Thoughts on the .357 S&W Mountain gun.

[jonsidneyb]

I have always been confused on one of the Mountain Guns.

When I think of a mountain gun, If it is to be a revolver I think of it as a revolver carried alot but only used a little. Capacity I think is not much of an issue for a gun of this type.

I understand the .45 LC and the .44 magnum. The approach made sence to me.

On the .41 I do understand why they made it they way they did but I kind of thought a 5 shot .41 on the L-Frame would make more sence but I could be thinking wrong. I am sure it would be been more costly to set up production for it since they have no 5 shot .41s to base it off of.

Now on the .357, I think the plain old Model 19 or 66 was more of a Mountain Gun than the L-Frame "Carried alot shot little" but that already existed.
What I think would be a true .357 mountain gun would be a 4 inch J-Frame .357.

You pick the cartridge and that determines the gun size.

Am I thinking wrong?

 

[Iggy]

Maybe this is what you need

Stainless model 60 (J-frame) 5 inch barrel.

 

[jonsidneyb]

Yep. to me that seems more mountain gun to me. Just the way I see it.

I hope no one thinks I was cutting down the one that was sold as a Mountain Gun. I actually like it and think it is a very good gun, just the word Mountain Gun just says something different than it in my mind.

 

[shooting on a shoestring]

Depends on what mountains you're in

A .357 might be a fine gun in places where big cats or bears aren't apt to be. I've seen the little J-frame, I believe a 5" barrel. It would make a light belt holster gun, but that 5" barrel is quite long even if the rest is small. I believe 4" or shorter is better. A mountain gun to me implies lots of carry, that calls for barrels that don't make you sit funny when you rest, or get in a pickup, or just sit down. 2" ones carry real nice.

I too have wished for a 5 shot .41 mag, but, that requires as much gun as a 5 shot .44 mag as they have the same SAAMI pressure rating and are only 0.019" different in bullet diameter. So what I want is a 5 shot, 2" in either .41 or .44, but .45 Colt would be even better.

 

[Brian Williams]

How about this one, I feel the same way, as light as possible and able to shoot a good heavy load for the caliber.
Mine is a S&W 65 with a mod 64 pencil barrel installed.

 

[jonsidneyb]

I don't think an L-Frame has enough room on the Cylinder for 5x.44 does it?

I am pretty sure 5x.41 will fit.


I can agree that a 4 inch barrel might make a better mountain gun but then again I wouldn't mind 5. I will be walking and climbing, not riding. I think a 2 inch is a touch short. I have some 3 inch guns and I think they are bit to short for a mountain gun. I still want sight radius and velocity so for me take the weight off someplace else besides cutting down the tube. I think to the smallest frame that can support the calliber and thining the barrel is ok too. Just leave me that velocity potential and some sight radius.

 

[Davevand]

The L-frame 696 is a 5x.44 special.

 

[Stainz]

Of course, the L-frame frame opening does have room for a 5 x .44 cylinder, witness my 296 & 696. Sadly, the dimunitive forcing cone makes the use of Keith level Specials a questionable practice at best in the 696, much less anything more stout.

A 3.125" barrel 7-shot Al/Sc/Ti 'Mountain Lite' variant (386 SKU 163687) may just be the answer, at a whopping 18.5 oz (Less than half the 625/629 MG's weight.). Pretty lite carry... but the HiViz front sight sets it aside from the other MG-type variants. Naw, I'll stay with my two 625 MG's in .45 Colt. They look, feel, and perform great.

Stainz

 

[jonsidneyb]

Ok then.

A mountain gun should be the smallest frame size you can fit the ammo into with a gun that retains much of the power of the cartridge and offers hit possiblities of a standard service revolver. A pure hunting revolver will likely be a heavier platform

5 shot L-frames for the bigger stuff and 5 shot J-frames for the .357

I know we would disagree on barrel length but that is ok. For me at minium 4 inches for an outdoorsman arm.

The truth is I would rather have an an inch in length over an increase in frame size. I think in a mountain gun the sight radius and velocity are more important than a larger frame.

But those are just my opinions that are debatable.

 

[Piedmont Plinker]

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore/SmWesson/upload/images/firearms/163687_large.jpg
.357 Mountain Lite
7-shot

 

[ArchAngelCD]

If you're looking for power in a light frame then S&W has 3 very good choices if you are willing to spend the money.

The S&W Model 357PD is a 4" 6 Round .41 Mag that weighs only 27.5 oz.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...angId=-1&parent_category_rn=15706&isFirearm=Y

The S&W Model 325PD is a 4" 6 Round .45 ACP that weighs only 26.5 oz.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...angId=-1&parent_category_rn=15706&isFirearm=Y

The S&W Model 329PD is a 4" 6 Round .44 Mag that weighs only 26.5 oz.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...angId=-1&parent_category_rn=15706&isFirearm=Y

Of course, when all else fails you could chose the gun that S&W is calling their 4" Mountian gun, the Model 29 but it weighs just under 40 oz.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...ted=tech&isFirearm=Y&parent_category_rn=15706

-edit spelling

 

[michael_aos]

I've got a 357PD and the Model 629 Mountain Gun.

The Model 386 isn't so far off, but I'd prefer it with 6-shots and a 4" barrel.

I'd also be OK with a weight around 25oz.

I've actually found myself looking at the Model 327.

 

[jonsidneyb]

When I bounce around in the wilderness, which includes climbing. I find bulk as big of of a problem as weight. Some times more.

I really do think of Mountain Guns as being a compromise. Not the first choice for other activities.

 

[SJshooter]

When I think of a Mountain Gun, I think it's the same as the non-Mountain version of the same gun, only lighter (usually with half-underlug) and with a lanyard ring on the butt. That's it. Anything more is conjecture about potential use.

 

[Cosmoline]

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore...3687_large.jpg
.357 Mountain Lite 7-shot

That's another example of the creeping madness at S&W. I'd MUCH rather take a Model 60 or a Ruger Sec. Six than that thing. That front sight will be destroyed after a good drop on the scree, and the back sight is a thin thin piece of sheet metal. It's too much flash and fluff for me, and not enough iron and steel. You shouldn't even consider buying a field sidearm if you're going to be afraid to throw it over onto a boulder or drop it in a river.

 

[22-rimfire]

If you consider a mountain gun a revolver that you carry hiking for defense purposes (carried a lot, shot little), then something like the Smith 329PD or 357PD would be perfect. A light 357 revolver would also be plenty of medicine in most cases short of big bear country.

If you plan on shooting it more, than the Model 29, 629, or Model 57 Mountain Guns would be more appropriate. They are fairly heavy revolvers. I'll just let Smith name their own revolvers and buy what seems appropriate to my needs.

 

[michael_aos]

I guess I just have a "thing" for a 4" barrel and 6-shots.

This 24oz, 3" Model 60 seems a lot like a "Mountain Gun" though.

 

[Stainz]

I believe that, at least historically, the 'Mountain Revolver' preceded the 'Mountain Gun' series. They really are alike alot. I admit to my fondness for them alot. The MG's are characterized by a tapered partially lugged 4" tube, with a chamfered cylinder for easy and fast access from a pack, etc. They all, at least in SS, seem to weigh around 39-39.5 oz. It is my assumption that a MG should have enough 'oomph' for real woods carry. As I don't do that alot, I am a more typical owner. But... I still feel the MG needs an appropriate caliber/round choice for such use.

I feel that for the average person, you just won't be needing a 'bear' gun alot. Perhaps my choice is clouded by my typical 'target of opportunity', something I dispatch alot. Such is the case with the wild 2L pop bottle full of water... which I do seem to encounter - alot. As my first S&W, a 625MG in .45 Colt, was a gift, I will 'always' have it. My third S&W was a 629MG - which, due to my error, I recently replaced with a standard 4" 629 - adding only 2 oz more. I guess I still would choose my 625MG as my 'choice' for a MG's role. It will carry 200gr LRNFP's @ 700 fps to 255gr LSWC's @900 fps, for popping fun to serious plinking, which I do alot. It can also sport my 250gr GDHP's at 840 fps - or those older 'hot' 200gr Gold Dots at 1,100+ fps, like Speer and Georgia Arms load, which I enjoy - perhaps not alot (Those GDHP bullet's are expensive!).

The key is your need or suggested 'use'. When I traded for my second 625MG earlier this year, I rationalized that it would make a nice 'Jeep' gun. Oops. Although it came less box and papers - and is a '96-er in great shape - it will simply replace my favored original sibling, which did get shot alot. I mainly got it because of my MG-gluttony, which may just add more similar goodies to my ownership - especially if they are SS and large bores - which I like alot.

Stainz

 

[shooting on a shoestring]

Sounds like you're set on the 5" J-frame

Jonsidneyb, You make some rational arguements for your position. A 5" barrel is not a carry problem for you, bulk is bad, J-Frames are compact, .357 is enough power to satisfy you. I think you left out one argument - you don't have a 5" .357 J-frame. That right there is reason enough to get one a try it out. Let us hear from you after you've shot it and carried it while.

 

[Iggy]

That 5" J-frame is just cuter than a speckled pup..

Light to carry, long enough barrel to be worthy of .357, and long enough to be plumb accurate.

If it didn't have the 2 piece barrel and the lock, I would probably own one.. Those aren't complete deal killers, but I have been using that as my excuse not to buy one.

A friend and I have been circling around one of these like a vulture for about a year.. We each have almost bought it on a couple of occasion.. Last time he was in the store it was gone!!

They get another one in, I'm liable to drop the hammer and get it.. !!!

 

[45+]

They do not have the fit and finish of the S&W's but Taurus has been doing some really right things the last few years. They have a 5-shot L-frame 41 Mag with 2" or 4" barrel. They have a 5-shot L-frame 44 Mag (probably better with Keith-level Specials or Silvertips) with a 2.5" or 4" barrel. They have a 5-shot J-frame 357 Mag with 3" barrel. They have a 7-shot L-frame 357 in 2" or 4". The 41 Mags are available in Titanium. I have owned several of these and I have had only one specimen that was not up-to-par. A stainless steel 41 Mag 2.5" had some ignition problems which the factory promptly fixed under warranty.

My new current wilderness packer is the 2.5" 44 Mag 5-shot. It will replace my 4" 44 Mag 5-shot. It has not been to the range yet, but if it shoots like it should, it will be with me most of the time when hiking, camping, or working in the boonies.

 

[michael_aos]

The Model 520 isn't so far off...

I especially like the titanium cylinder and HI-VIZ front sight. The wood grips are a nice touch.

But the frame shouldn't be carbon steel / blued, and it should weigh more like 28oz instead of 35.2oz.

I'd still prefer a 6-shot to a 7-shot as well.

Mike

 

[Ranger 40]

In the Mtns, where the Big Bears live you carry a handgun. That being said in most every case regardless of the weapon, you are going to get hurt real bad.
I have known of many fellows who had to use the handgun . They are usally shooting at point blank range, gun pressed agansit the target and fired.
The 4" .44 Mag. the .45 LAR Grissley, the Ruger BH and RH, .454 Casull all are good guns to carry with heavy loads. The .357 is not a good choice. The little Mtn.guns in .44 Mag and N-Frame is a good gun.
I don't think the choice of a light frame is a good idea. The heavy frame will take more punishment and still work. This will not be a target shoot if you run into a Grizz at 9,000" snow and mud. After he gets the first licks in you will need all you got to live thru it. A friend of mine was able to get off 5 rounds from a .270 at close range less than 20'. The bear took him out before she died.
The point is what ever Mtn. handgun you choose, its just the last thing you have when the chips are down.

 

[22-rimfire]

A friend told me that the Pennsylvania Game Commission biologists believe there is at least one 1,000 lb black bear roaming the Keystone State. That is a pretty big bear and at a size you begin to think about big Rocky Mt bears. You might want to keep that in mind when hiking the Appalachians and choosing your "mountain gun".

The last post kind of paints the reality of using a handgun for bear defense. It is a last ditch effort. Bears frighten me and I don't want to be anywhere close to one unless I'm hunting. Their speed and power is incredible. Flesh and bones aren't much armor.