I could tell, it didn't affect positive lockup.

Personally on my revolvers I don't care.

 

[Jaymo]

I plan on being buried with mine, so I don't worry about it.

Just kidding. I'm going to be cremated.
Or, I'll be turned into Soylent Green, depending on how Obamacare works.

 

[rehorne]

Driftwood, Dadgummit you made me slobber all over me keyboard!! Em air sum Purdy Smith and Colts. drool drool drool

 

[Jaymo]

Driftwood, is that a post war 38/44 Outdoorsman in the fifth picture?