The Richard Reid shoe bomb simulation video.

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jimpeel

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Shades of the "Dateline NBC" Chevy truck scandal, Batman!

Play the video that is supplied at http://www.msnbc.com/news/861091.asp and see where Mr. Reid would have had to be sitting to achieve the effect that is shown. Now THAT'S economy class!

The fact is that this explosion was on the underbelly of the aircraft and is far more severe than the shoe bomber would have accomplished. The interviewee also states this.

I think we're being duped; although I wouldn't have wanted to be sitting next to Mr. Reid regardless of his position within or without the aircraft.

This plane survived much worse
243a.jpg
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That simulation was bogus. His shoe bomb(s) would have done a lot of damage, but nothing like what was depicted in that video.
This plane survived much worse
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That's Aloha flight 243 from back in 1988. That damage was caused by stress fractures in the fuselage. Aloha does a lot of takeoffs and landings, but because the intra-islands flights don't take much time, it threw off their maintenance/inspection schedule (they were calculated according to hours flown).

I believe that they do their inspections according to number of takeoffs and landings now.

I remember when I first saw those pictures. When I insisted that the damage wasn't caused by a bomb, all of my friends said I was nuts. Well, I am nuts, but a bomb would have created a more "round" hole. It was obvious to me that the damage occured in a more rectilinear fashion. Even fancy shape charges won't do that. Det cord...maybe.:scrutiny:
 
Yes, if he had managed to detonate the bomb it would have made a good sized hole, damaged systems or put enough FOD into the engines to bring down the aircraft.

The explosion on the aircraft shown appears to have been detonated in the baggage compartment near the skin, not in the cabin area. Also, the explosion appears to be MUCH larger than the "demo" of the shoe blowing up.

The whole thing reeks of propaganda designed to make the event look worse than it would be to the judge and jury.

A smaller explosion could/might have brought down the aircraft but the layman wouldn't have been "impressed" by a ragged hole in the side of the aircraft but blowing one in half? That's a different story.
 
Aloha Air movie

Did any of you see the made-for-TV movie about the Aloha Air flight? They used a remote control airplane for the flying sequences. I read about it in a R/C modellers magazine some years back. The R/C plane was enormous, having a 14 foot wingspan, and was powered by two chainsaw-sized engines turning ducted fans inside slightly out of scale (larger) engine nacelles. Quite impressive.

Also, it isn't the takeoffs and landings that were the cause of the Aloha Air disaster, but the related cabin pressurization cycles. The cabin air pressurization causes the skin of the aircraft to expand slightly, and this led to a metal fatigue situation over many repeated cycles that caused a fissure crack in the skin, then rupture of the cabin at altitude.
 
Also, it isn't the takeoffs and landings that were the cause of the Aloha Air disaster, but the related cabin pressurization cycles. The cabin air pressurization causes the skin of the aircraft to expand slightly, and this led to a metal fatigue situation over many repeated cycles that caused a fissure crack in the skin, then rupture of the cabin at altitude.
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Wow! :what:
 
I saw that movie when it was first made, and afterwards (I was quite young when it came out) I would always be looking for little "cracks" in the cealing of the plane. :what:
 
Jim March

Man, the guys flying that crippled Aloha bird were good, weren't they? Gettin' that thing down was just unreal.
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There's a lot to be said of the redundant systems that are built into every aircraft. that is why the "single bullet" theory is exactly that. I have worked on aircraft and there are systems that are built into the port and starboard sides that if one fails the other takes over. The hydraulics, cables, electrical, servos, etc. are all redundant.
 
Think Pressurized Cabin!

If that plane was at cruising altitude and the bomb went off, it could easily look like that video....I'm assuming that the cabin was pressurized for the demo, as it would have been at altitude, to show the effects if airborn. (Pressure differential, like a balloon pricked)

Or, just call me a dupe.

:D
 
Good point. A cabin running at cruising altitude pressure differential would have an effect on the explosion. However if the explosion was small not to cause immediate structural failure the hole created would equalize the cabin quite quickly.

Cabin pressurization is controlled by a valve(s) allowing air to escape at a given rate (close the valve and the pressure goes up, open it and it goes down). Dumping pressure in a cabin doesn't take but a few moments when that comparatively small valve is opened.

That still leaves the apparent point of origin of the explosion in the lower half of the fuselage, not the cabin floor.

Still have my tinfoil hat firmly in place on this one. :evil:
 
Few moments v. instantaneous can make quite a difference....Many years back in No. Va. a construction worker was killed while air-testing a new 15" sewer line. The line was plugged, pressurized to 3.5 psi, and gaged for pressure loss. For some unknown reason, the worker put his head down near the plug just as it let go, instantly killing him. It's hard to believe that only 3.5 psi could be so powerful, but if you do the math that little 15" plug had 600 lbs of force behind it.

If you tape the skin of an inflated ballon & prick it with a pin, you get a small hole that can vent the pressure safely and semi-quickly...Unreinforced, it's a catastrophic failure. I could easily see the damage portrayed in the video (YMMV), but your observation on the location is well taken.
 
One source, can't remember which but may have been FOX, stated that the video was made several years ago long before Reid attempted his idiocy.
 
Unreinforced, it's a catastrophic failure.
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Certainly you aren't suggesting that an airliner's fuselage is "unreinforced". They certainly aren't armored or designed to withstand large explosions, but the amount of explosives that Shoeless Joe Jihad (first heard on the Michael Medved show) had in his shoes wasn't enough to cause wide spead catastrophic failure.

That's not meant to mean that he couldn't have caused the plane to go down. God knows that it is nothing short of a miracle to keep those things flying in the first place. It's just that everything gets put into over-the-top Hollywood proportions these days.

They could have made a video showing the actual amount of likely damage, and asked the jurors or the judge or whomever they are trying to impress, "Which of you would have liked to have gotten sucked out the hole in the side of the plane?"

BTW The judge in the case just put the viscious death-cult nut away for 50 years. Here's hoping that he gets Jeff Dahmer's old bunky for a cell-mate. I'd really hate to have to feed that rat for 50 years. What he really needs is a dirt-nap.
 
Certainly you aren't suggesting that an airliner's fuselage is "unreinforced".

Forgive the haphazard use....While certainly reinforced for normal structural stress/strain, I don't think it's reinforced/designed for sudden explosion/holes punched in the side (as my better half would say, "you're s'posed to read my mind" :neener: ).

However, not being a aeronautical/airframe type, I'd certainly defer to others....


What he really needs is a dirt-nap.
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Absolutely! :D
 
Has anybody ever heard just how much explosive was in Reid's shoes?

From the early photos of the shoes after his arrest, I'd think there'd be a hole in the floor, into the cargo bay; messy, but survivable.

And they'd be calling him "Stumpy" Reid...

Art
 
I agree with Art. In another life, I played around some with explosives. The pictures on the TV of the shoes showed maybe a couple of ounces of semtex (RE equivalent of about a 1.42) with no detonator device. From what it looked like, dumb-a** was trying to light a fuse directly into the explosive. The charge would not have gone off without a detonator. Military explosives are extremely stable - hence the idiot being able to walk and stomp around in the shoes. Explosives take the route of least resistance so "stumpy-Rich" as he would be known to his friends would be put in the hurt locker but I doubt that what was shown would be enough to cut through the fuselage unless he tamped it by shoving his feet up against the window. The configuration of the explosive in the shoe looks like it would have blown forward towards the toes and not down through the heel.

Just my opinion.
 
Man, the guys flying that crippled Aloha bird were good, weren't they?

One of those "guys" was a lady. I believe Connie Sellica played the pilot in the movie.
(Boy, I hate typing with one hand!)
 
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