Unintentional Discharge with 1911 in Public Bathroom

Status
Not open for further replies.
Those of us with Titanium firing pins, just breathed a tad bit easier.. OK I was breathing easy before. I just like my facts and data. :)

The Wilson site does not say anything I can see (quickly) about the firing pin. I'd assume titanium. Hmmmmm
 
Breathe easy, Greg. Unless you're deliberately trying to drop the gun so it'll hit straight on the muzzle, the odds of it hitting the floor just right in a fumble are so slim, that you're probably more likely to be struck by lightning.

And even if the gods all line up against you, the bullet striking the ground perpendicularly is going to instantly lose so much velocity that it'll present little danger, other than possibly a few tiny fragments.

Seriously, though. If we worried about that .001% chance that we'd be killed on the highway on a given day, we'd never get behind the wheel.

I'd guess that for every 1911 that got dropped and fired, there have probably been 10,000 that were dropped and didn't. We don't hear much about those. Who comes onto a forum and reports that he dropped his pistol yesterday and nothing happened?

*shrug*
 
yeah I was taking it pretty easy. Still just curious about your outcomes. The picture posted leaves me more questions than answers. IF the thumb safety did pop out? (I can't see that it would) there would be more damage on the cocking serrations. How is the slide stuck mid stroke? I suppose the thumb safety could be pinching it but again how did it get popped up? It should be square edge to square edge. Shouldn't the cam inside on the thumb safety hook on the frame in the full up position as well as the full down? Someone besides wilson fit the thumb safety?
 
I am aware of one case where an (unspecified) .45 semi-auto pistol was dropped and landed on its muzzle (from around elbow height on a guy who is 5'9"). This was on a tiled bathroom floor in a house.
The chambered cartridge discharged and the round made a significant hole in the floor. Although I don't have any other details, the person who relayed this info to me witnessed the event directly and is reliable.
 
I am aware of one case where an (unspecified) .45 semi-auto pistol was dropped and landed on its muzzle (from around elbow height on a guy who is 5'9").
Click to expand...

Certainly possible, and offers proof that changing out the firing pin spring regularly is a good idea.

This was on a tiled bathroom floor in a house.
The chambered cartridge discharged and the round made a significant hole in the floor.
Click to expand...

Well...most bathroom tiles are pretty thin, and not much more than glazed Plaster of Paris. When I was a kid, we used to bust old tile squares taped to a clothesline with a pump-up pellet rifle.

Not exactly in the bulletproof category.
 
1911; I integrated an anecdote from this thread in to my pistol class yesterday.

"A dropped gun is all trigger, don't grab it"

And..

"Don't drop a loaded gun."

(A student asked about what happens if revolvers were dropped, as we were on a tangent about shoulder holsters and why I don't like them.. and it reminded me of this thread.)
 
ATLDave said:"If your holster dumps your pistol any time there's not belt tension on the holster, then it's probably time for a new holster."


Agree, bad holster.
 
"Heretofore, in the pistols of this class, when the hammer was cocked ready for firing and it became necessary to lower the hammer to the safety position without allowing it to touch the firing pin, it required both hands of the user to accomplish this act."
Click to expand...

The "Heretofore" part is to describe the other technology up to the development of this innovation. So this sentence is not describing the use of the gun in the patent, but other guns "of this class" until this new development. And since the inertial firing pin was something that other pistols "of this class" lacked, you had to use the half cock as a safety position. This section is a prelude to a description of a better way of controlling the hammer when de-cocking, and not a section describing any carry safety system.

Browning developed two different hammer down safety systems to purposely avoid lowering the hammer to half cock. It is a real logical leap to go from the patent's description of other pistols that lacked his patented inertial firing pin as endorsements of that type of carry. If anything, Brownings inventions show a strong distrust of half cock.

The primary function of the half cock notch is to catch the hammer should it inadvertently slip or bounce off of full cock, or slip off the thumb while cocking. It takes a pretty huge imagination to see the quoted passage as anything else.
 
There is no excuse for this to keep happening. 44 years of daily carry and I never had a gun fall out of a holster in a bathroom. it's just negligence as far as I am concerned. Take the gun and holster off and stick it in your pants until you are done.
 
Someone has already mentioned titanium firing pins and extra power springs- that's all I use for what it's worth.

I believe I read you can drop a titanium firing pin/extra power spring equipped 1911 from 60" on the muzzle without it going off.
 
And since the inertial firing pin was something that other pistols "of this class" lacked, you had to use the half cock as a safety position.
Click to expand...

"Guns of this class" in this case were the 1907 and 1909s, which did have the inertial firing pins and could be carried at half cock and hammer down...and if I remember correctly...so did the 1905.

The concealed hammer guns all had manual "thumb" safeties.

Browning developed two different hammer down safety systems to purposely avoid lowering the hammer to half cock.
Click to expand...

All of Browning's exposed hammer guns used a similar half cock for the safety position...inertial pin or no. The 92 and 94 Winchesters couldn't be maintained with loaded chambers and the hammer full down...so the half cock was the only safe position unless the chamber was empty.

The primary function of the half cock notch is to catch the hammer should it inadvertently slip or bounce off of full cock, or slip off the thumb while cocking.
Click to expand...

Then why wasn't a simple flat shelf used instead of going to the trouble of making a fairly complex cut to form the captive notch that interlocked the hammer and sear, and prevented the sear from escaping regardless of how hard the trigger was pulled?

Why do that?

It doesn't follow logic to tie up a machine...tooling...time and manpower and spend money...to do it the hard way.

A flat shelf would have served the same purpose, and it would have been faster and cheaper to produce the hammers with a flat shelf. I'm pretty sure that didn't escape the notice of the engineers at Colt...whose jobs were partly finding ways to reduce production costs and speed up delivery on the contract.

These are questions that we ask ourselves when we're trying to get into a long-dead designer's head to figure out why he did something the way that he did it...because there's always a reason...whether it's apparent to us or not...and regardless of what we may believe.

Designers and engineers never do anything "just because."

If its only function was arresting a wayward hammer, it could have been a lot simpler. It would have been a lot simpler. If you'd ever worked on a contract in a production shop, that much would be apparent to you.

Time is money. A machine in use is money. Tooling is money. A man occupied running that machine is money. The bottom line is money. Not doing it the hard way just because you can.
 
whoever posted this said:
Gun-happy amateurs like this can get people killed. If you're going to take on the responsibility of carrying a loaded weapon, get training first so you know what you're doing. The general public is not the place to be field testing your methods.
Click to expand...

Yes, because I'm sure Gunsite and Thunder Ranch hold
"TACTICAL CRAPPING" classes, with Magpul's upcoming "THE DYNAMIC ART OF DEUCE DROPPING.

Lighten up.
 
The 1905 is another Browning/Colt patent, not the competition who didn't have inertial pins. Colt isn't competing with its own patents - stating the expectation of firearms users of the time who might know about Winchesters or Mauser's is normal for a patent.

The half cock hook is there so the shooter can't attempt to fire from half cock AND to catch a sear with a broken tip. That hook will catch what a shelf would not.

Please stop telling people that a 1911 half cock is an intended carry safety. Someone is going to take that as advice and get killed when the gun falls on the hammer and fires.
 
aaaaand there's why I carry hammer down with the safety on. SMH. Like you really need a cocked and locked 1911 at work. Idiots.
Click to expand...

You have got to love absolutes! Anyone who carries cocked and locked at work is an idiot.

Therefore by logic... Delta operators are idiots... FBI HRT.... idiots.... LAPD Swat team... idiots... my local sheriff... idiot... me, well obviously I am an idiot... I don't understand the design of the 1911 at all.

Learn something every day.
 
Golden Saber said:
aaaaand there's why I carry hammer down with the safety on. SMH. Like you really need a cocked and locked 1911 at work. Idiots
Click to expand...

Having read your commentary thus far, I'm reminded of the "people in glass houses..." line. I'd guess there are probably several hundred man-years of people carrying John Browning designs cocked and locked without incident in this forum. You seem a bit hasty in your conclusions.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

P
  • Locked
How Unintentional Discharges Happen
2 3
Replies
67
Views
6K
teknical
T
A
  • Locked
Spontaneous Discharge of a Firearm in an MR Imaging Environment
Replies
1
Views
389
Trebor
T
B
  • Locked
Accidental discharge wasn't
2 3
Replies
54
Views
4K
texlaw67235
T
R
  • Locked
Dude carrying a gun in public in VA has an AD that ends in his own death
2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Replies
180
Views
9K
230therapy
2
JohnKSa
  • Locked
There's no reason for this to EVER happen.
2 3 4 5
Replies
116
Views
7K
Dibbs
D
Back
Top