Why Low Gun?....

[Dave McCracken]

I had a good day today at the range. Shot well,despite some weatherbeaten clays that shattered on launch more than not. A series of No Targets would occur until either a whole target left the house or out of frustration we blasted the bigger pieces, oft on trajectories no trapshooter sees very often.

The Geezer League had major fun with those odd tracking discs. I shot a few with Superreverb's Parker Repro 20 gauge, and coveted yet another shotgun I do not own yet. It's like wielding a Rapier after using a Broadsword. A very pretty Rapier to boot.

After a few rounds of Trap, Handicap, Chinese Trap and Wobble, I headed home with a boxful of empty hulls and a smile. Before I left, though, one of the trap kids asked me why I shoot Low Gun.

Most folks in the traditional games of trap and skeet shoot with a gun mounted before calling for the target. This aids consistency, and those of us with shotguns that COULD fit better can scoosh around and get things lined up correctly first.

Back before I switched, I could run them often. It's harder now.

Premounting also helps getting on track a hair faster, a good thing where it's best to take the target close to the house.

And it's one less thing to go wrong in the short time frame of a shot opp.

So why shoot Low Gun?

First, I'm a shotgunner, not a trap, skeet or SC shooter. None of us walk through the fields and woods we hunt in with the gun up all the time.

Second, there's real advantages to Low Gun.

Shotgunning is a dynamic act. Mounting and shooting creates its own rythm. It gets the gun moving, and a moving gun is essential to hitting a moving target.

It reduces flinches, at least mine.

It also stops the arguments my eyes have as to which one is boss. IOW, it reduces or eliminates Mixed Dominance problems. Vision is focussed as it needs to be, on the target, and the gun appears peripherally.

It's no panacea, but a method that may help you.

Questions, comments, donations?....

 

[IDriveB5]

Ive recently started shooting lowgun for the reasons youve brought up. Bowlen's book had some points that, to me, seemed valid enough for a change.
My shotguns could fit better, and I'm still getting used to the new style of shooting, but its coming along well. If everything worked out perfect the first time, it wouldnt be much fun, would it?

 

[ezypikns]

Excellent Point

Especially since most of the skeet I shoot is in preparation for the opening day of dove season. I'll definitely give low gun a try.
Thanks again Dave, for another well written and thoughtful post.

 

[lawson]

now, i don't shoot Trap, Handicap, Chinese Wobble, or any of the other fancy games, and skeet shooting in my family has always been either a "bored on saturday afternoon" activity or "dove/quail season is about to open" practice.

but what you've said makes a lot of sense. in the bush, you don't walk around with your gun shouldered, unless maybe you saw a trio of birds land in the brush a few yards ahead of you.

because of that, when busting clays, i hold the gun the way i might hold it if i was walking around. it just makes sense.

 

[TrapperReady]

I shoot low gun probably 99% of the time at sporting clays, and I even drop the gun down a little bit between targets on almost all pairs. When shooting clay targets, it's critical to be able to clearly see the bird, and with the variety of presentations on a sporting clays course, it's even more complex than in trap and skeet. When shooting trap, that's usually acceptable, since you know where the target is going to appear and the barrel(s) won't obscure it enough to matter. In sporting clays, having the gun pre-mounted just puts a big metal thing into my field of vision

The other thing about low-gun is that I can better track the target's line by doing a "move, mount, shoot" than having the gun already on my shoulder. On crossers with the gun pre-mounted, I end up being "too precise" and aiming instead of pointing, which often results in a miss.

By dropping the gun out of my shoulder pocket between birds on a pair, it seperates the shots and gets me onto the correct target line. If I shoot low gun for the first bird and then just swing over to the other bird, I'll often just come across and not be on line. This severely reduces the margin of error. The only real exception is with true pairs which are on similar trajectories. Then, I'll often take the rear bird and then just keep my swing going through the front one and pull the trigger again.

For that other 1% (actually, it's far less than that) when I do shoot pre-mounted, it's typically on trap-style shots where I'm trying to hammer a long/fast first shot and get onto the second of the pair rapidly. It's a rare thing, but an important tool to have.

When I shoot trap, my scores are slightly better shooting pre-mounted. I've never tried skeet pre-mounted... it just seems wrong, for me.

 

[Ed/Pa]

Watch what you say about Low gun, You may offend a lotta people by being able to break clay targets that way. Heck, shooting that way for hunting is one thing, but doing at the trap range or skeet range just aint natural.....ha

 

[Larry Ashcraft]

I've always shot low gun. it's the only natural position for me.

Take a look at this link. http://www.chieftain.com/sports/1154013206/8
The kid on the right, the Shinovich kid. I talked to him this morning. He has been training at the Olympic Training Center in Colorado Springs.

He shot International Skeet for the first time the other day. Ran 50 straight. The trainers said it's been done before by a first timer, they just can't remember when.

97 MPH targets from low gun? Sounds impossible. This HS kid done it. Probably nobody told him he couldn't.

Last Friday we were hunting doves behind the barn. If one came across the field, and I had all day to figure out my lead, I missed it most every time. The ones that came rocketing over the barn, giving me maybe 1.5 seconds to react, were toast.

Point is, if the instincts are there, and the human computer is working, gimme low gun every time.

 

[sm]

How raised - what you do.

And for all the reasons already mentioned, and so many many more.

 

[TrapperReady]

Larry - On the long incomers which you can see from the next zip code, they're easy to hit if you just wait. I won't budge the gun until I can see detail on the bird (usually an eye or feather patterns), at which point they are (A) close and (B) I have to shoot reactively. Starting your swing and "tracking" the bird usually results in aiming and stopping the gun.

I don't find it hard to wait on dove, but sometimes when a "V" of geese is coming overhead, it gets mighty tempting to start too early.

BTW, Steve... before you posted, I would have bet $20 that your response would have been:

How raised - what you do.

 

[BozemanMT]

When i started in shotguns oh so long ago (about 2 years ) I started high gun, less to worry about, etc
But quickly within a couple of months I started trying low gun (badly) but I realized I could see the target. There was nothing in the way, I could use my periphial (spelled wrong) vision and track it. And ask someone said earlier get teh whole body swinging.

I shoot MUCH better low gun than mounted now at everything except trap. Trap kicks my behind from low gun. High gun in trap I can get low 20's consitently, but low gun, eerrrrghhh, we won't talk about those scores.

Luckily I don't like trap all that much. But I agree, you aren't walking around the wood shooting from mounted gun, so why practice that way?

Now, a friend I shoot with, who shoots better than I do only shoots high gun. And he usually beats me at SC and has run 75 straight (the bastid) at trap, but he can't shoot low gun to save his life. I would expect him not to do so well at hunting.

But hey, to each their own. My wife shoots high gun adn I can't convince her to change.

But yeah, rambling post aside, i like starting from low gun. I even shoot skeet that way (poorly)

 

[Larry Ashcraft]

TR -

On the long incomers which you can see from the next zip code, they're easy to hit if you just wait.

I think I remember that from the dim past, thanks for reminding me. (I'll try it tomorrow afternoon.)

Boze, lots of doves flying, you ready?

 

[HSMITH]

+10 to Trapper, that describes my shooting, reasoning, and vision to a T.

 

[sm]

This will be shared more in another time and place it is said I was real little, probably 18 months old. I had this wooden dowel, most likely a broom-stick cut down to "fit me".

For long periods of time I would mount that dowel to face. Low gun, mount to face and repeat.

I would have toys on my bed , on a dresser, on a window sill...

I would be in the yard, low gun, mount to face and swing on a bird, squirrel, rabbit, cat, leaf blowing...didn't matter.

I would drop the dowel a bit, and then mount again to face after pulling through and going "bang".

Big people did this, these folks I call Mentors & Elders. So if they did , I was supposed to.

I was about "so high" and real confused why some folks were standing there with a shotgun up on a shoulder, when this orange disc came out of that building . This was the first time I saw a skeet field. It is said I walked with the big people and took my turn with my dowel. It is said I took my option at low 8 and got to that one two times.

Mentors were grinning real big. My dowel was too small to fit in a rack by itself next to their guns, it fell through. Mentor had to lean it again his gun, that was better.

The first time a quail exploded at my feet, I did not jump, instead I got my feet a certain way, and mounted my dowel to face and swung at one quail going to the right. Then I stepped in a mud puddle and got my feet muddy and wet. I didn't get fussed at, and the Mentors were grinning, said we would worry about me getting muddy later on, I would probably get more muddy and dirty as the morning went on anyway...
...I did.

Low gun? I was just a wittle kid, I didn't know any better, still don't.

 

[PJR]

Having started out years ago shooting trap making the conversion to shooting gun down was a challenge but well worth it.

TR has captured my reason. You see the target earlier and get a focus on it sooner. The earlier I see a bird the better my chances of breaking it. Shooting low gun also allows you to put the gun barrels in a better position to break the bird which may be somewhere else on the flight path.

I don't use low gun all the time. I usually shoot gun up on any target with little or no lateral movement such as trap type targets or rising teal. I also find it helps with some rabbit presentations. I don't often drop the gun from my shoulder while shooting doubles. It depends on the presentation and whether doing so fits into my plan.

If you are going to shoot low gun it's important to do it right. The gun is raised to the face by the forward hand. If you are lowering your head to the stock when its on the shoulder you have a technique issue, fit problem or both. The gun is raised to the face by the forward hand to keep the muzzles smooth. Watch other shooters and if their muzzles bobble up and down when the gun hits the shoulder they are using too much rear hand to raise the gun.

Like anything else it requires practice. A couple of times a week I stand facing a full length mirror, shotgun in hand and practice mounting the gun. I stare at the reflection of the muzzles to make sure they have no bobble when the gun hits the shoulder and that I'm not lowering my face to the gun.

If you're going to shoot clays to your potential you need to bring the full arsenal and learning to shoot low gun is one of the key elements.

 

[Dave McCracken]

Folks, thanks for the responses.

Low Gun is a valuable technique, butthere's no Tablet Of Stone involved. For a brand new shooter, getting the gun up first simplifies things. For the rarefied atmosphere of top level trap and skeet competition, gun up makes sense.

The repeated mounts do improve the mount, if as was said, one brings the gun to the face and works on consistency. I started doing this to improve my mount, it worked. My mount is more consistent now and more fluid. Less wasted movement also.

While this has been said before, practice mounts at home are a very good tool for improving one's shooting.

 

[stiletto raggio]

I have shot low gun before, but frankly I don't see the rationale in doing it in formal competition. I practice it because, as has been said many times here, it plays to the practical side of shotgunning. It is the equivalent of drawing and firing a handgun from a holster or taking unknown distance shots offhand with a rifle. Nodody would argue that this is not more "practical" than shooting Olympic Free Pistol or a 600 yard benchrest competition, but shooting sports aren't all practical. For the majority of shooters, there is an honest advantage in competition to shooting high gun.

At the same time, if I had my way, I would shoot Sporting Clays 80 percent of the time and split the rest between formal skeet and trap. I think that if you practice your mount (which I have done tens of thousands of times) it will be there instinctively when you need it in the real world, but shooting targets that are artificially consistent (skeet and trap) only really helps you shoot those targets. When I was on the skeet and trap team at West Point, we shot against a lot of older competitors in the are. Some of these men hand literally been shooting for three times as long as we had been alive. Many of them were quite good at skeet and trap but had specialized at those games. High gun or low gun, when a target was not what they were used to, it was more difficult for them to hit it that it was for those of us with a more diverse shooting background.

I guess my point is that if shooting low gun works for you, great. I have seen a lot of great shooters do this, and I don't doubt its effectiveness once you have reached a very high level of proficiency, but for the majority of shooters it just adds another thing to screw up. In formal competition where the game is already highly unrealistic, I think you lose more in terms of competitive advantage than you gain in terms of muscle memory. I think practicing the mount is important, but if you are really concerned with your field shooting, I would look a lot more at the type of targets you are shooting than the quarter-second act of mounting the gun.

 

[Dave McCracken]

Lt Raggio, when the targets that day were going to places trap targets shun, we enjoyed them. It was remarked that we weren't trapshooters, who complain about non standard angles like Cowboys gripe about sheep.

Low Gun is not a panacea, but a viable method for many shot presentatiions.