T/C Encore, Contenders, G2s..Confused

[gfanikf]

Hey,

I've always had an interested in the Thompson pistols chambered in wildly insane calibers...because the idea of a 30-06 pistol sounds pretty darn fun!

Now I'm kind of confused on what each product offers. I basically want something that has the strongest frame, though I guess it takes effort (or straight negligence) to blow up a T/C judging by the fact that there are loads specially and only developed for them.

I've come to the conclusion that I often enjoy trying different calibers and the best thing to do is find a gun that is a modular as possible.

Now I am aware of the case law about the T/C, and if I'm remembering the ATF rule that came out of it is once a pistol always a pistol. However, once a rifle...it better stay a rifle without a tax stamp. I figure in that case the pistol frame is the best one to get, since you could add a rifle stock on it and go back and forth...I'm making a guess I of course wouldn't do that till I was a hundred percent sure.

Of course another idea is just buy H&R Handi Rifles (yes I know they're rifles vs pistols, but you can get them for under $300 out the door even ordering online).

 

[jakk280rem]

The Encore is what you want. It's basically a strengthened Contender, capable of handling 30-06, and bigger, class cartridges. The Contender and Gen 2 (G2) Contender are smaller, lighter frames capable of handling pistol and lower pressure rifle cartridges like 223 and 30-30. I'll let someone else explained the difference between the G1 and G2 Contender because I don't know.

 

[JFrame]

I'm hardly an expert, but I'll take a stab at the latter.

The G1 Contender requires you to break the action by squeezing the trigger guard/lever in order to re-cock the hammer every time the hammer is dropped. The G2 allows you to re-cock the hammer without pulling the guard/lever.

Also, the G1 has a set screw that allows you to adjust the lightness of the trigger pull. AFAIK, they dropped this screw on the G2.


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[JFrame]

Just an additional bit of info for the OP -- the grip configuration of the G2 Contender is different from the G1, so accessory stocks and grips designed for one model won't work for the other.

Also, you are correct about getting a pistol configuration versus a carbine T/C. If it originated as a pistol, you can swap between that configuration and carbine with no repercussions (provided all other restrictions for a long arm are met, i.e., the rifled barrel is longer than 16" with a shoulder stock).


.

 

[Random Discharge]

Ranked in strength, stongest to weakest:
Encore
G2 Contender
G1 Contender

The G2 can handle blackpowder, which is kind of cool, and has more steel in the sides of the frame to resist stretching. As noted: trigger not as cool as that on the G1 and the grips are different than the G1. The G1 and G2 can use the same barrels though.

A 44 Magnum is close to the limit of what a G1 can handle without the frame stretching on you (with high pressure loads). I sold my 44 magnum barrel and stick with 357 magnum. A 158gr 357 XTP on top of H110 or W296 is coming out of that 10" barrel around 1600 fps (there's no barrel to cylinder gap in these babies to slow down the loads!). That's enough for deer at the range I'm comfortable shooting a pistol. If I want more power and distance, I switch to my 30-30 barrel and plan on having some kind of rest. I've thought about getting a 357 Max barrel, but then I'd have another cartridge to load for...

It is an oversimplification, but the area of the cartridge head and the pressure of the cartridge have a lot to do with stress on the frame. Area*pressure = force on frame. It is easy to see why the 30-30 is a pussycat on the frame compared to the 44 magnum, and why the 357 at the same pressure as the 44 is not even close to a problem.

If it is a pistol you want, its hard to go wrong with the Contender over the Encore. If you seak insane hand held power (like torching off a 308 in a pistol!), the Contender will limit you.

 

[umc180gr]

Here is one in .30/06 flavor for your viewing pleasure

 

[pendennis]

Here is one in .30/06 flavor for your viewing pleasure

You're a better man than I, Gunga Din!!

 

[Hunterdad]

Here's a G1 in 30-30. Insanely accurate.

 

[gfanikf]

Thanks all! When I see a good bargain I'll grab a used encore!

 

[BullfrogKen]

The Contender will handle anything I'd ever want to shoot in a pistol - from the 30/30 and even 45/70! Anything more powerful and I'm shooting it in a rifle.

The Encore is a bit bigger and heavier. I always prefered the Contender.

 

[mooner]

I have a G1 Contender and have to agree that it is plenty for me. More so because of size than recoil. Put a 14" barrel on there and you have a seriously big pistol that is best off a rest. 30-30 recoil is similar to 44 mag out of an N Frame - stiff, but not punishing.

I had a 12" .223 with an integrated brake (essentially a 10.5" barrel) that had no recoil, but the muzzle blast from the short barrel and brake was awful. When the blast hit your face it felt like being punched in the nose - not nearly as bad as really being punched, but that is the closest sensation I could use to describe it.

 

[WCraven]

I bought a new one in 1993 so i guess it was a G 1.. but to say the limit is a 44 mag is not correct because it came with a 14" super bull in 35 Remington which is a very power round itself. i know it's the age old question which is better 44 mag or 35 Rem ,,

 

[Random Discharge]

...to say the limit is a 44 mag is not correct because it came with a 14" super bull in 35 Remington...

I agree. Which is why I stated:

A 44 Magnum is close to the limit of what a G1 can handle without the frame stretching on you (with high pressure loads).

And actually, among 35 Rem, 44 Mag and 30-30, the mighty 35 Rem is the kindest round to the frame based on the simple figure of merit force calculation I suggested. Base diameters in inches for these cartridges are 0.458, 0.457 and 0.422, respectively; SAAMI pressures in psi are 33,500, 36,000 and 42,000, respectively. Force=Area*Pressure = PI*DIA^2/4*PSI = 5519, 5905 and 5874 lbs for these rounds, respectively.

My concern was with 44 Mag rounds exceeding current SAAMI pressure guidelines. I've compared the force of high pressure 44 magnum rounds to rounds reported to cause frame stretch in G1 Contenders and decided they were too close for comfort on my G1 frame. I might think different if T/C still made G1 frames, but I'd like mine to last...

 

[BullfrogKen]

Well considering it'll take 45/70 - ouch! - and 35 Remington - the Contender frame will take anything I'm willing to shoot in it as a handgun. I have another set up in a carbine and I am fine not pushing it as high power rifle. Otherwise, I would have bought a high power rifle. I like the versatility a Contender frame gives me .

 

[Stevie-Ray]

The Contender was also produced in .357 Maximum, (SAAMI max, 40,000) and 7x30 Waters. (45,000) I agree that my .45-70 Govt. barrel is almost useless, due to it's horrendous recoil, even though it's a relatively low-pressure round. Given the pressure of the 7x30, one wonders why the Contender wasn't produced in .444 Marlin, as it's max pressure is at 42,000, though I know JD Jones produced that barrel for it. The G1 can use barrels that simply are too much in the way of recoil for my uses, so I guess I really will never have any use for an Encore. My .30-30 barrel is quite enjoyable and I'll stick to that.

 

[Random Discharge]

Yeah, I'm a big chicken for sure on 45-70. Anecdotal recoil reports have kept me from even trying one.

I've pared my barrels down to 22LR match (2x32 scope), 357 Mag (2x32 scope) and 30-30 (2-6x32 scope). I have been tempted to pick up a G2 frame to get a black powder barrel, but resisted.

With my 336 in 30-30, 357 revolver and 22LR Ruger Mk II pistol, I get more mileage out of these caliber selections for the Contender.