To go to NY or not to go, that is the question...

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leadcounsel

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So, I'm in a pickel... I think I've resolved this (and am still unhappy about my decision), but would like some input from others.

A few months ago I promised this woman I'm seeing that I would be her wedding date in upstate New York for a long weekend in 2010. We will be driving across country to get there.

The closer it gets the more uneasy I feel about going. There are several issues which could be resolved, but one primary issue is the fact that my CCW permits are void in NY, transporing guns is very difficult and strict (disassembled, unloaded, put in the trunk, etc.), and the magazine capacity is 10 rds. So we will effectively be unarmed getting there and unarmed for the entire time there while in public.

I have a level of loyalty to her that I don't want to break, but I also don't want to go hang out with her Democrat gun neutral (at best) family, including gay brother, in an anti-gun state. Part of me rebels against traveling to anti-gun states and spending time and money there. I hate driving through Illinois for instance, but sometimes it's necessary. I hate being disarmed like that!

If I do go, other than a handgun, what are my best lawful options for self defense in NY?

Do I go back on my word and not go, or do I suck it up and go?

If I don't go, where does that leave the relationship?
 
i live in ny not the city of course but in the country. u cant bring your pistol but i think u can bring a 18 inch shotgun (not sure if you have to be a resident to posses one) if nothing else carry a knife
 
Leadcounsel: Suck it up and go if you care about her.

We all from time to time must spend time with people that we can't stand to make people that love happy. Sometimes its for other reasons jobs etc.

Also althought what NY does with gunlaws is an unforgiveable attack on the 2A and America Liberty in general. You will most likely be able to spend a weekend there and survive unarmed especially if you keep your situational awareness up. Don't go unsafe places while there and remember her family how much they suck will be a part of your life as long as you are with her.

Good luck!
 
I think you have to go or find a new girlfriend.
I would go and make the best of it if.

AC
 
leadcounsel:

You can't bring a handgun, period, if you're not just passing through! Stopping for meals, potty breaks, or maybe even overnight, ought to be OK, but if your destination is in New York, you can't bring it. (Dunno about long guns.) Unloaded and in the trunk if you're just passing through....

Off the record, outside of NYC, you probably would be OK to have the handgun secured in your trunk. But don't bet the farm on it.

Best advice is to stay the heck away....

(I went to a family gathering in Rochester a couple years ago. Felt naked....)

Regards,
 
You'll be fine man. Just chill out. Do this for you lady. There's millions of unarmed people in NY everyday and they aren't gunned down the minute they leave the house without a CCW. You'll be alright.
 
I'm not paranoid, I don't think people are lurking to get me when I'm disarmed. But it angers me to be disarmed by a state supposedly protecting the 2A. Also, I would just be soooo angry at the state if something DOES happen while I'm disarmed with no recourse against the entity that disarms me! Imagine needing a gun and having a useless CCW license in your pocket with no gun. Then witnessing a crime, being the victim of a violent crime, etc. I would be soooo angry.

I just am conflicted on principal. Go and disarm myself and be miserable because I violate my own principal or don't go and break a promise to go.

There is the third option, which noone will endorse.
 
I'm not paranoid, I don't think people are lurking to get me when I'm disarmed. But it angers me to be disarmed by a state supposedly protecting the 2A. Also, I would just be soooo angry at the state if something DOES happen while I'm disarmed with no recourse against the entity that disarms me! Imagine needing a gun and having a useless CCW license in your pocket with no gun. Then witnessing a crime, being the victim of a violent crime, etc. I would be soooo angry.

I just am conflicted on principal. Go and disarm myself and be miserable because I violate my own principal or don't go and break a promise to go.

There is the third option, which noone will endorse.
Click to expand...

Forget principle. You're doing this for your lady friend. There is greater honor in being able to sacrifice for the woman you love than just about anything else. Do it for her. Not Chuck Schumer.

And as for the third option, that would invalidate all that you stand for, and make you no better than the common criminals you got a CCW because of in the first place.
 
Personally, I would carry anyway, but you mentioned you want to be "legal." In that case, you cannot protect yourself in any way shape or form. NY is just like MA, but a little worse in some ways. Forget about a knife. Any knife long enough for defense is outlawed just like a gun. You basically have to go naked. It depends on how much you really care about attending the ceremony. Also, if you were "seeing" her, now that she is married, that normally stops... If you want to be legal, just show up, leave the gun in the car, and leave ASAP to return to the closest free state. Good luck!
 
i hear ya lead counsel the only long gun restrictions we have here are cant be more then 10 rounds though. and yea i understand i also dont like ny gun laws in general. its damn near impossable to even get a pistol here and again nyc has way diff laws then the rest of the state.
 
Leadcounsel: Suck it up and go if you care about her.
Click to expand...

This.

I never understood why people allow themselves to develop such pointless tunnel-vision when it comes to things like this. My father always told me that the only sure way to build character and learn how to live in the world was to step out of my comfort zone as often as possible. I might not like it, but it's not going to kill me either.

The brother is gay, big deal. He's not going to force you to wear a pink tutu or make out with him after the reception.

The family don't share your political views, big deal. Don't talk politics.

NYC is anti, big deal. You're not living there, you're going to support someone you care about.

I'm sorry if I come off a bit rude, but this sorta thing really baffles me. I don't allow people or my surroundings dictate where I go or what I do. Of course there are going to be situations that are less than ideal based on my personal belief system, but I'm also secure enough in myself to handle them like an adult.
 
P.S. If you do wind up carrying and for some reason need to use your piece, you will be considered a criminal and will face hard prison time if caught. My best advice is protect ONLY yourself and disappear right after you protect yourself. There is no such thing as hanging around for the police and explaining why you were carrying an unregistered firearm while unlicensed. You will be considered a murderer, and will be promptly prosecuted as one. You might as well vanish ASAP because even if they wind up finding you, you are going to prison one way or another. This "advice" if you want to call it that; it is obviously against NY law. Take this with a grain of salt and it is only hypothetical. I do not advise you do this and I only described this situation like so, so you can understand what you will be facing in NY. There is no Castle Doctrine there, self defense is a punishable crime. Welcome to socialism!
 
Have a buddy that had a nylon 'letter opener' I flew with it back in the day. Might think about something like that. Personally though if I loved her, I'd just realize that her family in the Peeple Republik of NY are part of the package, and figure a way to get along with it. I've had to go 'nekkid' a time or 2 for that very reason in the past, and I'm still here. Just weigh the odds. I'm betting they're not plotting to take you the " where can take the redneck and get him mugged" tour. Odds are you'll be in decent neighborhoods the whole time. Good luck.
 
kingpin008

Darn, I should have just dittoed this entry. What I get for talking and typing at the same time. ;)
 
well the only city that has scared me in ny has been poughkeepsie but then again im from a small farm town that i can bring my shotgun most places.
 
eatont9999:

leadcounsel is accompanying his lady friend as her date for a wedding she is attending....

Not nearly as kinky as you were thinking....

Regards,
 
Leadcounsel upstate NY is VERY different than NYC. Where in NY will you be going?

I would suggest bringing a pistol grip shotty or a Keltec Sub2k (it folds in 1/2...perfectly legal here).
 
exactly wnycollector is right u can bring ur 18 inch pistol griped 8 shot 12g or a high point carbine or watever u have even an ak or ar if its got a 10 round mag.
 
P.S. If you do wind up carrying and for some reason need to use your piece, you will be considered a criminal and will face hard prison time if caught. My best advice is protect ONLY yourself and disappear right after you protect yourself. There is no such thing as hanging around for the police and explaining why you were carrying an unregistered firearm while unlicensed. You will be considered a murderer, and will be promptly prosecuted as one. You might as well vanish ASAP because even if they wind up finding you, you are going to prison one way or another. This "advice" if you want to call it that is obviously against NY law. Take this with a grain of salt and it is only hypothetical. I do not advise you do this and I only described this situation like so, so you can understand what you will be facing in NY. There is no Castle Doctorine there, self defense is a punishable crime. Welcome to socialism!
Click to expand...

Well I think that settles it, I'll pick principles over keeping my promise. I refuse to voluntarily go someplace under these circumstances if I can avoid it.

As far as stepping outside my comfort zone, believe me I have. Two combat deployments, lots of airborne jumps and helicopter rappels, traveled around the world and country in friendly and unfriendly places, been in very dangerous and unfriendly places globally and in the USA, etc. But most of that was either 1) no choice, 2) too young and naive to understand, 3) I reeeallly wanted to go to places like Australia or New Zealand or Europe and nobody has guns so it's not an option...

But to voluntarily go on a vacation to NY and spend time and money there and voluntarily disarm myself for the entire trip (legally) is just too much. It's not that I can't handle myself or my self defense in most situations, it's just principle. I'm going to gladhand a bunch of people that I disagree with that likely voted for people I disagree with that create these stupid laws to begin with.

I'm not worried about the gay brother hitting on me, it's just flavor to explain how lame the week is going to be hanging out with a bunch of lefties.

As far as the girl is concerned, yes I care about her, and she was a lefty but has been coming around, but it's a cold realization that is she were 'the one' (which I am 80% sure she is not), then this is the decision I would be presented with every holiday...
 
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Suck it up and go if you care about her. If you keep situational awareness in mind, you'll be fine. Don't go to bad neighborhoods, avoid bars, don't start trouble with anyone and you'll be fine.
Also even if you have a problem with her brother being gay, there was no need to mention that and I find it offensive.
 
Meytind,

How did I offend you that I mentioned her brother is gay? I didn't slander him or attack him. I called the family lefties, which is true.

As far as not going to bars or bad neighborhoods, I can guarantee that I will have nearly no choice as to where we go. It's a wedding and a reception and there will also likely be groups of her friends wanting us to go to the bars in the city (not NYC, but another big city in NY) and I will be obligated to go, unarmed (no gun, no knife, no nothing).

We will also likely be nearly defenseless as we drive across the country. Or, at least I won't have a handgun readily available as we stop to eat, rest stops, etc. What if the car breaks down? Even if I bring a rifle, I'm not going to be able to carry it anywhere and it will be useless for any quick life threatening self defense situations, nor can I discretely bring it into her anti-gun family's home.
 
My biggest problem travelling in NY was the police. Speed limit changed from 65 to 55, then at the bottom of the hill a State Trooper was lurking with his radar gun.

Nailed me for $145 in fines. But worse than that - a bill came in the mail a few months later for an additional $300; apparently the state legislature decreed that extra money could be extorted from out of state guests if they were in a big enough hurry to flee the state. The nice thing was they gave me two years to pay.

I don't doubt that you'd be paying for a lot longer than two years if they found you in a position to protect yourself with a firearm, and it'd set you back a lot more that 4-500 dollars.

But the fines and fees are understandable; they've taxed most businesses out of the state, so they have to raise money somehow. Forty years ago there was a local joke: the taxes in this state are enough to Rockefeller. Rocky long ago expired in the arms of his floozy, but the beat goes on.
 
Long Gun/Kimber Pepper Blaster/Pocket Knife

I would get a nice long gun that you can keep in a hotel room for protection and also unloaded in a rental car while traveling. For carry, get some of the Kimber pepper blaster. It sells for roughly 40 bucks. That is supposed to be really good stuff. Google that. I bought Fox Labs pepper spray last year for close friends not willing to carry a firearm in public for self defense. Fox is another super hot spray...but doesn't shoot out with the same force as Kimber Pepper Blaster. You can use a cheap uncle mike's J frame pocket holster to carry the Kimber Pepper Blaster in your jeans or shorts pocket just fine. I'd also look into an under four inch locking one hand opening pocket knife, such as a spyderco....problem is pocket knives you have to get too close to use...I look at knives as tools not self defense items. Get yourself some Kimber Pepper Blaster and if you have a good case take a long gun for hotel protection and enjoy your trip to New York. I'd say if you were going up there for an NRA sanctioned match you could bring a handgun...but doesn't sound like you could schedule one with a wedding in the timeframe...you might want to talk to some NY residents about the details of NRA sanctioned matches at clubs where you are going and procedures for non residents bringing handguns. Have a great time! I've heard New York is a beautiful state.
 
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