The DOD Surplus Brass Controversy - Fact v. Rumor

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No conspiracy from Obama.

I know that deflates a balloon or three, but here's more from one of the employees at Government Liquidations:

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=844248&page=12

The facts as I know them, which come directly from candid discussions with my CEO, indicate the following:

- Prior to 11/2008, Demil B items required no mutilation for sale to the public. That policy changed in November, but several exceptions were granted. Expended munitions brass was one of those given a waiver.
- Enter the new administration. Since Demil B category items had been given a broad, general label as "national security sensitive" someone above the DRMS (likely in the DLA) reviewed the policy and immediately went with a CYA policy and yanked all exemptions. No thoughts or considerations were given to the implications of this policy change, but this directive was issued to DOD Surplus effective immediately last week.
- S&$! storm blows up as a result. In particular, the letters, phone calls, and emails to our legislators, the media, and anyone else who would listen caused this policy to be review post haste.
- As of this morning our company was informed that expended munitions brass will now be reclassified as Demil Q –– which requires no mutilation unless sold to a foreign country.


There you have it. The policy change was simply the result of some n00b administrator attempting to close a perceived "national security" loophole and brass got caught up in the snare. There was no political motivation behind the policy change, but it is good that people like us were suspicious, got involved, and helped bring about a resolution.
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I would argue that a supply chain problem caused by the government is every shooter's concern, with the implications it has on the ammuntion industry.
And your concern is last night's ball game?
Good day to you sir.
I'm done.

ETA ".....In particular, the letters, phone calls, and emails to our legislators, the media, and anyone else who would listen caused this policy to be review post haste.
- As of this morning our company was informed that expended munitions brass will now be reclassified as Demil Q –– which requires no mutilation unless sold to a foreign country.


There you have it. The policy change was simply the result of some n00b administrator attempting to close a perceived "national security" loophole and brass got caught up in the snare. There was no political motivation behind the policy change, but it is good that people like us were suspicious, got involved, and helped bring about a resolution."

Big thank you to those concerned enough to react to this problem!
 
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Certainly smells like Victory.

Is there any definate word or possibility that Georgia Arms can continue thier work and all other people to calm down and savor this victory?

I think we should stay true to all things related to the 2A that matters, even the most boring supply issues.
 
I think we should stay true to all things related to the 2A that matters, even the most boring supply issues.
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It's always better to know the facts before you jump in and make accusations. There still aren't many facts available to us.
 
I wouldn't go so far as to call it a victory. It was a wronged turned right, certainly, but there wasn't much of a struggle.

Someone new in a position of power made a poor (snap) decision which was corrected - it happens all too often.
 
Why would I think something that is fixed to be a accusation. If I think that something is fixed due to the attention these last few days onto this situation, why yes it's a good outcome and one to be desired.

I never will know ALL the facts, I doubt that anyone will either except those who specifically work on that problem.

If I, as a US Citizen understand that there will be no problems with supply of Brass and can rely on a good amount of ammuntion for the near future of some years, why yes that is a wonderful thing.

No accusations anywhere.
 
I hope that Georgia Arms will be able to call everyone back to work soon and get back to running out the orders that are pending.
 
I wouldn't go so far as to call it a victory. It was a wronged turned right, certainly, but there wasn't much of a struggle.

Someone new in a position of power made a poor (snap) decision which was corrected - it happens all too often.
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I think it is definitely a victory. It is all too often that a poor snap decision is made and it wasn't corrected. I remember all the surplus guns the DOD destroyed during Clinton:

SMALL ARMS DESTROYED AS OF MARCH 15, 1994

M1911A1 Pistols--110,000 M14 Rifles Cal. 7.62 NATO--50,000 M1 Carbines--45,000 M1903A3 Drill Rifles--40,000 M1 Garands--30,000 M3.45 Cal. Submachine Guns--20,000 M1903-A3 Rifles--6,000 M12 (H&R 5200) Cal. .22 Rifles--6,000 Total destroyed--307,000 Total cost--$1,079,873

Source: Defense Logistics Agency, Defense Distribution Region East


Let's be glad we turned this one around and right quick.
 
Just received this email from Gov. Liquidation about the expended casings!

Directive was rescinded at 4:30 this afternoon, thanks to everyone







am sorry you hadn’t been informed –



Word came down that all shells 50 caliber or smaller CAN still be purchased without the mutilation requirement as long as kept in the US.



(As it was in limbo, I did not sent your EUC to Battle Creek until today, also why I have not contacted you for payment until today.)



Thanks!



Arana K. Wolin

Document Verification Supervisor

Government Liquidation, LLC

DOD Surplus, LLC

15051 N Kierland Blvd. #300

Scottsdale, AZ 85254

(480) 609-3306 direct telephone

(480) 596-4480 fax

[email protected]
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YAY FOR US!!
 
Aniumal Mother:
SMALL ARMS DESTROYED AS OF MARCH 15, 1994
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That is nothing, Clinton would destroy or force the sale to foriegn nations over 750,000 m14 rifles alone.
He did the same with most remianing garands in the armories.
He wanted to keep them from ever being sold to civilians through what is today the CMP. Just like garands have been for decades since WW2.

The M-14 or the civilian M1A is a fine rifle. The military reciever is even better than most, being made from a forged reciever.
It could easily be made semi auto only.
At the same time to support Clinton the ATF came along and made thier policy of once a machinegun always a machinegun just to quiet those who might argue.
He also kept the massive stockpile, literaly thousands upon thousands of 1911 pistols from ever going to civilians destroying most.


The great irony is that today the military is unable to get enough m14 rifles. Finding a great need for such rifles in Iraq and especialy Afghanistan.
They are purchasing any they can find from any foriegn location that was sold some previously. Unfortunately Clinton destroyed most of them and they cannot fill the need.
They military has been scrambling to purchase all things M14.
m14_dmr.jpg

Thanks alot Clinton.



Back on topic, it is great to see things accomplished. A slight change in policy can easily become permanent if time is allowed to elapse and the new policy becomes "normal".
 
woohoo!

only downside is all the brass auctions i was watching on GovtLiquidation are now gone...including a VERY doable one for me (less than 50 miles from home, and was a small enough quantity that it would've easily fit in my truck+small trailer).

:(
 
Jeff,

I only posted as fact the fact that I received that e-mail from Georgia Arms.
Lindsey Graham is my rep. I will try to contact his office tomorrow and see if I can get anymore facts.

Scott
 
Not to sound like the eternal pessimist, but this could have just been a trial balloon. Regardless, it's good to see it deflated.
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That is true, it might have been a test to see what reaction would be.

And thanks to the internet, the problem quickly became known, and was apparently fixed.

The internet is a very powerful tool to keep our 2nd Amendment (and other) rights safe. It is interesting to wonder whether or not the AWB would have been passed in 1994 if the internet had been as widespread then as it is now.
 
GEORGIA ARMS

"Dear Loyal Customers,

Thanks to your voice, DOD has rescinded the order to mutilate all spent cases as of 4:30 pm on 3/17/09. We appreciate the time and effort that you expended, together we all made a difference. We will be posting the email we received from DOD as well as any additional information within the next 12-16 hours. Thanks so much and lets get to work!!! Georgia Arms"
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Don't be confused.

They've just not been updated yet.

It took them 3 days to get the auctions changed to reflect the mutilation requirement.

Give them 15 minutes or so to switch the online auction verbage back. The reversal supposedly happened at 4:30 PM Government Liquidations, LLC time today... ;)
 
I hope that Georgia Arms will be able to call everyone back to work soon and get back to running out the orders that are pending.
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On GunTalk on Sunday (eons ago in this saga), Larry Hainey of Georgia Arms said he had enough stock on hand to keep his people busy for 2 -3 months, then layoffs would have to start. No one was laid off due to this . . . this time. :scrutiny:

P.S. Kudos to The Shootist. Nice job Gordon.
 
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It's always better to know the facts before you jump in and make accusations
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I would have to say that, in this case, the Moderator needs to practice what he preaches. In this thread, it appears that the OP was right in what he was saying - no matter how many times the argument was made that the sky was not falling!

While I would be the first to agree that gun owners as a group tend to be VERY paranoid about the current government, I would also contend that the current government has earned most of their reputation from past actions. It would be foolish on our part to classify EVERY rumor to totally without merit without having all the facts. (Now where did I put all of that surplus tin-foil I have been stockpiling for falling-sky occasions?)
 
I would have to say that, in this case, the Moderator needs to practice what he preaches.
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Indeed. But even worse was the Moderator's attempt, once the reality of the problem had become the 600 pound gorilla in the bedroom, to mitigate his bad call by calling it "a supply chain problem."

Every industry has to deal with supply chain problems. The supply chain problems of any industry are not on topic at THR.
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Sorry, but a supply chain problem is when someone you have a contract with unexpectedly can't fulfill the order, or perhaps there's a hurricane interrupting deliveries temporarily. It is not when the government changes the rules and prohibits the purchase of brass, all brass, for reselling. This was a 4-day full-out assault on the supply of remanufactured ammo. It apparently took some significant intervention by gun nuts (like us) and politicians to get it reversed, no matter what the original source of the problem was. This could have had significant effects on the cost and availability of all ammo, not just .223.

I understand not wanting to declare the sky is always falling. But in this case, the Pied Piper had the children halfway out of the town. :eek:
 
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