What no to do with a Winchester 1873 Rifle

[Doug Bowser]

What not to do to a Winchester 1873 rifle

A man brought me a Winchester 1873 rifle in .38-40. His nephew bead blasted the metal and lost a large amount of screws and pins. I made new pins from old drill bits and I have a large selection of US thread screws. I had to turn the heads of the screws down and shorten them to fit. I decided to use a Plum Brown solution on the metal. The metal had to be heated to about 275 degrees. The Plum Brown solution has to be repeatedly oiled to stop the solution from working. Here is a photo of the rifle and action. The rifle was made over 100 years ago and the Nephew reduced its value by over $1200.00. A real HORROR STORY.

 

[ThomasT]

His nephew bead blasted the metal and lost a large amount of screws and pins.

Idiot.

 

[db_tanker]

man...the boy was trying to help but oh good LORD...

 

[Doug Bowser]

It was the best I could do under the circumstances.

 

[hq]

The rifle was made over 100 years ago and the Nephew reduced its value by over $1200.00. A real HORROR STORY.

It's not really the value, but providing that the rifle was in original configuration when he started, messing up a part of history. That's the main reason I'm about to do something drastic (but in a way period-correct) to another 100+ year old Winchester shortly, which I definitely wouldn't had it not been already ruined once. To look at the bright side of things, ignorant DIY-smiths create raw material to projects which no-one in their right mind would do to an unmolested gun.

 

[Panzerschwein]

I see, so looking at that rollmark on the barrel, is this a Winchester's?

So Colt's and Winchester's, but not Ruger's?

This is all terribly confusing, I'm giving myself hypertention just thinking about it!!

 

[ThomasT]

This is a Winchester. Colt and Ruger have nothing to do with it. The gun was designed and put into production in 1873. It was a heavy but very popular rifle chambered in at least 4 calibers I can think of and probably several more. Even after the lighter and more compact 1892 came out in most of the same calibers some would still only buy the 1873. IIRC they were still made after the start of the 20th century from left over parts.

I do not pretend to be a Winchester expert. I am going on my shaky memory of all the Mike Venturino articles I have read over the years. I am certain a real expert will be along shortly to straighten me out.

 

[FL-NC]

The things that amateur butchers do to fine guns out of sheer incompetence are disgusting. Some of the things I've seen done to 1911's and US military weapons has made me want to cry.

 

[22250Rem]

It's really sad what happens sometimes when well meaning but uninformed folks get involved in something like this. Stuff like that is what helps to keep Doug Turnbull in business. Only problem is that his work rightfully commands top dollar because it's recognized as one of the best. Some of the work they've done on stuff like 1873 Winchesters is absolutely stunning featuring period correct bluing and case hardening. If the owner were willing to invest some bucks they could get an estimate on a first class restoration from them at www. Turnbullrestoration.com . They aren't cheap but if you want the best there it is.

 

[LoonWulf]

I kinda like it.....not that i woulda done it, but i like the plum brown on the cleanish bead blast.

 

[Tommygunn]

The dust cover is pushed back too far; I presume the screw that forms the stop is missing. A new one might be obtainable through Numrich, or maybe Dixie Gunworks.

 

[Panzerschwein]

Well at least now that the collectors value is gone, you have no fears of taking it out to shoot. You don't have much collector's value left to harm!

 

[Doug Bowser]

The dust cover is pushed back too far; I presume the screw that forms the stop is missing. A new one might be obtainable through Numrich, or maybe Dixie Gunworks.

The screw was missing. I got a replacement from Dixie Gun Works.

 

[Doug Bowser]

Well at least now that the collectors value is gone, you have no fears of taking it out to shoot. You don't have much collector's value left to harm!

Believe it or not, the bore was decent.

 

[alsaqr]

Yeah, some guys should not be allowed to handle guns.

i sold a pristine Winchester model 1876 to a guy along with the original box and tag: Got a premium price for the gun. The new owner reduced the value of the gun to zero with one hand load.

 

[eastbank]

my Winchester 1873 in 38-40 made in1893, and a few others. I just can,t see why some one would degrade a fine piece of firearm history like that. eastbank.

 

[someguy2800]

Unfortunate it happened. I would have probably bought it at the reduced value (assuming it was for sale) polished away all the bead blasting, and had it blued. Original or not it would have been a prized shooter to me.

 

[hq]

polished away all the bead blasting, and had it blued.

Returning it to the condition it left the factory is IMO a very feasible option when the bubba'd gun in question is even somewhat rare. I've been slightly baffled for a long time that full restoration of vintage guns is so commonly frowned upon whereas much rarer cars are commonly restored to full OEM condition and revered unlike worn, faded and scratched examples. Guns too can be restored to a fantastic, correct LNIB spec and - frankly - if all the scratches, dents and worn-out finish don't specifically stand for something meaningful other than it only having been used by who-knows-who in who-knows-where, it's pretty hard to value it for any other reason than that's what you're expected to do.

Oh well. Maybe I shouldn't think too much.

 

[someguy2800]

Returning it to the condition it left the factory is IMO a very feasible option when the bubba'd gun in question is even somewhat rare. I've been slightly baffled for a long time that full restoration of vintage guns is so commonly frowned upon whereas much rarer cars are commonly restored to full OEM condition and revered unlike worn, faded and scratched examples. Guns too can be restored to a fantastic, correct LNIB spec and - frankly - if all the scratches, dents and worn-out finish don't specifically stand for something meaningful other than it only having been used by who-knows-who in who-knows-where, it's pretty hard to value it for any other reason than that's what you're expected to do.

Oh well. Maybe I shouldn't think too much.

I have to agree, I prefer a nicely refinished gun to one thats all beat up with no finish left on it. In fact I just bought a nicely refinished 1898 Krag rifle today.

 

[eastbank]

it would take a lot of refinishing and new wood to get that rifle to look any where close to new looking and still it would not look new close up. I don,t like or buy refinished older firearms, as a matter of fact I only own one refinished firearm out of several hundred and its a 98 mauser in 8mm done in the 60,s and by doing that they turned a mint german all matching 98 mauser into a 450-400 rifle at best over what it would be worth if left alone, close to 1500.00 or more today. eastbank.

 

[hq]

I have to agree, I prefer a nicely refinished gun to one thats all beat up with no finish left on it. In fact I just bought a nicely refinished 1898 Krag rifle today.

Congratulations. Nicely restored examples are few and far between.

I've gathered a number of more or less well-worn guns over the years for the exact purpose of either refinishing or "restification". Guns from 1910's to 1960's, rare enough to warrant a restoration but on the other hand worn, already modified and/or common enough for me not to shed a tear once they've lost their originality. When done properly they far exceed the standards of fit and finish they came with from the factory.

 

[eastbank]

the key word here is properly, and they cost money to have done right, most refinishing is a bad buff job(rounded edges,dished screw holes, markings buffed to death) and worse wood work. I have looked at a handled few like new antique winchester rifles, 1873,1876 and others and I have never seen a refinishing job that came close to a factory finish other than trumbull and he ain,t cheap. eastbank.

 

[Speedo66]

To each his own. Every '73 that somebody Bubbas up makes mine worth just that little bit more. lol

 

[someguy2800]

I see alot of old guns that are just so worn and beat up and brown that they have no apeal to me, but are still worth alot of money. I guess I just don't see how refinishing them to make them presentable is such a crime. Alot of people talk about trying to match the finish that the gun would have been made with but personally I don't really care what the factory finish on a certain gun was. As long as the end result is aesthetically pleasing to the person its being done for I don't think it matters if its "correct". Alot of the guns we consider rare and valuable are not in fact rare, they are just high in demand. Winchesters and Lugers are the ones that come to mind to me. They made gazillions of both and they are available absolutely everywhere to someone that wants to pay a dollar more than the next guy. Everybody wants one which makes them valuable but it doesn't make them all museum pieces. A 69 Camaro is valuable, a Ferrari Daytona is rare. If an 1873 that had been reblued and the stock refinished was only worth $100 and an original one with beat up wood and all the finish brown or worn off was worth $5000, I would rather have the refinished one.

 

[FN in MT]

Thankfully no one engraved the owners name, SSN and DOB on the side of the receiver with an electric pencil...seen quite a few firearms ruined by "Operation ID".