Trouble with Top Brass .308 Win/7.62 NATO Brass

[William Dykstra]

Good afternoon, I am having some trouble with some Lake City brass in 7.62x51. I purchased a bag of 250 cases from Top Brass at Cabela's. It is just once fired Lake City brass that has been processed and "cleaned" (the reason in use quotation marks in because they were somewhat dirty and had a sticky substance on them. The looked great after tumbling them for a few hours though). I have not handloaded with them yet. But, i have tried chambering them in a couple of my firearms. The bolt would not close on my Remington 700 or my Springfield M1A, I have not yet tried it on my CZ 557 Varmint. I tried chambering once fired (by me. in a Savage Axis) cases that have only been tumbled and not yet trimmed or resized, and the bolt closed with very light resistance. Could it be something to do with the way Top Brass processed these cases, or could it have something to do with the firearm that the cases were previously fired in? I have the understanding that the M240B has a different way of headspacing than a Remington 700. Is there any way that I could mitigate the problem? I have with me some RCBS AR Dies in .308 Win., and when I used those the same issue of sticky bolt occured in both my Remington 700 and M1A, but the bolt could still close. I also have some Hornady Custom .308 Dies that I have not tried yet. What are your suggestions?

 

[1KPerDay]

Try sizing a couple.

 

[William Dykstra]

Try sizing a couple.

K, one minute

 

[William Dykstra]

Try sizing a couple.

Yeah, the bolt's still not closing

 

[Axis II]

Trim length and make sure they are actually 308win

 

[NoName47]

Yeah, the bolt's still not closing

If you fl sized them you might have to bump the shoulder more

 

[1KPerDay]

Yeah, the bolt's still not closing

If the case goes into the chamber smoothly all the way until you start to turn the bold handle down then it's probably not an issue of "fat brass" from a machine gun or something. Sounds like you need to crank your die in a little and bump the shoulder back a bit more. Do you have a case gauge?

 

[1KPerDay]

If you are only neck sizing then try FL sizing some.

 

[NoName47]

7.62x51 has a slighty longer headspace than 308 win. If the brass was processed then it was done to 7.62 headspace and not 308

 

[William Dykstra]

If the case goes into the chamber smoothly all the way until you start to turn the bold handle down then it's probably not an issue of "fat brass" from a machine gun or something. Sounds like you need to crank your die in a little and bump the shoulder back a bit more. Do you have a case gauge?

No, i do not. I am still new to reloading. How do you bump the shoulder back? Yes it is going in smoothly

 

[NoName47]

No, i do not. I am still new to reloading. How do you bump the shoulder back? Yes it is going in smoothly

Start with shell holder in ram. Put ram at top of stroke. Hornady dies screw down till it touches the shell holder, lower ram and start there. Size then check in your gun. If it still is tight, screw the die another 1/8th turn. Rcbs is the same way just screw it in 1/8th turn farther to start.

 

[NoName47]

If this solves your problem, you can play around with the depth of the die to get it just right. If you dont have a headspace gauge, you should get one. Hornady makes a good one

 

[William Dykstra]

Trim length and make sure they are actually 308win

Left: LC 7.62x51 Length of 2.003
Right: Sig Sauer .308 Winchester Length of 2.013
The Sig brass fits fine, so it looks like a shoulder issue.

7.62x51 has a slighty longer headspace than 308 win. If the brass was processed then it was done to 7.62 headspace and not 308

My Remington 700 and Springfield M1A shoot Federal XM80CL 7.62x51 just fine. It looks like the chamber for both of them is suited for .308 and 7.62.

 

[forty_caliber]

I just went through this with some 7.62 MG fired cases. I had to use a small base die to bump the shoulders back .10. Then FL size and trim. Took a while to process a 500 case batch.

.40

 

[William Dykstra]

I just went through this with some 7.62 MG fired cases. I had to use a small base die to bump the shoulders back .10. Then FL size and trim. Took a while to process a 500 case batch.

.40

Why is it that MG fired brass has issues with size? Is it something to do with how big the M240B chamber is?

 

[forty_caliber]

Why is it that MG fired brass has issues with size? Is it something to do with how big the M240B chamber is?

I think that this is the exact issue. Oversize chamber to reduce malfunctions in full auto.

.40

 

[MEHavey]

The brass is likely fine.
Using good case lube, Full length resize (die/shellholder contact +add'l 1/16 turn) ...
...and let us know

 

[William Dykstra]

The brass is likely fine.
Using good case lube, Full length resize (die/shellholder contact +add'l 1/16 turn) ...
...and let us know

Ok, so I ran over to Cabela's a bought a case gauge, some rcbs reloading dies (green box FL), and some case lube. I put the Sig .308 brass in the holder and it fits fine. When I put the LC brass in it poked out a little. I resized it and put in the case gauge again and it poked out a little less. I tried moving the dies up off the case holder on the ram just a little, but that didn't help any. Then I screwed the die down so the ram and caseholder could go up all the way. I put it in the gauge and it only pokes out just slightly (only about .004-.005). I tried putting it in the Remington and the bolt still didn't close.

 

[forty_caliber]

I still think you need a small base die to get this brass working. Need to bump the shoulders back. This is the product that I used on mine.
7690106 MSR Precision 3-Die System.308 Winchester

.40

 

[NoName47]

Then I screwed the die down so the ram and caseholder could go up all the way. I put it in the gauge and it only pokes out just slightly (only about .004-.005).

You need to screw the die in farther. Ram up die down till it touches shell holder and then another 1/8th turn. Your press should cam over the slightest. I never use a case gauge, just get a headspace gauge for your calipers and measure a fired case and set the die to bump the shoulder 3 thou.

 

[NoName47]

I still think you need a small base die to get this brass working

All a small base die does is size the base beyond saami specs to ensure reliable feeding in semi autos or full autos if your lucky enough to own one.

 

[William Dykstra]

I still think you need a small base die to get this brass working. Need to bump the shoulders back. This is the product that I used on mine.
7690106 MSR Precision 3-Die System.308 Winchester

.40

I've run it through my RCBS Small Base Die and i can't for the life of me get it to go all the way in. I'm going to be patient with this brass though.

 

[Average Joe]

I have the same problem with my Rem 700. I pick up range brass and resize, trim, and it passes the gauge test. It will chamber and shoot fine in my M1A. I messed around with the shoulder and still it would not chamber in the Remington 700. I just save that brass for the M1A, I know this doesn't solve your problem, but that's what I do.
I might add, that the range brass I acquire, is mixed, and most brands will chamber, and those I use for the Rem 700. I don't fight it anymore, I just go with the flow....

 

[NoName47]

I've run it through my RCBS Small Base Die and i can't for the life of me get it to go all the way in. I'm going to be patient with this brass though.

#1 rule never force a case into a sizing die. It will get stuck and you will have the most fun of your life getting it out

 

[Charlie98]

My experience with ‘once-fired’ brass... and particularly with Scarch (Top Brass) is a tale of woe. When I get near my computer, I can post all sorts of case failures with that brass (out of only 2k cases,) some on the initial loading. I’ve sworn completely off any sort of once fired brass... unless it’s my once-fired.