Why do you like DAO?
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James Bondrock
Member
On balance, I like DAO autos if they have a short and light trigger stroke, which the Smith DAOs do. (It is shorter and lighter than the typical DA pull of a traditional DA/SA pistol.) The advantage, for me, is the same pull for every shot, with no need for the DA to SA transition. A disadvantage (minor) is that it is more difficult to accurately place a long distance shot or a critical short distance shot (e.g., over a hostage's head). They will easily produce MOA (Minute of ???????
) accuracy at short range, however.
) accuracy at short range, however.10-Ring
Member
I like DAO for the consistent trigger pull from 1st round to last...it's really a matter of finding the right DAO system you like best from a DAO Smith or Beretta to the LDA from Para or LEM from HK.
wally
Member
IMHO Kahr and Glock are not true DAO -- the slide has to move back some to "reset" the trigger and partially cock the piece, hence no second strike on a hard primer by simply pulling the trigger (not that this is a real shortcoming).
DAO is my last choice. I only buy them if they have some special size/weight/power charactistics like the Kath PM40 and Kel-Tec P3AT do.
Cocked and locked is my preference -- all shots are the same and the trigger break is much more predictable.
The only thing I really like about DAO guns is they are truely ambidexterous.
--wally.
DAO is my last choice. I only buy them if they have some special size/weight/power charactistics like the Kath PM40 and Kel-Tec P3AT do.
Cocked and locked is my preference -- all shots are the same and the trigger break is much more predictable.
The only thing I really like about DAO guns is they are truely ambidexterous.
--wally.
Ivy Mike
Member
I prefer DAO for its ease and simplicity in operation. All you need to do is pull the trigger and she will go bang.
My FN Forty-Nine (.40S&W) is a DAO pistol. No external controls (except mag release) make it very good for concealed carry of a full size gun. The trigger pull is a stiff, but very even 10 pounds on my gun. It doesn't stack up at all. The RSS firing system also ensures a safe pistol until the trigger is pulled. There are no springs pulling the trigger and the entire action is totally at rest and blocked until the trigger is pulled.
Short story: even trigger pull, smooth sides, simple to use.
My FN Forty-Nine (.40S&W) is a DAO pistol. No external controls (except mag release) make it very good for concealed carry of a full size gun. The trigger pull is a stiff, but very even 10 pounds on my gun. It doesn't stack up at all. The RSS firing system also ensures a safe pistol until the trigger is pulled. There are no springs pulling the trigger and the entire action is totally at rest and blocked until the trigger is pulled.
Short story: even trigger pull, smooth sides, simple to use.
My Beretta 92D Centurion if fast and smooth and there is less to fool with in the heat of drawing and getting it into action. It's one gun that I wasn't sure I would like when I purchased it but has fast become a favorite gun to carry. I really prefer the DAO only autos now after using and getting used to the 92D.
JNewell
Member
Reduces the training issues associated with manual decocking.
Simplicity of controls makes them basically a flat revolver, with many of the advantages of that design.
For most users, I don't think not having the SA option is a significant handicap in a defensive weapon. We aren't talking about the HRT here.
Simplicity of controls makes them basically a flat revolver, with many of the advantages of that design.
For most users, I don't think not having the SA option is a significant handicap in a defensive weapon. We aren't talking about the HRT here.
JeffC
Member
I like my Beretta 96D Centurion's DAO pull, it's just like shooting a revolver in DA mode. I even pulled the sear out of my 92F and shot it DAO for awhile also.
At least on a Beretta, you have double strike capability. If the round doesn't go off the first time you can just pull the trigger again.
At least on a Beretta, you have double strike capability. If the round doesn't go off the first time you can just pull the trigger again.
wally
Member
When the first shot has to count, make mine SA.
Lots of shooting with DA/SA guns comapring the hits on target of the first DA shot vs. a SA followup shot has made all my DA/SA guns become safe queens.
DAO is more consistant, but I'm always more accurate with SA. Only my Glocks with 3.5 lb trigger connectors come close, and I think these are too light for safe carry. YMMV.
My first three autoloaders were DA/SA guns S&W 59, Beretta 92, & SIG 220. Now after many years I know what works best for me.
--wally.
Ivy Mike
Member
A manual safety is just one more item that could fail or be fumbled.
99% of the time its not a problem, but me and Murphy go back a long way. I'd hate to be introduced to him again if I actually had to use my guns.
I do own DA/SA weapons as well as DAO. Both types see carry duty.
99% of the time its not a problem, but me and Murphy go back a long way. I'd hate to be introduced to him again if I actually had to use my guns.
I do own DA/SA weapons as well as DAO. Both types see carry duty.
wally
Member
Count up the trigger parts in your DA/SA or DAO guns and compare to a 1911 SA with safety and you might not be so confident about who's side Mr. Murphy will be on These are low chance of failure parts and if the 1911 safety breaks it falls out taking the gun off safe.
If minimum parts count insured reliabilty, Jennings guns would be great!
--wally.
These are low chance of failure parts and if the 1911 safety breaks it falls out taking the gun off safe.If minimum parts count insured reliabilty, Jennings guns would be great!
--wally.
shoobe01
Member
Hardly anything is "true" DAO. Even the smiths pre-cock a little. Note you cannot restrike.
I like because:
I changed the springs on my smith 5946. Got a kit from Wolff. Can't remember the weight, but I think they offered labeled levels as well, so this was akin to "lighter, but still combat worthy. Don't worry about it." Loads of difference. And taking apart the trigger assembly was neat. Very cool little system, not many moving parts.
Oh, I also tossed the smith mag safety and drop safety while in there. That slicked it up even more, for anyone who does not have a service weapon.
The smith has an odd double reset, so practice till you are used to it. Again, not unlike a revolver, and it can be gotten over easily. A friend complains it stacks, but I think its pretty smooth, and pull thru pretty fast so it doesn't matter.
Getting caught up in the trap of slowly staging is a mistake. I do it sometimes, but its a mistake.
I would like to see someone make a real "revolver action" pistol. DAO till you thumb cock it, then the hammer is SA for that one shot only. Not needed, but fun and we can all justify it for that one head shot you just know it around the corner
In general -- like everyone seems to have something against mini 14s -- lots of people seem to be against DAO on principle. There was a recent incident with a crazy man taking a nurse hostage somewhere. Guard shot him effectively (but not to death) with a DAO 96. This seems to have worked out fine, but the writeup I saw of it impugned the caliber and action style. Like somehow it would have turned out just fine even /more/ with an SA in .45.
I like because:
- Slicker interface. Slick slide gun, no thumb safety, etc.
- The usual, consistent first to last. Why I sold all my DA/SA guns and went to all SAO or DAOs.
- I shoot it almost as well. And, better than a glock. This is from actually looking at my scores in IDPA. My 1911 will narrowly beat it often times, but not always. Revolvers are similar, and seem to still be the best shooters but for capacity.
I changed the springs on my smith 5946. Got a kit from Wolff. Can't remember the weight, but I think they offered labeled levels as well, so this was akin to "lighter, but still combat worthy. Don't worry about it." Loads of difference. And taking apart the trigger assembly was neat. Very cool little system, not many moving parts.
Oh, I also tossed the smith mag safety and drop safety while in there. That slicked it up even more, for anyone who does not have a service weapon.
The smith has an odd double reset, so practice till you are used to it. Again, not unlike a revolver, and it can be gotten over easily. A friend complains it stacks, but I think its pretty smooth, and pull thru pretty fast so it doesn't matter.
Getting caught up in the trap of slowly staging is a mistake. I do it sometimes, but its a mistake.
I would like to see someone make a real "revolver action" pistol. DAO till you thumb cock it, then the hammer is SA for that one shot only. Not needed, but fun and we can all justify it for that one head shot you just know it around the corner
In general -- like everyone seems to have something against mini 14s -- lots of people seem to be against DAO on principle. There was a recent incident with a crazy man taking a nurse hostage somewhere. Guard shot him effectively (but not to death) with a DAO 96. This seems to have worked out fine, but the writeup I saw of it impugned the caliber and action style. Like somehow it would have turned out just fine even /more/ with an SA in .45.
russlate
Member
DAO autos are just terribly wrong feeling to me, who knows why?
Shooting a revolver double action doesn't bother me or shooting an SA pistol with safety. I even have a DA/SA pistol that I like to carry.
But DAO pistols leave me standing there after the first shot wondering what malfunctioned. Instant brain fade.
Give me a single action auto. Or give me a DA revolver. Or give me a DA/SA auto. I can even make do if you give me a SA revolver! But please not a DAO auto!
Shooting a revolver double action doesn't bother me or shooting an SA pistol with safety. I even have a DA/SA pistol that I like to carry.
But DAO pistols leave me standing there after the first shot wondering what malfunctioned. Instant brain fade.
Give me a single action auto. Or give me a DA revolver. Or give me a DA/SA auto. I can even make do if you give me a SA revolver! But please not a DAO auto!
Most DAO triggers are atrocious and are little like a nice, smooth S&W revo DA trigger. If they had a decent feel like a S&W K-frame trigger, there would be much more acceptance.
That being said, I own 3 of 'em
1. AMT DAO Backup .45
2. Kel Tec P32
3. Kel-Tec P40
None of them are a joy to shoot. They are ugly, unelegant, pleasureless tools. I'd put most other DAO pistols in the same category.
They have their place.
That being said, I own 3 of 'em
1. AMT DAO Backup .45
2. Kel Tec P32
3. Kel-Tec P40
None of them are a joy to shoot. They are ugly, unelegant, pleasureless tools. I'd put most other DAO pistols in the same category.
They have their place.
MrPink
Member
I'm not a big fan of the DAO. Although I recently bought a SIG 229 DAK, so we'll see how it goes.
I'm a big fan of the 1911 and HK P7 and the SA trigger. That being said, I also think the criticism of the DA "chrunch-tick" is overblown. Years ago, I ran the DA-SA paired shot drill with my SIGs and have pretty much gotten use to it. I like the SA pull of a conventional DA and the first shot DA isn't so bad. If I need an accurate first shot, I can always cock it.
I'm a big fan of the 1911 and HK P7 and the SA trigger. That being said, I also think the criticism of the DA "chrunch-tick" is overblown. Years ago, I ran the DA-SA paired shot drill with my SIGs and have pretty much gotten use to it. I like the SA pull of a conventional DA and the first shot DA isn't so bad. If I need an accurate first shot, I can always cock it.
Coltdriver
Member
Like a revolver, you pull the weapon, pull the trigger and the gun goes bang.
Anybody can get good with a DAO trigger, it just takes practice and familiarity with your particular trigger.
Having to deal with a safety or cocking a weapon may not be to your advantage in a truly stressful situation.
Most of us "civilians" simply don't practice enough to remain cool and calm under the severe stress of a life threatening situation.
Certain other instinctive characteristics will also take over when a person finds themself in a life or death situation. You will compulsively stare at your threat, you will tend to square to your target and you will tend to squat a bit.
It takes a lot of drill to do anything else.
If you are looking for a target shooter, get a SA. But for defensive carry, a dao or a da/sa works best for me.
Anybody can get good with a DAO trigger, it just takes practice and familiarity with your particular trigger.
Having to deal with a safety or cocking a weapon may not be to your advantage in a truly stressful situation.
Most of us "civilians" simply don't practice enough to remain cool and calm under the severe stress of a life threatening situation.
Certain other instinctive characteristics will also take over when a person finds themself in a life or death situation. You will compulsively stare at your threat, you will tend to square to your target and you will tend to squat a bit.
It takes a lot of drill to do anything else.
If you are looking for a target shooter, get a SA. But for defensive carry, a dao or a da/sa works best for me.
cratz2
Member
Well, I guess I'm pretty easy to please... I grew up a 1911 guy and still love them. I currently carry a DA/SA decocker CZ PCR... Heck, I even like the Glock system, esp with the Ghost Rocket added. But out of the guns I've owned, I think the best trigger for carry is the Kahr system. Long enough for a bit of added safety, light enough for well placed shots... The Kahr isn't true DAO as repeated trigger pulls on an unloaded chamber will not result in repeated clicks...
I haven't found the ideal true DAO system yet... I love CZs, but their initial DA pull is definately longer and heavier than ideal but I do wonder what could possibly be done if converted to DAO and lightened.
Oh well... like I said, in the mean time, I'm pretty happy.
On the Smith system, it is decent as well, but I definately wouldn't want to rely on a well placed shot outside 10 yards or so. Even if I had all the time in the world but then, I haven't trained with one either.
I haven't found the ideal true DAO system yet... I love CZs, but their initial DA pull is definately longer and heavier than ideal but I do wonder what could possibly be done if converted to DAO and lightened.
Oh well... like I said, in the mean time, I'm pretty happy.
On the Smith system, it is decent as well, but I definately wouldn't want to rely on a well placed shot outside 10 yards or so. Even if I had all the time in the world but then, I haven't trained with one either.
JNewell
Member
I suspect that with adequate training, the only real disadvantage to DAO is that it's almost always going to give you slower splits. That's important for competition, but I'm not convinced that it makes a real world difference on the street. There's just too much stuff (polite word) going on and flying around when there's a deadly force threat presented...shaving hundredths of a second off a split is (my guess, YMMV) the least of your worries.
The DA/SA thing never slowed Ernie Langdon down.
The DA/SA thing never slowed Ernie Langdon down.
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