Tikka T3 or Weatherby Vanguard

[Fumbler]

Personally, I'm surprised at the mention of the Vanguards 90deg bolt throw. I could have sworn that Weatherby was all about the six lug bolts with miniscule deg of throw.

The Vanguard is not a true Weatherby. It is a 2 lug design made by Howa of Japan.

But in a short action, part of the allure is the shorter, stiffer action is supposed to aide accuracy, this somewhat defeated in a long action gun.

Action length in regards to stiffness is probably a moot point with the T3's enclosed reciever.

I'm not sure why people make a big deal out of the one action length. Shaving 3 oz off by shortening it wouldn't matter considering it's already over a pound less than competitors.
The bolt stop keeps the bolt throw short so thats not an issue either.
What it does do is keep the cost down. That was a good thing for those of us who didn't wait for everyone and their brother to realize there's more to bolt actions than a Rem 700 before buying one.

 

[ArmedBear]

I like my Vanguard Sporter (walnut stock with rosewood cap). I picked it up new for $400 on sale, so it was about the only thing I saw in walnut for the price. I like the "California-style" stock with the angled cheekpiece.

However, last night I compared it with a Winchester Featherlight M70. The Vanguard is definitely a full-sized gun! It feels like a beast by comparison with the light Featherweight, though the Vanguard is pretty close to a similar rifle from Remchester. A light gun (like the Tikka) is nice to have, unless you shoot it a lot, and you probably won't be shooting too many rounds through it. The Featherlight even seemed light with a monster scope on it.

The Howa (Vanguard) bolt action is reliable and simple, but not tight like a Mauser-knockoff like a Winchester, or whiz-bang like a Weatherby Mark V (a gun that sells for $1000 in the cheapest version that you probably wouldn't buy and a lot more when you start getting picky).

This is an interesting option:
http://www.czusa.com/01.detail.php?id=52

Also, you can get a Howa from Howa rather than Weatherby. Different stock and different barrel lengths. Good prices.
http://www.legacysports.com/

Winchester has nearly transformed their M70 line into a marketing strategy for the WSM and WSSM cartridges. They offer lots of options in these rounds, as does their sister brand Browning.

 

[scubie02]

Action length in regards to stiffness is probably a moot point with the T3's enclosed reciever.

I'm not sure why people make a big deal out of the one action length. Shaving 3 oz off by shortening it wouldn't matter considering it's already over a pound less than competitors.
The bolt stop keeps the bolt throw short so thats not an issue either.
What it does do is keep the cost down. That was a good thing for those of us who didn't wait for everyone and their brother to realize there's more to bolt actions than a Rem 700 before buying one.

I just don't like when a company makes a product function in a certain way strictly as a cost cutting measure (Savage USED to do that, but even they offer true short actions now, and they have been considered a "cheap" brand), and its apparently not that much of a cost cutting measure, since the t3'c command comparable prices to winchester's and such these days. Whereas with its cast receiver (sure looks cast to me anyway) and the long action to short action conversion deal, to me it should be less expensive. Like I said, that's not to say it might not function fine, but its the principle so to speak.

 

[Dance&Sting]

This is an interesting option:
http://www.czusa.com/01.detail.php?id=52

Already own three CZs and there is absolutely nothing I dislike about em. Very accurate out of the box especially the 452 series. So I decided to pick a different rifle company which I'm sure can support the same, or even better , accuracy my CZs gave to me. Thanks for sharing your opinion.

Winchester has nearly transformed their M70 line into a marketing strategy for the WSM and WSSM cartridges. They offer lots of options in these rounds, as does their sister brand Browning.

BTW the M70 is my next rifle. Either that or an A-bolt chambered in .243 WSSM. Seriously, this is what I had in mind too..!

Quoted by someone VIP: "Great minds think alike."

 

[hoghunting]

Take the Tikka.
I have the T3 Lite in 300 WSM and am amazed not only at its accuracy- 3/8inch groups @ 100 yards with handloads- but it has such a great trigger and handles and balances as a rifle should. I replaced the factory recoil pad with a gel-type pad from HiViz and recoil feels like a .30/06.

GREAT GUN, highly recommend the T3 to anyone.

 

[45crittergitter]

The Vanguard is guarenteed (sic) to shoot 1.5 MOA.

AND

Yeah, the Weatherby's (sic) come from the factory garuanteed (sic) to shoot sub 1.5 MOA.

I don't think my T3 Lite has ever printed a 5-shot group that big.

 

[Lobotomy Boy]

It's unique and has a Sako styled look but $1000-$2000 cheaper and in my blind opinion, bang for the buck.

It also has a Sako trigger group and a Sako cold-rolled steel free-floating barrel. The T3 Lite is the finest firearm I've ever owned, and I bought my first gun 37 years ago. I plan on getting a varmint version in .308.

 

[IV Troop]

It also has a Sako trigger group and a Sako cold-rolled steel free-floating barrel. The T3 Lite is the finest firearm I've ever owned, and I bought my first gun 37 years ago. I plan on getting a varmint version in .308.

I have a Tikka varmint 308. I also have 4 other heavy bbl 308s from other manufacturers. The Tikka is hands down the best of the group. I took it to sniper instructor school last year and cleaned house.

I just wish they would import them in other calibers besides 223, 22-250 and 308. I would love a pair of 6.5 Swede and 300 win heavy bbl Tikkas.

 

[BevrFevr]

tikka all the way

I would buy a howa over a weatherby myself. They are nice just not a tikka.

I have a laminated stainless .308. I will buy more guns and bolt guns but I don't need to now that I have this one. I would trade up to a Sako if I had unlimited funds.

I checked this out. I think it is on the Berreta site somewhere but No Sako/Tikka barrel leaves the factory that can't put 5 shots under an inch.

I don't know what the one poster scubie had wrong with his rifle but someting tells me there is more to the story. Hell my ak shoots better than that. Maybe somebody used his barrel as a pry bar or something. Maybe a loose screw.

The long action/short action is irrellevant hyperboly. A long action capable of magnum calibers will surely last almost forever shooting short action rounds. So it is actually a benefit with regards to the tikka.

 

[cjanak]

Most people love the Tikka T3, but for an alternate (if somewhat crotchety) view read this.

Also, here's Chuck Hawk’s opinion on the best bolt actions produced. Hawks is a big fan of the Weatherby Vanguard/Howa action.

Personally, I think they are both probably solid firearms, but since you were getting so many pro-Tikka responses I thought I’d send you some alternate viewpoints for balance’s sake.

 

[Bukufungi]

Tikka or Vanguard

Well...First I would say both are excellent rifles. I grew up in Central California very near Weatherby's main offices. My dad still shoots them exclusively. For years I hunted with a Vanguard SS synthetic stock in .30-06 AND .338 win mag. Last year I shot a friends Tikka T3 Lite at the range and was so impressed with the accuracy, I bought one in .30-06. I have since sold both the Vanguards. I do firmly believe the Vangaurd to be a quality hunting rifle and would never hesitate to recommend it to any friend or family member however, I feel there are some advantages the Tikka offers over the weatherby that appeal to me personally... some may not feel the same. First off the accuracy of my friends, and my Tikka are unbelievable....seriously. I have shot three bullets through the same hole on many occaisions...no joke. This rifle can really shoot straight. Secondly it is lighter than the Vanguard. The Vanguard was not overly heavy or inaccurate by any means but the Tikka is noticeably better in both respects...in my experience at least. For me where the weatherby exelled was in felt recoil. Both the .30-06 and .338 were a pleasure to shoot and I never noticed the recoil at all. This was likely due to a combination of the extra weight and excellent stock design. The Tikka will get your attention. So that was the trade off for me. Lighter weight rifle that is a little more accurate at the price of higher recoil. I have added a Limsaver to the Tikka which has helped for sure but still more noticeable that either Weatherby IMHO. BTW I am not "sensative" to recoil by any means just making an observation. Both are push feed if that matters to you. In the end I would recommend the Tikka over the Vanguard for those reasons but only if the extra recoil will not bother you. I strongly suggest you shoot both prior to buying if at all possible. You have chosen two excellent rifles to compare and would be very happy with either i'm sure. Good luck!

 

[ForneyRider]

One of our deer hunting party shoots a Howa 1500 in 7mm Mag. Supposedly it is the same action as Weatherby Vanguard. He got it for 450$. He spent 500$ for the Leupold sitting on it. It's a very good hunting rig.

Watching one of the Outdoor Channel shows, they interviewed the head of Legacy Sports, the importer of the Howa 1500. He was a big time trap shooter.

I think these Howa/Weatherby Vanguard are great bang for buck. Stocks take a beating and they are good hunting accuracy and reliability. I much prefer them over a Remington 770 or other entry level bolt action.

 

[jmco]

Hello Bukufungi,

Your point about shooting both rifles prior to purchasing makes a lot of sense, however, how does one normally go about this? I am in a position where I have narrowed my purchase down to either a Tikka T3 (30.06) or a Browning Medalion (30.06). I would love to be able to shoot both prior to purchasing, but haven't a clue about how to go about this. In your experience, are there gun clubs/shooting ranges that might provide such access?

Any help you can provide is greatly appreciated.

Kind regards,

jmco

 

[rbernie]

Also, here's Chuck Hawk’s opinion on the best bolt actions produced. Hawks is a big fan of the Weatherby Vanguard/Howa action.

Yes, we had a very long and contention thread about that review a while back.

I have seen a T3 triggerguard get smashed during a severe fall down a ravine. The hunt for that hunter was effectively over until he could get to camp and get a backup. If you're on the hunt of a lifetime, then perhaps the Tikka is not the best choice.

But for most of us, most of the time, we're not on the hunt of a lifetime. In most of the situations in which most of us hunt, light weight and reliability and accuracy are critical. In those areas, the Tikka does very well.