Walther P-1 reassembly question

[alamo]

Very technical question for any P-1 expert.

I got a P-1 from SOG last week and I took it apart to give it a good cleaning / inspection. This is an older one (12/60 acceptance date) so it doesn't have the reinforcing bar. Took the top cover off and removed the signal pin and firing pin. I noticed that the clip on the firing pin spring that fits on the signal pin was positioned in the middle of the signal pin, on the part of it that flares out a bit.

In all the diagrams in the manual I bought at a gunshow (Walther P-38 Pistol by Major George Nonte) the firing pin spring clip is on the forward "wings" (or whatever they are called) of the signal pin. When reassembling, I put it on that part but the clip is loose and it wouldn't stay there, it slid back towards the middle. I went ahead and reassembled as it was. I've cocked the hammer and pushed on the back of the firing pin and I can feel the tension of the firing pin spring.

Do I need to clamp the clip down on the forward part of the signal pin so it stays put or is it OK the way it is - loose and slides back to the middle signal pin?

 

[dfariswheel]

Ok, I'm not sure what you've got but:

The diagrams all appear to show the firing pin spring coil section being put on the SIGNAL pin. The coil section goes on the FIRING pin.

The firing pin spring goes on the front of the firing pin, with the "clip" portion facing to the rear, and hooked over the signal pin.
The "clip" is offset on one side of the spring body, and the "clip" must be rotated to the top, so it lays on the top of the firing pin, and the signal pin is inserted under the "clip" portion.

So, with the slide cover off, you should have the firing pin spring over the front of the firing pin, the "clip" portion facing rearward, and rotated up, with the signal slid underneath the "clip" and the signal pin spring on the rear of the signal pin.

What can happen, is the "clip' portion can be bent if put into the gun with the spring upside down. In this position, the "clip" must be pulled up too far to fit over the signal pin, and when it's repositioned properly, it may not have enough tension.

 

[alamo]

Thanks for the input. I posted this on the P-38 Forum and got no responses. I've got everything set up right. The firing pin spring is on the firing pin and the signal pin is under the clip. My question is at what point on the signal pin must the clip be on? When I took the cover off, it was in the middle of the signal pin. On the diagrams it is hooked on the forward part of the signal pin on the outward protrusions or little "wings" as I would call them. My clip is larger than the wings and won't stay hooked on the wings. Tipping the gun upwards will cause it to slide back to the middle. Maybe this is normal? It's just when looking at the cut-away diagrams showing the pistol in the firing sequence, it is always hooked on the forward wings of the signal pin, not in the middle.
I could clamp the clip down some so it would stay on the wings but I'm not certain if that is what I need to do.

 

[Jim K]

The square part of the firing pin spring extension (what you seem to be calling the "clip") fits over the long flat part of the signal pin (yes, the MIDDLE of the signal pin). It has to pull the signal pin down, since a round being loaded pushes it up.

In assembly, the firing pin is inserted first with the coil part of its spring on the front end and the spring extension to the rear. Then the signal pin is slipped beneath the extension. The signal pin is kept forward by a separate coil spring that fits over the rear end with a large end that butts against the back of the slide cutout.

After making sure everything is correct, the rear of the top cover ("der deckel") is slipped into the notch in the front of the rear sight and then moved down and forward and given a solid rap on the top front to snap it into the slide cutout. (Use a block of wood or a plastic hammer for this to avoid marring the top cover.)

Don't take the cover off too often; if it loses its spring it can fly off in firing and the rear sight and other parts can go off into the boondocks. (One of the drawbacks of the P.38/P1 is that a pierced primer will almost always blow off the "deckel".)

HTH

Jim

 

[alamo]

Thanks Jim, that's what I needed to know. I will take it off one more time to make sure it's right and then leave it alone. It was difficult to put back on as I had never done it before. I struggled with it for awhile and didn't see anyway it was going back in and then it suddenly went in. It makes you appreciate the relatively easy disassembly of most modern pistols compared to the P-38.

 

[denfoote]

I was looking at my P38 factory manual and I still can't figure out what you did!! For normal cleaning, the P38 comes apart into four pieces: Slide, barrel/locking block, frame, and mag!! It's no harder to put back together than my Taurus PT92 AFS, or my P5. Both of which use the same system!! I guess you just have to be used to it or something!!

 

[alamo]

I was taking it completely apart as it was "new" to make sure it was all clean and to familiarize myself with it. Have you ever seen the top plate on your P-38? Take off sometime remove all the internal parts and put them back in and put the top plate back on. It's loads of fun if you've never done it before

 

[denfoote]

The manual reads: "Die pistole ist ihre 4 Haupteile zerlegt und kann nun gereinigt werden. Ein weiteres Zerlegen der pistole ist bei Bedarf nur vom Fachmann vorzunehmen."

Which (loosely translated) means: "This pistol comes apart in 4 pieces!! Don't even think about trying to take it apart any further, unless yur a friggin gunsmith!!"

I ain't no gunsmith!!!

 

[Jim K]

I seldom recommend removal of the top cover, but if one must, here is the way. Make sure the gun is unloaded.

Take the slide off the frame and separate it from the barrel. Then insert a screwdriver up from the bottom of the slide with the handle at about a 90 degree angle to the slide. With the screwdriver blade, push the signal pin back out of the way, and insert the blade up undeneath the front lip of the cover. Hold the rear sight (to prevent parts from flying), rap the screwdriver handle on the bench and the cover will pop right off. Put it back on as described in my previous post.

Actually, the P.38 was considered at the time to be quite an easy pistol to detail strip. Field stripping is simple, and there are fewer loose parts than on a 1911; nothing requires a pin punch. The magazine can be used to loosen the grip screw. Many modern guns are much harder.

Jim

 

[alamo]

Good info., thanks. I only took the cover off because it was a surplus pistol that is 42 years old and I wanted to make sure everything was OK in there and familiarize myself with it. Once I make sure the spring is set correctly, I don't anticipate taking it off again. It is easy to take it apart into the basic componets, it was that top cover reassembly and getting all the parts in there correctly that was a bit challenging for the first time. I've never seen something like a top cover on any other pistols. The only other pistols I've taken completely apart are the Makarov, Kel-Tec P-11 & P-32 and Glock 19.