What do YOU do with a Spotting Scope?

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Omnivore

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I have my own ideas about what a spotting scope is for, but they seem at odds with the people who design and manufacture them. I am therefore super curious what you actually do with yours: What type of shooting, hunting etc., how you support it, adjust it, what are you looking at, who's doing the looking (you, the shooter, or someone else acting as your spotter) and anything else you can tell me.

No theory please (as in "you could do this or you could do that") I just want to know what you actually do.

Thanks.
 
last trip to range was 3 guys and one 22 rifle. One shot, one reloaded the magazines and one looked through the scope and called location of hit.

Usually I use the spotting scope to help sight in and that's about it.
 
Kowa 821M with 27x long eye relief eyepiece on a Ray-Vin Spotting Scope Stand.

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Picture in simulated use for standing.

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Picture in simulated use for standing, at another angle.

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Picture as mounted to cart for transportation between firing lines.

This is setup specifically for High Power (NRA and CMP) Rifle 'Across the Course'.

My main uses for the spotting scope in competitions is:

1. To see the shot spotter (shot location) and the scoring disc (shot score).

2. See the mirage to call wind speed and direction.

When practicing at the range where I don't have target pits/service, the main use is to spot the holes in my target.

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Picture taken of me at the Creedmoor Cup during the 80 round aggregate while on the 300 yard line. This is the same scope, but with my old Creedmoor generic scope stand.
 
Range for me to see where I am hitting. My brother in law is really into Mulies and he sits on top of hills looking for a deer to put the stalk on.
 
Offroad; What distance? Distance is key. I forgot to put that in my list of questions. Caliber is good to know too. Thanks for that.

Also; It would be good to know whether people are using a rifle scope, and if so, the scope's magnification.
 
Ocabj: Wow, thanks. How do you adjust the scope for "aiming" it? Do you have a T&E mount, or do you just yank on it (like a typical camera tripod)? I'm not sure from looking at the pics.
 
For me 300yards 6.5x20 .308. My eyes aren't what they used to be and actually used it @ 100yds on my kids .243 4 power scope.
 
I don't want to try to describe the mechanism of the Ray-Vin scope head, because it will definitely come out very confusing.

Check out this product page for info:

http://www.ray-vin.com/scopestands/scopehead.htm

But it basically allows you to reposition the scope however you want it. If you have a scope without a rotation collar on the body, this scope head is a definitely must have for position shooting. The Kowa 821M has a rotating collar, though.
 
my setup and use is identical to ocabj except I don't have the ray-vin stuff and i use the freeland stand (a little cheaper than ocabj's setup)

http://www.championshooters.com/store/product.php?productid=418&cat=283&page=1

here's a closeup of the head
http://www.championshooters.com/store/product.php?productid=418&cat=283&page=1

when shooting HP across the course or long range, you also need the spotting scope to score other people's targets, but primarily, as ocabj said, it's for reading the wind.
 
I work on the 11th floor of an office building in downtown Denver. Mine comes in handy for people watching. I need to bring it to work Monday, the DCN is going on, maybe I can see some action! boxing2.gif
 
ocabj: I plan on updating my scope stand and am trying to decide between several manufacturers, including Ray Vin, Giraud and First Strike. I have been to all of their web sites and have read Ray Vin's handy comparison chart. I use a scope mostly for high power shoots and am looking for a simple to operate head that will support a relatively heavy scope- my sixty plus ounce Leupold is about ten ounces heavier than Kowa's 821 and a sturdy (read, steady in gusty winds) stand.

So I'd appreciate your experience (likes and dislikes) with Ray Vin's product(s). Thanks.
 
3Pairs; Yes, a good 4x will have trouble resolving small bullet holes for me at 100 in good conditions.

ocabj; Yes, I've run into the ray-vin stuff after much searching. I guess if you look enough you're going to come to the same places. Thank you for the info and the pics.
 
SwampWolf: The Ray-Vin head will handle your scope.

As far as which stand and head combination to get, I think it's a pretty difficult choice. The Ray-Vin, Creedmoor Big Blue, and the Giraud are probably considered the top scope stands and heads.

One primary reason I wanted the Ray-Vin is because I already had a Ray-Vin cart and I liked the tow-kit capability to hook the scope stand up to the cart for carting from line to line.

The scope head does work, and while it does allow for one hand manipulation for minor adjustments, you do have to learn how to use the scope head to take advantage of that. I thought about getting the Creedmoor Big Blue head to use on my Ray-Vin scope stand for more offset. But I may have someone machine a rail for me that will hook up to the scope head, and then my scope to the rail so I can have the scope set back closer to me aft-wise, like David Tubb has his scope setup for prone (such that he can see through the scope while at the same time still be in position to take the shot).

So which scope stand? I honestly can't give you a definitive answer. I do like my Ray-Vin stand, though. Your best bet is to go to a match and see if the other shooters will let you test out their stands to get a real hands-on test of the stand.
 
I was at a convention hospitality room a week or so ago.
The hospitality room was on the 30th floor of the hotel.
They had an end table pulled over near the window with a spotting scope on it and a big bowl of money. A sign read that the money was being donated to a cancer charity. You had to make a donation to look through the spotting scope. I threw a buck in the bowl and took a look. Turns out the hotel room was over looking the European style pool. :D
They collected thousands.
 
Conclusions so far

Not that it's a huge sample, but the results are about what I figured:

Most people use a spotter to see bullet holes (or otherwise spot their shots) and/or to dope the wind while shooting, or while in close proximity to the shooter.

A few people use a spotter to locate game, so I'll define that as a secondary application, which could probably be satisfied with some 10 x 50 binocs. With much greater magnification than that, you'll need a stand for the optic. Otherwise the jiggle from touching the optic will tend to erase any additional resolution.

That's why I can't figure out why some "spotting scopes" are made at all. To my thinking, there are some of what we in the design business call "constraints" that aren’t being met. If you're building automobiles for instance, one definite constraint would be that the car must have enough room for a driver. Another constraint would be that the car must get you (and some minimal amount of your stuff) from point A to point B faster and/or easier than walking, etc.. You get the point.

There is another class of requirements that I'll call "design goals". For a car, one design goal might be that the car must be visually attractive. Another would be that it should cost less than a year's pay for the average American. While not absolute constraints, those are reasonable goals.

Since a spotting scope is used by a shooter while shooting, or by a separate person acting as a spotter for a shooter in the process of shooting, one hard constraint, I would think, would be that the scope have enough eye relief to be used at all magnifications while wearing glasses (you're never supposed to shoot, or be with a shooter, without those safety glasses, right?).

Yet that eliminates the majority of "spotting scopes" on the market, right there in one fell swoop. I have looked at entire inventories in more than one gun store and not found a single spotter that allowed me to use glasses.

Another constraint would be that the spotter's optics have better resolution than that of the gun sight. This one gets more personal, or situational. If you're using a high quality 20x riflescope, you're going to want a higher quality spotter, probably with more magnification. Otherwise you can "spot" using your riflescope.

You have no use for a separate optic unless it can resolve as well or better than your gunsight.

If you're using iron sights, your spotter will still need to detect mirage and see bullet holes.

If you're shooting at 100 yards or less, probably the cheapest of the cheap scopes will do-- except that they never seem to have the eye relief to use them without violating range rules regarding eye protection. May as well use a medium quality pair of 8x or 10x binoculars-- they're more versatile anyway. At 100 yards with a decent 8x rifle scope, you can see your bullet holes, down to 22 caliber, just fine. You don't need to dope wind at 100, so you don't need a spotting scope unless your sight has less than about 8x magnification or is of poor quality (but then why buy a poor quality rifle scope and a poor quality spotting scope, when you could just get one good riflescope). Once you get out to 200, 300 and especially beyond 300, you need some pretty good optics. Otherwise don't even think about seeing bullet holes. This is where a spotting scope comes in, no matter what, and it has to be a good one.

Then there are the scope stands. I've tried camera tripods and the little 6" thingies that come with cheap spotting scopes. Very cumbersome. A day using that setup and you're tired and a little frustrated. I got a celestial 'scope stand that has T&E (traversing and elevation) fine-tuning at the turn of a crank. Much, much better for getting on target, really nice, but the tripod configuration tends to get in your way. Serviceable, but sub optimal, plus it can't be used shooting prone when alone-- it can't get nearly low enough. So we come to the stands and adjustable heads that the Highpower shooters use. It's going to be a support base with a single, vertical pole for height adjustment that supports prone shooting and standing.

No gun store I've ever seen (or most of the on-line shooter's suppliers) has anything like that in stock. You have to get them from specialty shops. Good thing we have Google.

The choices are very few in optics, and then you need a custom stand and a custom head.

What gives, Man? Maybe the market is too small, but in that case, why is there all that unusable stuff on the market? You see it everywhere and from some pretty big name brands.
<rant="off>
 
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