What smaller caliber do you recommend for predators to prairie dogs

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Asking this bunch what caliber they prefer is like asking a fat guy what he likes for dessert! We all have our opinions, even if we only have shot one rifle! Well, here is mine: everyone needs a 223 bolt rifle, hopefully with a faster twist barrel. Mine is a 10 twist and it can hit squirrels out to 500 fairly regularly. We have squirrels here, not PDs, ours are much smaller, about the size of a beer can standing up. I have several more calibers, some of which are much better at the intended squirrel grounds, however; a 223 is cheap to shoot, components are everywhere, if you have a 7 or 8 twist you can shoot long bullets with a high BC very well. With 40 grain Vmax pills, it is impressive on impact with a squirrel too.
 
Thanks for all the replies, I’m not planning on shooting p dogs at 1000, maybe not at all. I have the range to shoot 1050 yards right out the front of my shop. Me and my son were just doing it yesterday. We basically just got started that far last winter. But it sure is addicting. I’m thinking my next rifle something along the lines of a smaller caliber, but something I can pull out and shoot water jugs at my 1050 target. The p dog thing is just a dream for now, but want to do it someday and might as well have the rifle to do it with. And besides, it’s FUN.
 
Jpron said:
Thanks for all the replies, I’m not planning on shooting p dogs at 1000, maybe not at all. I have the range to shoot 1050 yards right out the front of my shop. Me and my son were just doing it yesterday. We basically just got started that far last winter. But it sure is addicting. I’m thinking my next rifle something along the lines of a smaller caliber, but something I can pull out and shoot water jugs at my 1050 target. The p dog thing is just a dream for now, but want to do it someday and might as well have the rifle to do it with. And besides, it’s FUN.
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If you’re doing a lot more target shooting out to 1050 and only maybe doing a little varminting, stick with the 6 creed, 6.5 Grendel, or 243win (my preference in that order). Your 6.5 Creed would make a lot more sense than spending money on a new rifle, and a 22cal will let you down often enough in the wind to make a 6mm or 6.5 worth it. You’ll really NEED a flasher on your 1050 target to notice impacts from the 22cals.
 
So long as you keep velocities down between the 2900-3100fps range or so(depending on bullet weight), a .243 will last a LONG time. My rifle's had thousands of rounds through it and I know for a fact it was built in 1963. It's my most accurate game rifle and about 4th overall with only my match rifles being able to hold sub MOA out to as far as I care to shoot. People who constantly try and achieve Max V and Max Q(pressure) loads are usually the ones who have very low barrel life. Also, I've seen allegedly "bad" barrels shoot MOA with a simple re-crown. It's amazing how much a compromised crown will affect long range accuracy and more importantly, long range consistency. Shoot reasonable loads, protect that crown, punch the barrel with a brass brush approx one time for every round down it...or 100 strokes if a long day...soaked with nothing more than good old Hoppes 9 and it'll outlast you.
 
I'm just wonderin'...can anyone even see a prairie dog on the ground at 1,000 yards? If so, those peepers are worlds better than mine :).

I'll third (or fourth?) the .22-250. That's an excellent round for all sorts of dogs, be they prairie or song...


Stay safe!
 
Riomouse911 said:
I'm just wonderin'...can anyone even see a prairie dog on the ground at 1,000 yards? If so, those peepers are worlds better than mine :).

I'll third (or fourth?) the .22-250. That's an excellent round for all sorts of dogs, be they prairie or song...


Stay safe!
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Are they the ones with horns and moo at you? My neighbor gets mad when I shoot at them.
 
So who makes a fast twist 22-250? And what barrel length we looking at? I should be looking at a 24 inch
 
Prairie dogs to predators? Biggest smaller predator - not an Alaskan Brown Bear, I presume - is possibly a wolf, more likely a coyote. And smaller stuff.

I reload and this may make some of my observations impractical.

I have a .22-250 Remington in a Remington 700. I like it but Remington decided I didn't need to shooter 'heavier' bullets in it and gave it a 1:12 twist. Which will not stabilize a 69 grain boat tail. I think a .22-250 would do a great job for most of the small stuff, but I think - and I confess I may be wrong - a 55 grain bullet is a bit light for coyotes or wolves.

So, I'd jump up to the 6mm or .243 caliber bore size. I think .243 Winchester is a bit light for deer and such - and I accept the different opinions of others - but it would be sensational for wolves, even fat wolves and anything smaller. Also Coyotes, Jackalopes, badgers (make sure to get them good the FIRST shot: my backup arm for badger is an M18 Claymore). However, one might consider a .243 Winchester a bit large for prairie dogs or squirrels.

My 'anything' rifle is an old sporterized M94 Swede carbine in 6.5x55mm Swede. But it is old, homely and not available right off the shelf.
 
A true varmint/predator rifle is not a 1000yd rifle. A 1000yd rifle is way over kill for shooting varmints/predators. Long range varmint rifle for me is the 22-250. The Swift is a good one as well. .224 Weatherby if you can find one. Under 400 yds the 223/5.56. Cheap to shoot, accurate and ammo is EVERYWHERE.
 
I have three friends that killed prairie dogs at 1,000 yards or more. Two used 6.5-06’s and one used a .308. All had high B.C. bullets.

Guys that are suggesting .222’s, .220 Swift, and .22-250’s have obviously never tried 1,000 yards. I do know guys that are making fast twist 250’s that would stretch that far, but again it’s with high BC bullets. Something with a BC in the.3’s and 4’s isn’t going to cut it.
 
"Guys that are suggesting .222’s, .220 Swift, and .22-250’s have obviously never tried 1,000 yards. I do know guys that are making fast twist 250’s that would stretch that far, but again it’s with high BC bullets. Something with a BC in the.3’s and 4’s isn’t going to cut it."
Not sure the guys suggesting 243 have either, yeah Whidden used one to win but his is a 1 in 7" twist IIRC with a 30" barrel and he shoots 105 Berger's at 3300 fps.
And still IMHO the 243 isn't a step away from 6.5 Creed
 
Jpron said:
So who makes a fast twist 22-250? And what barrel length we looking at? I should be looking at a 24 inch
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Savage makes a factory fast twist in one of the target models, or get a donor savage and have the fast twist barrel sent to you from shilen, criterion, mcgowen, etc.
Eta if you're anti savage, go remage.
 
27" less drop and 5" less drift per 10mph. Of course if you're shooting a off the shelf 243 the bullet probably never stabilized and no telling where it went.
Also I'm only getting 2950 with my 24" barrel with 107 SMKs because I'm loading to AR10 mag length. Plenty good for shooting at 1000 but I don't have the advantage on 6.5s that Whidden does.
 
The way I read the OP's question is that he wants something SMALLER than a 6.5 which will still "reach out" 1000yds.

I guess everyone has their own definition of "reach out". I guess my .22LR will technically "reach out" 1000yds if you're just looking to launch a projectile that far...

From my experience shooting and growing up in dirt dog country, as well as long range match shooting; There's no PRACTICAL and CONSISTENT round under 6mm(.243) which will fit that bill. Sure...a hot pea shooter will actually REACH 1000yds, however will it do so accurately and consistently? Not from what I've seen. To be honest, I don't think many people really appreciate just how far 1000yds really is to a shooter. There are a number of ranges built to be able to shoot service/high power matches. Those ranges are 600yds and are regularly shot with open sights and a .223(well, now the CMP allows scopes...but I still shoot peep). I was on the Viale range at Camp Perry (1000yd line) and took a poke with my world class accurate match rifle in .223 using 75gr A MAX bullets single fed. Because the .223 goes transonic out about 700-800yds...that extra 400yds is a WHOLE different game. Add to that...mirage, wind, light...I just don't think everyone who's talking about shooting 1000yds has actually toed the line and SHOT 1000yds on a regular basis, under match conditions, with a full value wind or with any consistency using small caliber rifles. Also, dialing in your zero elevation is pretty easy, calling wind is NOT as simple as looking it up on a chart. To say a known round will act the same from one second to the other is just false. You're calling wind, reading mirage...and then hopefully in the time it takes to decide to actually squeeze, the lock time on the firing pin and the bullet actually reaches that distance...it's all stayed the same. I was one of the people who thought Whidden was off his rocker when he showed up with that .243. But hey...he's got it down and you can't argue a 7x "clean" target at the National Matches. NOT my 1st or 2nd choice for that range but it works for him. But he has a "space gun" which is highly modified and he literally splits grains, turns necks, and may even shoot cryo rounds(some match shooters will actually carry their ammo in dry ice to ensure they're a constant temp...seriously. ). So it's also not the same "game" as buying a sporter and chucking factory ammo or even basic reloads out that far.

As always...just my opinions and observations.
 
CryptKeeper5 said:
The way I read the OP's question is that he wants something SMALLER than a 6.5 which will still "reach out" 1000yds.

I guess everyone has their own definition of "reach out". I guess my .22LR will technically "reach out" 1000yds if you're just looking to launch a projectile that far...

From my experience shooting and growing up in dirt dog country, as well as long range match shooting; There's no PRACTICAL and CONSISTENT round under 6mm(.243) which will fit that bill. Sure...a hot pea shooter will actually REACH 1000yds, however will it do so accurately and consistently? Not from what I've seen. To be honest, I don't think many people really appreciate just how far 1000yds really is to a shooter. There are a number of ranges built to be able to shoot service/high power matches. Those ranges are 600yds and are regularly shot with open sights and a .223(well, now the CMP allows scopes...but I still shoot peep). I was on the Viale range at Camp Perry (1000yd line) and took a poke with my world class accurate match rifle in .223 using 75gr A MAX bullets single fed. Because the .223 goes transonic out about 700-800yds...that extra 400yds is a WHOLE different game. Add to that...mirage, wind, light...I just don't think everyone who's talking about shooting 1000yds has actually toed the line and SHOT 1000yds on a regular basis, under match conditions, with a full value wind or with any consistency using small caliber rifles. Also, dialing in your zero elevation is pretty easy, calling wind is NOT as simple as looking it up on a chart. To say a known round will act the same from one second to the other is just false. You're calling wind, reading mirage...and then hopefully in the time it takes to decide to actually squeeze, the lock time on the firing pin and the bullet actually reaches that distance...it's all stayed the same. I was one of the people who thought Whidden was off his rocker when he showed up with that .243. But hey...he's got it down and you can't argue a 7x "clean" target at the National Matches. NOT my 1st or 2nd choice for that range but it works for him. But he has a "space gun" which is highly modified and he literally splits grains, turns necks, and may even shoot cryo rounds(some match shooters will actually carry their ammo in dry ice to ensure they're a constant temp...seriously. ). So it's also not the same "game" as buying a sporter and chucking factory ammo or even basic reloads out that far.

As always...just my opinions and observations.
Click to expand...
OP stated that he's not necessarily competing at 1000, just wants something to try and hit milk jugs at 1000. IMHO doing that with a 223 is more fun because of the added difficulty. And for the record 75gr ELDs loaded long are stable to 1000, very challenging in wind but stable.
 
witchhunter said:
Asking this bunch what caliber they prefer is like asking a fat guy what he likes for dessert! We all have our opinions, even if we only have shot one rifle! Well, here is mine: everyone needs a 223 bolt rifle, hopefully with a faster twist barrel. Mine is a 10 twist and it can hit squirrels out to 500 fairly regularly. We have squirrels here, not PDs, ours are much smaller, about the size of a beer can standing up. I have several more calibers, some of which are much better at the intended squirrel grounds, however; a 223 is cheap to shoot, components are everywhere, if you have a 7 or 8 twist you can shoot long bullets with a high BC very well. With 40 grain Vmax pills, it is impressive on impact with a squirrel too.
Click to expand...

I like your thinking and especially the first sentence in your post. :D I just took a .223 bolt gun to the LGS Saturday and put it on consignment. Prairiedogs have almost become like the dodo in my area and ground squirrels are seldom seen. About all that's left is coyotes and I have an AR set up for that situation.
 
I suggested 3 calibers that y'all just pooped on. But I also said it's up to the shooter to hit the target at that point. I've never shot even close to 1000 yds, but I wouldnt imagine a relatively small projectile (i.e 22 cal) to be as accurate at that range as something with more mass to it, such as a 308.

We have the room for 1000+ yd ranges here in KS but being one of the windiest states doesn't lend to good LR shooting. Out where the open expanses are, wind blows 30 mph over half the calendar days, and in multiple directions if you're in the Flint hills. IIRC KS has one 1000 yd+ range and it's in the SW corner, about 7 hours from me.
 
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