I may be headed toward a target revolver. Our local range pro shoots a 38 Special double action with a 6 inch or so barrel. He cuts business cards in half and I don’t think I’ve ever seen him miss. He’s also 80 years old. He has some custom grips but it looks like a S&W of some form or other. For a starter revolver in 38 Special, what is out there? Is used a good place to start? Are new revolvers as accurate as the older ones? Is another caliber advisable? I plan to reload whatever it is and already reload 38 Special and 357 Magnum for my Blackhawk. I have a feeling our pro had his longer than I’ve been alive.
Target Revolver Options
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NIGHTLORD40K
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Seems like you're leaning towards center fire?
S&W model 686, Colt King Cobra Target, or Ruger GP100 if you like full underlugs. You'll probably want to work up a target load using full length .357 cases if you go with one of these- but you'll still have the option of using full power defense loads if thats important to you.
If Magnums aren't a priority at all, you can't go wrong with a clean vintage .38 S&W M14. The Colt Officer's Model Match is a great old target gun too, but evaluating a used one is a bit more in-depth.
S&W model 686, Colt King Cobra Target, or Ruger GP100 if you like full underlugs. You'll probably want to work up a target load using full length .357 cases if you go with one of these- but you'll still have the option of using full power defense loads if thats important to you.
If Magnums aren't a priority at all, you can't go wrong with a clean vintage .38 S&W M14. The Colt Officer's Model Match is a great old target gun too, but evaluating a used one is a bit more in-depth.
Yes centerfire is where I’m headed. I want a cartridge I can reload. I have a 22 target pistol, though it’s not a revolver. I was leaning toward a dedicated 38 Special, but a 686 or GP100 do sound appealing. The full 357 Mag loads I have for my Blackhawk are accurate, but I’m only good for a dozen or so. Target loads would be in order. My Blackhawk doesn’t seem to like 38 Special loads and a double action would also be preferred. It shoots minimum loads of 357 Mag pretty well, but there is a no man’s land between 38 +P and even starting loads in a 357.
There is a local gun shop that regularly has some nice looking 38 Special revolvers. Price wise used guns would be preferred. My Blackhawk is used and shoots very well as long as a 357 Mag case is used. It single handedly made me a single action fan.
Find one of these:
for decades this was "the" target Revolver in NRA 2700 Bullseye Pistol.
The 32 S&W Long was, and is, an outstanding target round. I occasionally see someone with a Pardini auto pistol chambered in 32 S&W Long. Low recoil, tack driving round.
I talked to Phillip Hemphill about revolvers, Phillip was a ten times PPC champ and he shot a "K frame" Smith. I am sure he had a number of K frame Smiths. Never asked if he shot four inch or six inch, as I don't know the PPC game.
the bud who sold me this, said he fired 60,000 rounds of 38 Specials through it in PPC competition. The load was a 148 LSWC and 2.7 grains Bullseye, Federal primers.
These six inch L frames are very accurate and the under lug barrel really reduces felt recoil.
I don't shoot 38 Specials in this N frame, but it is a tank, and should suck up any 38 Special recoil.
You must have big hands to double action a N frame. I think the K frame S&W were the most common PPC pistols due to frame size. It is just easier to double action a K frame.
for decades this was "the" target Revolver in NRA 2700 Bullseye Pistol.
The 32 S&W Long was, and is, an outstanding target round. I occasionally see someone with a Pardini auto pistol chambered in 32 S&W Long. Low recoil, tack driving round.
I talked to Phillip Hemphill about revolvers, Phillip was a ten times PPC champ and he shot a "K frame" Smith. I am sure he had a number of K frame Smiths. Never asked if he shot four inch or six inch, as I don't know the PPC game.
the bud who sold me this, said he fired 60,000 rounds of 38 Specials through it in PPC competition. The load was a 148 LSWC and 2.7 grains Bullseye, Federal primers.
These six inch L frames are very accurate and the under lug barrel really reduces felt recoil.
I don't shoot 38 Specials in this N frame, but it is a tank, and should suck up any 38 Special recoil.
You must have big hands to double action a N frame. I think the K frame S&W were the most common PPC pistols due to frame size. It is just easier to double action a K frame.
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NIGHTLORD40K
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K32s are uber-rare and expensive.
It's slightly easier to find .32SWL J-frames. They did make some with square-butts and 3" barrels, but even then they are not common or cheap.
Colt also made a fair number of Police Positive Targets with longer barrels in .32 New Police (same as .32SWL), also not common or cheap.
Probably more practical to start with the .38/.357s, although Model 25s also have a strong target following in .45 ACP/ .45LC.
J-Bar
Member
S&W model 14, or its grandfather ( pre-1957) the K38 Masterpiece. Spend the money to get a good one, probably $1000 or so. Use 148 grain wadcutters over 2.7 grains of Bullseye.
Many have followed this path. No need to reinvent wheels. Or loads.
Whatever.
I'm 79, for what it's worth.
Many have followed this path. No need to reinvent wheels. Or loads.
Whatever.
I'm 79, for what it's worth.
ontarget
Member
I'll toss in another vote for the K38/Model 14 S&W. And then find a K22/Model 17 22lr as an understudy. Both excellent options.
halfmoonclip
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It's my impression that the .32s are almighty tough to come by. (A late buddy had one; he had a squib on rapid fire, and put the other four in the bore behind it. He never found a replacement, or even a replacement barrel) You're better served with a .38. Wadcutters are how most of us started out handloading, at least those of us who are well seasoned.
You've had great advice about possible choices; a 6" K-frame is an excellent choice. If you want a little more weight, a 6" L frame will work.
Back in the day (again, the seasoned thing), we shot K-38s, and loved the excellent S&W single action triggers. Even current Smiths should have great single action. If not, there isn't much to cleaning it up.
Those revos ruled the roost until the M52 Smith auto came along, or else guys just shot their 1911 with target loads.
Moon
Pat Riot
Contributing Member
This ^^^^ is very good advice.
I have a model 19-4 with a 6” barrel that excels shooting .38 Spl Wadcutter loads. It likes J-Bar’s load and a load I like using a 148 grain HBWC over 2.6 grains of Winchester 244 powder. Cleanest powder I have ever used and it’s made for .38s and 9mm loads.
My shorter barreled .38s like 2.8 grains of Bullseye under a 148 grain HBWC.
If you’re interested, I’ve got a K-22 AND a K-38 I’m kicking around selling. Both are shooter grade without box or original grips, but both shoot very well. Matter of fact, the K-22 was tuned by Grant Cunningham some years ago, so it’s even a sweeter shooter than when it was original (I’m traveling at the moment, so if interested, lemme know, but be patient).
Whatever you decide, I’d go with something with a Patridge front sight. That red ramp you often see is a Jack-of-all-trades, but not great for anything. IMO, it’s particularly bad for fine target work.
Frulk
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Ask your pro what he's shooting...could be a Dan Wesson. From your comments it sure sounds like one.
WestKentucky
Member
Vintage smiths don’t necessarily shoot better than modern ones do, but people prefer them over modern guns. My 10-6 in 38spl is as accurate as any other gun I own, despite its fixed sight and 4” barrel. It’s also ugly as sin but has an action that is absolutely amazing in both single or double action.
The suggestion of 32 long is also a well respected cartridge but it was always a bit behind the 38sw and by the time 38spl came around it got left in the dust. The 32swl guns are not necessarily expensive, but the good ones aren’t cheap. One with an adjustable sight might run well past a grand, even in other makes. My 30-1 is a J frame gutter sight 3” gun and is amazing when I do my part. I hold the gun and when I hear a pop something has a hole in it, very close to dead center. It’s one of those guns I don’t know when I’m shooting, it just happens at the right time kinda situations.
Now, on to others… as in other brands. There are a few choices, most of which you can rule out as a target gun just by thinking about the purpose behind the company as a whole. Charter for example makes a serviceable pocket gun, but they focused on small and light rather than durable or accurate. Fine for the product that they sell, but not what you want here. NEF/H&R revolvers were made to serve as a cheap alternative to the big names in the wheelgun world. Again they are plenty serviceable, but not specifically intended to be accurate. The only budget gun I could in good conscience recommend is Taurus from the 80s and 90s. The newer ones seem rougher inside and they started having QC issues in the 2000s. Worth noting that most Taurus products are very close copies of the big names visually, and they were even owned by the same company as S&W for a while. The guns either work or they don’t, and the ones that work shoot well.
There was mention of a Ruger single action, which is also a very good platform. The guns are generally made to not only function but be accurate as well, especially the adjustable sight guns. There’s no shame in that single action game, but to be superbly accurate you would need the right version of the gun, not one more tailored to cowboy games.
Long and short, there’s a bazillion old k38s out there with price tags that start with a 3 or 4. Those will work. The ones with adjustable sights will cost more but they are preferred. Colt guns are just about as good but demand a premium price. Not worth the extra in my book. Buy a k38. Shoot wadcutters like suggested. Then buy a j-frame 32 and shoot wadcutters.
The suggestion of 32 long is also a well respected cartridge but it was always a bit behind the 38sw and by the time 38spl came around it got left in the dust. The 32swl guns are not necessarily expensive, but the good ones aren’t cheap. One with an adjustable sight might run well past a grand, even in other makes. My 30-1 is a J frame gutter sight 3” gun and is amazing when I do my part. I hold the gun and when I hear a pop something has a hole in it, very close to dead center. It’s one of those guns I don’t know when I’m shooting, it just happens at the right time kinda situations.
Now, on to others… as in other brands. There are a few choices, most of which you can rule out as a target gun just by thinking about the purpose behind the company as a whole. Charter for example makes a serviceable pocket gun, but they focused on small and light rather than durable or accurate. Fine for the product that they sell, but not what you want here. NEF/H&R revolvers were made to serve as a cheap alternative to the big names in the wheelgun world. Again they are plenty serviceable, but not specifically intended to be accurate. The only budget gun I could in good conscience recommend is Taurus from the 80s and 90s. The newer ones seem rougher inside and they started having QC issues in the 2000s. Worth noting that most Taurus products are very close copies of the big names visually, and they were even owned by the same company as S&W for a while. The guns either work or they don’t, and the ones that work shoot well.
There was mention of a Ruger single action, which is also a very good platform. The guns are generally made to not only function but be accurate as well, especially the adjustable sight guns. There’s no shame in that single action game, but to be superbly accurate you would need the right version of the gun, not one more tailored to cowboy games.
Long and short, there’s a bazillion old k38s out there with price tags that start with a 3 or 4. Those will work. The ones with adjustable sights will cost more but they are preferred. Colt guns are just about as good but demand a premium price. Not worth the extra in my book. Buy a k38. Shoot wadcutters like suggested. Then buy a j-frame 32 and shoot wadcutters.
A good centerfire revolver for target competition is going to cost you real money. S&W K-32 and Model 16-0 through -03 chambered in 32SWL will hit your pocket book for about $3000 or more. I'm not sure what the cost or target K-38's are going for for a about "box stock" Model 15 and Model 14's (38 Special) but they are more reasonable. But, they may be more for a "target" modified/tuned gun.
I recently bought a Manurhin MR32 Target reolver which set me back about $4K. They also have 38 Special target revolvers in the same price range. Single action only or DA.SA actions. My MR32 shoots great. A 32 SWL was on my bucket list and S&W K-32's were just too hard to find.
If you just want to play in the target game and are not worried about your performance, then any good 38 Special or 357 Magnum revolver shooting 38 Special target ammunition will do well.
If you are competitive like me that will not do and you will want/need better equipment.
I recently bought a Manurhin MR32 Target reolver which set me back about $4K. They also have 38 Special target revolvers in the same price range. Single action only or DA.SA actions. My MR32 shoots great. A 32 SWL was on my bucket list and S&W K-32's were just too hard to find.
If you just want to play in the target game and are not worried about your performance, then any good 38 Special or 357 Magnum revolver shooting 38 Special target ammunition will do well.
If you are competitive like me that will not do and you will want/need better equipment.
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CajunBass
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While any good 38/357 revolver will do the job (as well as a few semi's) I would start and end my search with a Smith and Wesson K-38/Model 14. They didn't call it "Masterpiece" for no reason. I do however admit that I'm a "Smith and Wesson guy" with a minor in Colt.
I started loading 38 wadcutters about 50 years ago using the standard 2.7 grains of Bullseye/148 grain wadcutter. I'm still loading that same load today, with the only concession being now I use plated bullets rather than plain lead. Indoor range rules you see. No reason to change, and I've never seen a 38/357 that didn't "like" it. Alas, I may be changing it soon. I'm about out of Bullseye, and haven't seen it for a while.
I started loading 38 wadcutters about 50 years ago using the standard 2.7 grains of Bullseye/148 grain wadcutter. I'm still loading that same load today, with the only concession being now I use plated bullets rather than plain lead. Indoor range rules you see. No reason to change, and I've never seen a 38/357 that didn't "like" it. Alas, I may be changing it soon. I'm about out of Bullseye, and haven't seen it for a while.
Pat Riot
Contributing Member
When I first got my model 19 I wanted to change the Patridge front sight out to a Baughman ramp sight or something with some color contrast. I am glad I never did. I have come to love that Patridge sight for target shooting.
halfmoonclip
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With my not-so-young eyes, a fiber optic is now my choice, especially in our badly lit indoor range. But Pat is correct; the cognoscenti among target shooters prefer the Patridge. It does show up well in silhouette.
BTW, the S&W single action beats any other trigger, and spoils you for anything else. It is so clean that you can nearly think the gun into discharging.
Moon
If looking for a specifically for a 38 Special I'd go with an older S&W model 14 or a Colt Officers Model Match. If going with a .357 I wouldn't hesitate to go new or used. There are lots of options out there. Actually tons of options if you start looking into all the various S&W frame sizes and newer offerings from Colt and even Kimber's 4" DASA target model wouldn't be a bad choice. One nice thing about the newer S&W offerings is that they are drilled and tapped so you can add a rail and mount a red dot easily. Good luck!
halfmoonclip
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Used revos are a crapshoot. I know what things to check, but sometimes still get snookered. A LNIB M67 had a factory trigger so light as to be downright dangerous; happily, it's not hard to fix.
I examined a M28 that an unhappy customer brought back at a local dealer; it really wasn't carrying up. Not sure how the dealer handled it. No one local can fit a new ratchet.
Moon
I examined a M28 that an unhappy customer brought back at a local dealer; it really wasn't carrying up. Not sure how the dealer handled it. No one local can fit a new ratchet.
Moon
Heh…gotcha beat - my S&W41 had an UltraDot attached, and it’s been a revelation, so I’ll likely skip the FO and go directly to the UltraDot for my target needs (though when it comes to “target needs”, it’s tough to beat the S&W41/UD I’ve already got
).Hmmm…Now that I think of it, depending on your age & eyes, a perfectly good option would be to buy a new S&W, red ramp and all, and install an UltraDot.
halfmoonclip
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I struggle with optic sights; they let me see my wobbles so much that it is disconcerting.Heh…gotcha beat - my S&W41 had an UltraDot attached, and it’s been a revelation, so I’ll likely skip the FO and go directly to the UltraDot for my target needs (though when it comes to “target needs”, it’s tough to beat the S&W41/UD I’ve already got
Moon
halfmoonclip
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