The demise of metal

[kokapelli]

Plastic has its place but the plastic guns will not be used when they are 100 years old like metal guns are. We will just throw 'em away and make new ones.

Oh no! I'm going to have to toss my plastic guns when they're a hundred years old!

 

[FIVETWOSEVEN]

Go shoot a cylinder of .40S&W from a S&W Scandium frame 310 Night Guard and then shoot a magazine full of .40 from a Glock 27.

Revolver > Semi in the recoil department with same calibers. At least in My experiance.

 

[HisSoldier]

I can't tell if the frame on it is metal or plastic - the grip sure is plastic.

It's 7075 T-6 aluminum if I remember correctly. Given the choice I'd choose plastic over aluminum myself, and an all steel gun is worth 20 plastic guns. We live in a world of dishonest manufacturers, so if you want the good ones to stay around buy their products, let them know you appreciate solid steel, that MIM is garbage, and you are willing to pay for quality.

 

[Manco]

Anyone notice what has happened to the Colt line?

Steel will likely continue to lose ground in this battle. Reinforced polymer will move into uppers soon enough.

Not that I will be buying them...

Well, I didn't say that the market for steel-framed pistols wouldn't continue to shrink.

 

[Roswell_Kid]

"Oh no! I'm going to have to toss my plastic guns when they're a hundred years old!"

A hundred years from now some boxes of detergent and cockroach poison might read "This environmentally-friendly packaging was made entirely of recycled Glocks."

 

[REAPER4206969]

Plastic has its place but the plastic guns will not be used when they are 100 years old like metal guns are. We will just throw 'em away and make new ones.

Polymer frames will far outlast metal under any practical condition.

 

[BBMW]

Nasty: You're right of course. (Hoorah-my USAF mileage is about the same)

As the 'youngsters' are saying about us old fogies, Those plastic made in China shoes don't rot or fail when submerged in mud, so get over it-save the cows.

The XD my son competed with was a fine gun, that I enjoyed shooting. He was winning with it locally on a regular basis. When he decided to shoot another 'class', I talked him into a quality 'steel' gun. He couldn't get over the improvement in muzzle flip, target acquisition speed and long range accuracy. He can't wipe the grin off his face.

I have no doubt that none of this discussion matters at all. The bottom line is money.

To your comments on the improvements in muzzle flip, et al, would this not be because the steel gun is just plain heavier? I can see this being an advantage for a competition gun. But for anything being carried, it's a severe disadvantage. And for a competition gun, maybe starting out with a lighter plastic gun, and giving it the ability to add weights in various places to tune it's overall weight and balance would be better.

Also, more to the entire thread, what drives the gun industry is the law enforcement and military markets. For these poly guns have several large advantages. Some of these have been mentioned (weight, corrosion resistance, etc). Also, poly guns seem to package better, so you can get more rounds a gun of the same size and lighter weight than an aluminum or, especially, steel framed gun. Also poly frames may have a wear advantage over aluminum frames. With aluminum, you have steel on aluminum friction. The aluminum is going to lose eventually. In a poly framed gun, the embedded rails can be steel, which will take the slide friction and can wear better than the aluminum rails on an aluminum frame.

 

[BushyGuy]

i am glad i have 2 all metal handguns, i think the polymer handguns are more comfortable for all day carry then the all metal ones.

i think the all metal ones are built to last for centuries!

 

[searcher451]

The bottom line, in my view, is that both have their place. I'm happy to own the polymer pistols that I have currently -- close to a dozen in all. But I'm delighted to own the metal pieces that are in my collection.

 

[meytind]

I wonder if this is how kids in the 50's felt when their parents mocked rock music.

 

[Nasty]

1SOW - Welcome Home!

I have an HS2000 (now known as the XD) and it's fine for what it is, but it is not like my 1944 Remington Rand. Change is life, eh?

 

[Ben86]

All metal guns are dying out a bit because of the market demands for more practicality.

But, just like revolvers never faded out, I don't think metal guns will. Metal guns have a certain aesthetic quality that cannot obtained with polymer guns. I have been feeling a little burnt out on polymer lately and have been trying to decide between getting my first 1911 or an AR-24.

 

[Mr.Davis]

You just can't make a plastic gun feel as good as a metal one. Fact.

Many people confuse opinion with fact. Fact.

 

[kokapelli]

Many people confuse opinion with fact. Fact.

And that's a fact!

 

[Youngster]

If it wasn't for polymer everyone would be by now making their frames out of cheap blocky aluminum investment castings ala Ruger.

 

[gwnorth]

No plastic in my safe - mostly stainless steel. A couple of alloy frames (CZ P-01 and SIG P226) but the only polymer pistol I've ever owned (an FNP 45) got traded for a S&W 65-3.

My main problem with polymer pistols is that most of the good ones are striker fired, and I just prefer not to own any striker fired weapons (I just like a hammer on the end of my slides).

When I peruse the cases at my favorite gun shops, I've never had any problem finding plenty of all metal guns to tempt me. Sure there are lots of plastic models available too, but it's not like there's a barren field of metal guns to pick from either.

 

[easyg]

Plastic has its place but the plastic guns will not be used when they are 100 years old like metal guns are.

Well, my Remington Nylon 66 is already over 40 years old, and it still shoots just fine.
I don't think that it's just going to self destruct sometime in the next 60 years.

The notion that polymer framed weapons will not last for 100 years is just silly.
Heck, I've been told that even flimsy plastic water bottles will take many centuries to degrade in our garbage landfills.

 

[Ben86]

Heck, I've been told that even flimsy plastic water bottles will take many centuries to degrade in our garbage landfills.

Very true, so military grade polymer should last a lifetime, even with heavy use.

 

[P97]

Youngster Posted: If it wasn't for polymer everyone would be by now making their frames out of cheap blocky aluminum investment castings ala Ruger.

I have several Polymer guns, and my favorite, and one that I choose for every day protection, just happens to be one that the Youngster was referring to here. I think there will always be some Companies, that will make the all metal gun, because there will be enough people prefer them, that there will always be a market for them. Plastic has its place, but so does Metal.

 

[easyg]

Plastic has its place, but so does Metal.

Of course metal has its place....

The barrel, the slide, the springs, the hammer, the striker, the bullets, the casings, the cylinder, the forcing cone, etc.....

 

[metalman8600]

The slide, barrel, striker/firing pin will always be made out of metal. There is no getting around that. So I don't see how switching only part of the firearm to plastic will change anything but weight. With a good coating process, steel will last forever. And it has more than twice the strength of polymer. Plus, all the polymer framed pistols I tried were striker fired. Polymer framed striker fired pistols just feel like they have a cheesy spongy feeling trigger. The only polymer frame pistol that felt good in my hand was the M&P, but the trigger was typical polymer feel.

 

[Prion]

Totally dude! It's like all country and pop now. So weak, man. Where have all my long-haired head-banging brethren gone? Sold out, man, gone corporate, got a wife and two kids. Not me man. I'll die rockin' out in my parents basement until I die! Hardcore metal man!!! Long live Sabbath, Ozzy is my savior!

Anyone got any spare Rogaine?

 

[ArmedBear]

There are different uses for pistols.

I don't think we'll be seeing new general-purpose designs in all-steel, or even aluminum/steel. New practical pistols for personal carry, law enforcement, etc. are all polymer-framed.

Target shooting for accuracy is utterly dominated by metal guns. For centerfire competition, the 1911 platform is almost the only one, or can seem so.

Aesthetics are another matter. Guns bought for aesthetic enjoyment are probably going to be all-steel for a long time, just as comparable rifles have figured walnut stocks.

 

[easyg]

With a good coating process, steel will last forever. And it has more than twice the strength of polymer.

It really depends upon how the pistol is maintained and how it is treated.
Both steel framed and polymer framed pistols will last for hundreds of years if they are cared for properly.
But when they are not cared for properly, the polymer frame actually has alot of advantages over the steel frame....
Impervious to rust, impervious to becoming magnetized, impervious to many corrosive chemicals that destroy metals, able to flex without damage upon heavy impacts, generally less effected by both fresh-water and salt-water....

Plus, all the polymer framed pistols I tried were striker fired. Polymer framed striker fired pistols just feel like they have a cheesy spongy feeling trigger. The only polymer frame pistol that felt good in my hand was the M&P, but the trigger was typical polymer feel.

Maybe you should try a hammer-fired polymer pistol.

 

[kokapelli]

Well I can see one advantage to steel pistols, driving nails when you can't find your hammer.