To crimp or Not to crimp...

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Keeperfaith

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Hi, im still a novice reloader.

I noticed that the factory rifle and pistol ammo I have doesnt looked crimped at all...

Do you experienced reloaders crimp for these calibers? (if so, why or why not)

9mm
40 S&W
45 ACP
.223 Rem
30-06 Springfield
.308 Win.

Now for those who do crimp, do you use your bullet seating die or a "factory crimp die"??

Thanks
 
I taper crimp the handgun cartridges (45acp and 40 s&w).

I do not crimp 308 win, 30-06, or 223 Remington even when used in a semi auto rifle (M1a, M1, Ar-15).
 
I load 9mm, .223, and a little bit of .30-06. I crimp those just slightly with the seating die. I crimp revolver cartridges somewhat heavier; also with the seating die.
 
For me, crimping is based upon the action type of the firearm used.

Autoloader pistols all get a small taper crimp (9mm, .40, .45, etc.) until they fit into my case gauge, then just a hair more adjustment to ensure smooth operation.

Bolt action rifles all get a slight roll crimp or none at all depending on the weight of the rifle vs. the recoil and of course changes in accuracy.

Lever action rifles all get a solid roll crimp.

Semi-Auto rifles usually get a medium crimp, although many people don't crimp for AR-15 style rifles.

Revolvers in traditional calibers all get a roll crimp. The degree of crimp correlates to the amount of recoil.

I use a Lee FCD if I have one, or the RCBS factory seating die with crimp. This is what I usually do. YMMV.
 
You don't need to crimp for high powered rifle cartridges and doing so can really cause more issues than solutions, and may impeed performance.

As for auto loading handgun cartridges, 45 ACP and other simular types, crimping is not the correct description considering what is being accomplsihed. These type cartridges are not gaining, nor do they attain neck tension by use of a crimp die. The crimp die when used for these cartridges is only intended to remove any belling of the mouths and doesn't increase neck tension at all. These type cartridges are often thought to need a crimp to increase neck tension, yet nothing could be further from the truth. I have never used a crimp on these cartridges because I don't bell the mouths. I accomplish this by chamfering the inside mouths nicely, which assures me of maximum neck tension, and uncomprimised feeding / cycling of the rounds.

As for revolver type handgun cartridges, the crimp is applied to prevent bullet set back, or jump from the mouth, and is necessary.

GS
 
Semi auto pistol ammo seldom "looks crimped." The taper crimp on this ammo just removes any excess flare (if any). The only rounds that you make that should have a visible crimp should be the rare cases that were the longest on the bell curve. Well, there's a school of reloaders that like to put a visible tapered crimp on the case mouth using Redding crimp dies. But that's a different story.

Factory rifle ammo should only look crimped if the bullet has a cannelure. Then you'll see just a slight bevel/indent at the end of the case mouth.

If you want to make sure your pistol ammo works reliably in most all guns, you should crimp it. Average brass thickness at the mouth is 0.01". If your case mouth measures no more than 0.02" larger than the diameter of the bullet, it should fit in any chamber. If you don't crimp, the best you can probably do with mixed brass will probably be around 0.04".

If your guns have generous chambers at the case mouth and you don't overdo it when you flare the cases, you'll find no need to crimp. But some day you might buy a new gun and find it doesn't like your reloads.

For small bore rifle, it's different. You don't flare the case mouths. So you don't need to crimp, unless you have a specific reason for doing so.

For pistol ammo, I use the seater die to crimp. If you're using cast or oversize plated bullets, or if you're using thick brass, the FCD can damage the bullet and reduce neck tension.

For rifle, you obviously would use the FCD, since that's the only way to do it.
 
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Just remove the bell, or a hair more. This one has .001 worth of "crimp".

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I load .45 acp for my 1911's and taper crimp with my seating die. I load .44 mag for a rossi lever action and roll crimp with my seating die. All my loading is done on a lee 3 hole turret press.
 
The main thing I got from the Brian Enos Competition Reloading video was a great quote (paraprhased): "A lot of trouble and headache would be solved if they didn't call this thing a 'crimp' die."

All you really want to do is remove the flaring from the case - tension from the uncrimped part of the bullet will keep it in place. Anything more than that impedes accuracy (sometimes significantly if the bullet tumbles).

What I do is simple: keep a freshly resized case aside, and keep one dummy round with no primer in it that has the correct OAL.

Take your seater die and scew the seater plug WAY out. Then, take the resized case, put it in the press, and raise the arm to max height. Screw down your seater die until you feel it hit the case. Its at that point that it basically will remove the flare and crimp NO MORE.

Remove the resized case, then raise the template round into the die. Screw down the seater plug until it contacts the bullet on the template round.

You're now set. Once you load the first round use your calipers to verify OAL (and adjust if needed) but 99% of the time you'll be right on.
 
I adjust my crimper so the very shortest cases get the bell completely removed, which means the longest ones get about .001 crimp. The only way to get it 100% the same would be to trim the .45 brass, and that ain't happening. My .45 ACP loads out shoot me, and most shoot extremely well from a rest, so I'm not changing.
 
The main thing I got from the Brian Enos Competition Reloading video was a great quote (paraprhased): "A lot of trouble and headache would be solved if they didn't call this thing a 'crimp' die."

"De-flare" die, maybe?
 
GLOOB, I think you mean .004" and .002", not .04" or .02"? A variance of .020" or .040" would be an extreme variance when referring to brass or mouth diameters. A cartridge that is as much as .020" larger at the mouth would likely not chamber, and one that is .020" crimped at the mouth would severely distort the bullet and cause other major issues. I can't imagine what a variance of .040" would look like?

GS
 
Yeah, I made an oopsie. But only half wrong. I meant 0.02". That's how much bigger I want the case mouth to measure after seating/crimping, beyond the actual diameter of the projectile. E.g., my target for 45ACP would be .452+.02=0.472". This is simply the diameter of the bullet plus the thickness of the brass (~0.01" x2). If you get your crimp down to 0.472, then there's no flare leftover. (Or you have a little leftover flare but your brass is really thin... which is the same thing; as long as you can get it down to .472" it should work in any modern 45ACP chamber.)

But you're right about the 0.04. I meant to say 0.004". That's to say that without crimping, it's hard to get any closer than 0.024" over the bullet diameter with mixed brass and minimal flare. So in the above example, I would expect the case mouth to measure 0.476" or greater (on many of the cases) if I didn't crimp.
 
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For some reason, and I don't know why, I like the Lee FCD for rifle calibers. I fired identical loads in 30-06 and .223 from bolt action rifles there was no difference in accuracy or velocity from no crimp and factory crimp. I still apply a factory crimp to all my rifle ammo.
 
If your post disappeared, take that as a hint. Let's stay on topic without the insults and fussing. :)
 
I crimp 308 for the ar-10 variants, but not my bolts. Will crimp 9mm lightly for semi-auto pistols.

So basically only if the action is violent and imo calls for it. Definitely better performance with no crimp. Used to have some targets showing it from the same rifle. Wife throws too much away. :(

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2
 
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