Suggestions Needed Target Accuracy Problem

[gonediesel]

Hey guys, newbie here needing some suggestions. I am having trouble with my shot accuracy. I am using a 10 inch bullseye target at varying distances and I continually hit the target in the 7 and 8 o'clock area. I hit in all rings from the bullseye to the most outer ring. I shoot a 100 rounds each shoot and I may have 1 or 2 holes in the target outside the 6 to 9 o'clock (lower left) area of the target. So I am very consistent with my inaccuracy. I shoot with a S&W SW9VE and a Glock 19 with the exact same result from both guns. So I figure my gun hold/grip or stance must be off. I am not sure of my stance since I just read about the various stances this morning. Today I am going to try a modified weaver stance (locking elbow on shooting hand with slight pull from other hand) since I believe I may have been using a regular weaver stance with too much pull force from my non-dominant (non-shooter) hand. So fire away with suggestions please. I have a CCW class this weekend and I really don't want to resort to aiming high and to the right to pass the test. GD

 

[Conqueror]

Assuming you are right-handed, 7-oclock shots are often a telltale sign of too much finger on the trigger, and too fast a trigger pull.

Only the very tip of your trigger finger should contact the trigger face - the portion under the fingernail. And when you pull the trigger, you should slowly squeeze it while maintaining a steady sight picture. Let the gun surprise you when it goes off - that's how slow to squeeze.

Once you're accustomed to this technique you can speed it up significantly, but remeber: Slow is smooth, and smooth is fast.

 

[gonediesel]

I have not left for the range yet....

...but have done a lot of reading on various forums. I should have read more earlier before posting as there is a lot of info regarding my problem. I did some reading and searching before but didn't know the proper terms to do more searching with. :banghead: "low and left" will pull up a bunch of good articles and threads. I have a list of items I will look at and try when I get to the range. I have a house full of kids this week and been waiting for my wife and her sister to leave with the little ones so I can do some dry shots with the gun. What I have noticed are my trigger finger, grip and anticipation needs working. I grip the gun too tight prior to the shot and cause it to move slightly. Also, I caught myself having too much finger on the trigger. I have been practicing only placing the pad on the trigger and pulling slowly and evenly down on the trigger. I have read about two hours worth of threads and practiced a bit here at the desk. I will post my results when I get back.

edit to add, thanks conqueror for the reply, I mentioned the trigger issue above but firing to fast I don't think I do. I usually fire off 2-3 shots in about 10 sec and pull in the target to look at what I've done. One thing I don't understand while at the range are the people who fire off a whole clip in a few seconds. Someone does this every time I have been at the range. And each time it is amazing to see all the ceiling tile particles come flying down in several firing lanes of the range. I think they may hit only the target on the first shot and then all hell breaks loose. It pretty disturbing to see this each time I'm at the range.

 

[scythefwd]

gonediesle,
do you have adjustable sights on the guns? What distances are you shooting at? How fast are you shooting? Would putting a dayglow orange sticker in the 10 help you center your sight picture better? Are you shooting right handed with your left eye dominant or vice versa? Are you sure you are getting proper target reaquisition before sending more lead down range? Is there a lighter load you can shoot until you are more comfortable with your gun?

 

[CountGlockula]

Just be patient when the CCW class starts. Pay attention to EVERYTHING on what the instructor says.

 

[Conqueror]

I mentioned the trigger issue above but firing to fast I don't think I do. I usually fire off 2-3 shots in about 10 sec and pull in the target to look at what I've done.

You misunderstood my post. How many shots per second you shoot is not what I am talking about. I mean you are physically pulling the trigger too hard and too fast, and therefore jerking the gun off target. Even if you wait 5 seconds between shots, you can still yank the trigger too hard and throw your aim. You should be taking 2-3 seconds to actually pull the trigger from first motion to hammer drop. Squeeze it slowly and smoothly to the rear while focusing your vision on the front sight, and holding the front sight steady over the slightly fuzzy bullseye.

 

[gonediesel]

Back From The Range ...

.. and major improvement. Here is some info about me and my gun, I am left handed with some things and right with other. I shoot right handed. I don't seem to have a dominant eye but have been shooting with my right eye. My gun is a S&W SWVE with about an 8lb trigger. The sights are not adjustable as I can see. I don't believe the gun is out of sight. Other people have shot my gun and done fine with it. This is completely user error. As I have the same patterns with a Glock 19. So, I printed up 10 targets made by a David Mooney found in one of the threads I read earlier this morning;

http://home.comcast.net/~dave_in_delaware/Designs/CCxDPM-target02-2in-red-circle.pdf

If I had used his target prior to today I would have filled the "tightening fingers and jerking or slapping trigger" areas with bullet holes. After reading many threads regarding "low and Left" I made a list of things to observe while at the range. I fired off 150 rounds, 10 shots in each target. I shot at both 5 and 10 yards. At 5 yards I pretty much had 9/10 shots within 2.5 inches from center of bullseye. Several I blew the bullseye out. At 10 yards all shots were within 4 inches of center bullseye. My shots have tighten up quite a bit but looking at all the targets, 95% of all shots were ranged between the 6 and 12 o'clock position. There wasn't a single shot outside the bullseye on the right side between 12 and 6. So I still have some corrective issues to work out but I have reduced these issues quite a bit. What I did to correct my low and left issue, first I dry fired many times at home and then at the range trying to notice movements in the gun. What I noticed was what conqueror mentioned, to quick of trigger pull and subsequent jerking of the barrel. I also noticed that when I fire the gun, I would squeeze the grip with a death grip just before it fired. I read somewhere that when you make a fist and squeeze tightly your ring finger and pinky finger will move inward causing the gun to move. I also corrected my stance, using a modified weaver stance. I lock the shooting arm while giving a slight opposing force with my opposite hand to steady the gun. While shooting live rounds I pulled the trigger slowly, using only the end of my finger, focusing my eye on the far sight on the barrel, and finally keeping my grip firm but not trying to crush the gun. I did this while trying to only focus on the sight and not think or worry about the firing. One thing I noticed today that I never notice with the 500+ rounds shot from this gun, it is not smooth and I can feel 2 clicks before the gun fires. Before I would just pull the trigger and not notice the trigger feel or movements. I have decided that I may take my gun in to a gunsmith to have the trigger worked a bit to reduce the heaviness and see if it can be made to have a smooth pull. Thanks for the replies and any other comments would be appreciated. GD

Here are a few links to threads I read that have provided me with some of the answers to my low and left problem.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=197160

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/photo-gallery/22355-low-left.html

http://glockfaq.com/trigger.htm

http://www.alpharubicon.com/leo/pistoltrainingtg.htm

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/general-hs2k-sa-xd-talk/45847-shooting-low-left.html

 

[gonediesel]

CCW Test Passed

Well, I passed the CCW accuracy test 10/10. I bought a box of snap caps to help continue working on my accuracy. So, thanks to the THR members for the info found on the site. GD

 

[The Bushmaster]

7:00 is slapping or jerking the trigger. 9:00 is too much trigger finger...

Congrats on passing the CCW....