The Capital does again MD'rs

Status
Not open for further replies.

Norton

Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
2,718
Hundreds of guns from Severn shop end up in criminals' hands
By ERIC HARTLEY, Staff Writer
A Severn gun shop has sold hundreds of guns that ended up in the hands of criminals, a national firearm safety organization said.

On Target Inc. on Route 175 sold 224 guns that were used in crimes between 1996 and 2000, according to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms statistics cited by the organization.

Jim Kessler, policy director of Americans for Gun Safety, said On Target is one of 11 stores in Maryland with a large number of "crime guns" traced back to it.

On Target ranked ninth of the 11 stores in the state, with a Prince George's County store having sold nearly 900 crime guns, Mr. Kessler said.

Mr. Kessler said the 11 are among 120 stores or dealers - out of 80,000 in the United States - that sold about 15 percent of the guns used in crimes nationally.

Clarence Thomas, president of On Target, said his store has a large number of crime gun traces simply because it sells a lot of handguns. He said Americans for Gun Safety's report is misleading and unfair.



"That's like saying that one-third of the people killed by drunken driving were killed by automobiles made by General Motors," Mr. Thomas said. "That may be a true statement, but it's meaningless."

He said he believes On Target has never sold a gun improperly in 25 years in business, and said there is little that dealers can do that isn't done already to prevent guns from getting into criminals' hands.

Stores have no control over guns that are stolen or sold illegally on the street, he said.

Mr. Thomas also questioned the motives of Americans for Gun Safety.

"They have an agenda," he said. "They pretend they are for gun safety when in fact they are for gun abolition."

Mr. Kessler said he was not sure why so many guns from On Target ended up in the wrong hands. But he said many other stores don't aggressively enforce gun laws.

"They ignore obvious sales to people who are traffickers and straw buyers," Mr. Kessler said. "A person will come in and buy 20 handguns. No collector is going to buy 20 of the same gun. ...

"Criminals figure out where they can make a buy."

Mr. Kessler said some gun dealers put profits over public safety.

"Instead of being an ally to law enforcement, they're turning a blind eye," he said. "With some stores, their niche market is criminals."

On Target was sued after an Arnold woman was murdered in 1993 with a gun stolen from the store. The suit was thrown out, with the Court of Appeals ruling a store is not liable for what happens if someone steals guns from it.

Americans for Gun Safety urges the federal government to do more inspections of gun dealers and cite or shut down those in violation.

"I think that for the most part the laws that pertain to gun stores have been enforced so rarely that gun stores are really on the honor system," Mr. Kessler said. "And it's up to each individual store employee and their conscience to decide whether they're going to follow the letter or the spirit of the law."
 
This is absolute unadulterated poppy-cock. I can personally vouch that

I've seen the staff at On Target turn people away if they don't have their I.D. in order or their is some other problem related to the purchase of a firearm.

It's amazing that the Capital continues to follow this path....makes me ashamed to live in Annapolis.:cuss:
 
Agreed.

Having purchased firearms at On Target, I can say that they are the most professional and thorough of ANY gun shop I've purchased from.

What nobody in the media has the cajones to say is exactly WHERE the store is located and the store's immediate demographics.

It's located next to one of the county's poorest, and most violent housing projects. The housing project is so bad that the military won't let anybody stationed at Fort Meade take residence there. What does THAT tell you?

I feel the urge to make a purchase from On Target real soon to show my support.

It's convenient that the total number of guns sold was ommitted. What if the store sold 15,000 guns in a four year period? So 224 guns used in crimes would equal.....???...about 1.5% of all guns sold in a four year period?
 
And this Mr.Kessler is full of sh*t. You can't buy 20 guns at time in Maryland. It is already against the law. If On Target was selling people 20 guns at time they would have been shut down a long time ago.

Oh well. ignorance and bias tend to go hand in hand with the anti-gun viewpoint.
 
Crownvic: That depends on the type of gun and what kind of licensing you have. Unregulated Longarms? Feel free to buy that many at once if you have the money. Regulated firearms with MD collector status? Ditto.

And while I've never bought a gun from On Target I do have a membership there for the range so I may just have to renew that one to help em out.
 
If On Target is #9 who are the top 8?
What is a 'crime gun'? Is it like a 'gun crime'?
 
Mark Tyson:
If you fill out a 1-page form and send it in to the State Police you will be a "Designated Collector" and exempt from the one-gun-a-month law.

Kharn
 
quote:

"They ignore obvious sales to people who are traffickers
and straw buyers," Mr. Kessler said. "A person will come
in and buy 20 handguns. No collector is going to buy 20 of the same gun. ...

unquote

In otherwords, Kessler implies that after going through
and passing a rigorous background check, the collector's
intent is to buy guns and distribute them to criminals.
Would any of you be willing to risk losing your driver's license
and earn a prison sentence by buying a car and turning it over to a drunk?

Kessler offered no confirmed cases where a legal gun
owner and purchaser bought guns and then distributed
the guns to people who used the guns for criminal purposes.
 
Alright, that does it. My next purchase (maybe a Glock 17?) will be from On Target, I don't even care if it ends up costing a bit more.

Can someone let me know where it is?
 
Related story:
http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?S=1598056&nav=5D7iK9kJ


Posted: January 12, 2004 at 8:11 p.m.
WASHINGTON (AP) -- About one of every seven guns linked to American crimes or considered suspicious from 1996 through 2000 can be traced back to the same 120 gun stores, a gun safety group said Monday, urging the government to set up a watch list of irresponsible or corrupt gun dealers.

Of the 373,006 guns traced from crimes during the five-year period, 54,694 came from the 120 stores, according to data from the Bureau of Alcohol, Firearms, Tobacco and Explosives. The data, which surfaced in a lawsuit by the NAACP against gun manufacturers, was made public by the Washington-based Americans for Gun Safety Foundation.

The 120 stores -- located in 22 states -- made up less than 1 percent of the 80,000 individuals and stores licensed to sell guns during that period, said Jim Kessler, the group's policy director.

"There are a very tiny number of gun dealers who are associated with a huge number of crime guns in America," said Kessler, who wants a watch list of those merchants.

The National Rifle Association said any dealer breaking the law should be prosecuted but disagreed with the idea of a watch list. Chris Cox, the NRA's chief lobbyist, said government officials already have the tools they need to inspect gun stores at any time.

"This is only a gun control group trying to make themselves relevant in a debate in which they have nothing to say," said Cox. "The focus of the investigation should not be taken away from the person who committed the crime."

Kessler acknowledged there is nothing to indicate that the 120 stores sold the guns illegally or knew they were selling to criminals. He compared them to the liquor stores of his youth.

"There was the liquor store you could go to where it didn't matter how bad your fake ID was, and you could buy beer. And there was the liquor store where it didn't matter how good your fake ID was, you weren't going to buy any beer, and that's the way it is with gun stores," Kessler said.

The top three gun dealers on his list were Chuck's Guns in Riverdale, Ill., with 2,370 guns sold; Don's Guns & Galleries Inc. in Indianapolis, with 2,294; and Badger Outdoors Inc. in West Milwaukee, Wis., with 1,906.

Don Davis, owner of Don's Guns & Galleries, said his stores do state and federal background checks on everyone who buys. "If it's OK with the governor of this state and it's OK with President Bush, then what the hell can I do?" he said. Once the weapons leave the store, they can be sold repeatedly at gun shows with no background check, and that is probably what happened to the guns that came from his shops, he said.

"If I was doing something wrong or illegal, I wouldn't be in business," added Mick Beatovic, owner of Badger Outdoors Inc. "The ATF wouldn't allow it. The local police wouldn't allow it."

A message left at Chuck's Guns was not immediately returned.

The report was released at the beginning of an important year for gun legislation in Congress. The federal assault weapons ban is up for reauthorization and the Senate will probably consider legislation to immunize gun manufacturers and distributors from lawsuits arising from crimes in which guns were used.

First, Congress has to consider legislation that opponents say would keep information -- like that in the Americans for Gun Safety report -- from becoming public. Inside the $373 billion spending bill passed by the House and up for action in the Senate next week is a provision that would ban federal agencies like the ATF from making public any records kept by gun dealers or submitted by gun dealers to law enforcement.

Kessler's group wants that provision taken out of the spending bill. "When you have 120 gun stores -- one-tenth of 1 percent of the nation's gun stores -- associated with 15 percent of the crime guns and the public is not told about it, it's a travesty," he said.

Americans for Gun Safety, a gun control group founded and bankrolled by Monster.com billionaire Andrew McKelvey, got the ATF data from a lawsuit filed by the NAACP, which sued Browning Arms, Smith & Wesson, Glock and other major gun makers in 1999. The suit claimed gun manufacturers knew that corrupt dealers were supplying products to criminals in black and Hispanic neighborhoods but did nothing to stop it. The case was dismissed by a federal judge.

The report was limited to handguns and assault rifles, and dealers were limited to those with more than 200 suspicious traces by the ATF.

A gun is considered suspicious if it has an obliterated serial number; was recovered in a crime within three years of first being sold; was part of a multiple purchase in which more than one handgun was sold to one individual; was recovered in a state other than where it was bought; was one of several firearms recovered in a crime that was traced to the same buyer; was sold by a dealer who is habitually unhelpful to police in completing crime gun traces; or was traced back to a store that repeatedly reported firearm thefts.

------
 
I completely agree with all of what's been said so far. The folks at On Target are very professional and I find it extremely hard to believe that they'd do anything illegal. My family has had a membership to their range for the last 3 or 4 years and my father has purchased two guns from them. Both times they followed the letter of the law to a T and I've never witnessed any kind of misconduct by the staff there.
 
Greyhound: If you're familiar with the Ft. Meade area On Target is in a small plaza on the corner of 713/Rockenbach and 175. If you're not that familiar here's the address so you can plot your course better.

2618 Annapolis Road
Severn, MD 21144
 
Anapex-

Thanks, I have a general familiarity with Rt 175 and Anne Arundel County, and I'm sure a Mapquest search will do just fine.

I'll be sure to let them know why I came to their shop.

Normally a Continental Arms man but maybe I'll check out their range, too.
 
I think we all know that figures never lie, but liars figure. consider where this is, and then let us ask, "What is a "crime gun" by your evaluation?
Are they counting one found in a car in a restricted area? One in federal housing where it is not allowed? Any gun confiscated from a case in the bedroom when a domestic disturbance is investigated? Someone that bought one knowing he could not register it, that had it in his home and got caught?

Were these guns "used in a crime"? Or is it a case of these guns "were the crime"?

smoke and mirrors, I think we need more facts:confused:
 
On Target is one of the most professional gunshops in MD. I purchased my last two firearms from them and they are very thorough. They even have a paper that they make you sign for their own records after going over the operation and safe use of the firearm you purchased stating that they did go over everything with you.

A first class establishment, IMO.
 
The following would be a "crime" in Maryland: while on his way to the On Target range, a law-abiding gun owner transports his unloaded handgun locked in the trunk of his car, with the ammo locked in the front compartment. In route, he is pulled over by a law enforcement official for speeding. The officer requests the trunk of the car be opened and finds the gun. The officer demands to be shown papers or receipt of purchase validating that the driver is the actual owner of the gun. When the driver claims he is the owner of the gun but left the paperwork in his safe at home, the officer cites him for failure to show intention to drive to a shooting range for sporting purposes. The gun is confiscated by the LEO.
 
which is why many MDers are opposed to Project Exile

A police state could roadblock the exit to a gun range and find 1 out of 10 cars has a gun violation

a loaded magazine would be enough
 
I follow up from last post... Local news reported a correction last night that the report is flawed. LEO and ATF said the number of guns sold used in crimes is much much lower. AGS seems to have been caught in a lie by the ATF.
 
the officer cites him for failure to show intention to drive to a shooting range for sporting purposes.

This has been bothering me all day. How the heck can you prove you are on the way to the range? A signed, notarized statement saying that you intend to?:cuss:

Now I understand that on the way home you would have a receipt, but my God does anyone know if someone's guns have actually been seized because they couldn't prove they were going to the shooting range as opposed to on their way to knock off a 7-11? Good grief, just when I think it can't get worse here.....
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top