What good are 'weapon free zones'

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Shadow 7D

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*while this thread was in part inspired by the school shooting today, it IS NOT about it, rather I would like a place to discuss the pro's - and yeah I don't personally see any, and cons of a 'gun free zone'*


I personally don't see any point to them, other than harassment of *mostly* law abiding citizens and as a bingo charge (usually dropped or plead away) to add to a criminal. Israel had problems with islamic terrorists attacking schools to hold the students hostage or massacre them, their response was to arm teachers, when was the last time you heard of a Hamas attack on an Israeli school? A nut case in England attacked a school, and they banned guns (mostly) and yet the gun crime has risen dramatically since then.


We all know a brady bunch push is coming, lets air our views on 'gun free zones' or as others put it, 'victim disarmament zones'
 
In my opinion, it's ok to prohibit guns in certain locations such as a courthouse or school or secure area of airport. But, (and this is a big but), only on the condition that the owner of that location guarantees the safety of the occupants, provides security and other measures to ensure that weapons are not being brought in (think metal detectors at airports), and is liable to a person that is injured by an attack from another person.

In other words, if you are going to remove a person's ability to fully protect themself, then you must be willing to step in and guarantee that person's safety. You shouldn't be able to simply call a place a "gun free zone" and then leave all the law-abiding citizens as sitting ducks.
 
In my kids .S. amongst the teachers are a retired Captain U.S.M.C. and a certified LEO who is working as a teacher. I certainly think they would make a more rapid response than waiting for the police to arrive, this would involve a massive 180 degree change of opinion by the people in charge of the school, but it would be legal in my state if the Superintendant signed off on it.
 
Phatty said:
In my opinion, it's ok to prohibit guns in certain locations such as a courthouse or school or secure area of airport. But, (and this is a big but), only on the condition that the owner of that location guarantees the safety of the occupants, provides security and other measures to ensure that weapons are not being brought in (think metal detectors at airports), and is liable to a person that is injured by an attack from another person.

In other words, if you are going to remove a person's ability to fully protect themself, then you must be willing to step in and guarantee that person's safety. You shouldn't be able to simply call a place a "gun free zone" and then leave all the law-abiding citizens as sitting ducks.
Click to expand...
Please show me ANYWHERE that is true.
 
They do no good. I am not convinced they do much harm frankly in terms of what some people say "if somebody had a gun, the thing would not have happened". I think very few people, if they had a gun, would or could act in such a way to change the outcome. That is citizens. Armed guards is a different story. Israel does it quite well. The place is an armed camp but you pretty much have to fire a rocket or set off a bomb to kill a large number of people. You pull out a gun, you're gonna be dead right there real quick just about anyplace. Churches, mosques, synegogs, schools, groceries, ballgames...all got guards armed to the teeth and trained well.
 
mgkdrgn said:
Please show me ANYWHERE that is true.
Click to expand...
And that is the crux of it
what 'security' measures may be taken are quite frankly either 'not enough' or just window dressing, what is to stop an armed gunman from shooting up a courthouse or airport, nothing (an there are more than a few courthouse shootings to tell you how effective that is...)
 
Armed guards everywhere? So that I can feel "safe"? We have them, they are called "police", and they don't make me feel very safe. No thanks, I'll take my chances, and live with the understanding that the tradeoff for living in a first world country that recognizes most of my rights, is the occasional tragic and unnecessary loss of innocent life in situations such as this.
We live in a country of 300 million plus people who have lots of time, relatively no hardships, and a disproportionate idea of the value of "things" and "stuff" as opposed to family and morality. These things will happen.
 
Literally - they enable the nannyists to fell good about one another and pat one another on the back at fund raisers and awards ceremonies.
 
We've beat the heck out of this topic on THR - the consensus is Gun Free Zones (or weapon free zones in other countries, like CHina, who also have a problem with mass murders in schools), is that

THEY DO NOT WORK.

Period.
 
Make up your own sign that reads "Shop owner has made this a death zone" and put a skull and cross bones just under the wording. Then whenever you see a shop that says "no guns allowed", just put up one of your signs. I am sure if you do it enough, you will see BOTH signs disappear.

Jim
 
I would rather think a small placard sized image of a gang banger (bandanna, hoody and sagging pants) mowing down patrons at a counter with the script
"Victim Disarmament Zone, criminals welcome"

would get the point across
 
Today's tragedy in CT show the uselessness of this "feel good" gun control activist favorite. Had one of the teachers or the principal (who was killed) had a CCW the carnage inflicted on the most innocent among us would have been greatly attenuated. Were else can a nut case inflict the most harm but a place they know there will be no other firearms but theirs.
 
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MSgtEgress said:
Today's tragedy in CT show the uselessness of this "feel good" gun control activist favorite. Had one of the teachers or the principal (who was killed) had a CCW the carnage inflicted on the most innocent among us would have been greatly attenuated. Were else can a nut case inflict the most harm but a place they know there will be on other firearms but theirs.
Click to expand...

+1 .
 
As Trent said, we've beaten the pinata of "GFZs" every few days for the last 10 years here. Do we really expect ANY ONE MEMBER to actually come up with a heartfelt defense of them? Or even try?

Sort of like a "Do you think guns are good?" thread. I guess I figure I could lay firm odds of the consensus.
 
Fine, then Sam
view this as a sharpening of the debate knives
we know it's coming, and this is a great place to put forward resources and cognizant arguments contrary to what the mass media is going to hype on this sad event.

AS THEY PUSH THEIR AGENDA AND TURN DOLLARS ON CHILDREN LIVES.
how do you stop it, say to a person, that contrary to what the guy raking in the blood money says, that's NOT how it works.

What line can you take to show the ineffectiveness of GFZ?
 
This is the pre-law degree coming out. The THEORY behind the gun free zone laws is a good idea. It attempts to slap strict penalties on people who bring firearms to gun free zones. However the practice falls very short of the goal as we all know: CCW rates offer better deterrent than penalties for breaking the law. And most active shooter situations end in the shooter dying before seeing a courtroom. Either put down by law enforcement or themselves.
 
'weapon free zones' are free fire kill zones.

That has been proven over and over again but sadly too many people are too stupid to understand that.
 
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