Working up a load for 44 mag.

[SunnySlopes]

This is for Ruger Redhawk and a Ruger 3 screw Super Blackhawk.

The bullet: Berry’s 220 grain standard plated flat point; max velocity (according the Berry’s) = 1250 fps.

Berry’s website specifies to use cast bullet data for load data.

I’m using 2400 powder.

I cannot find 220 grain cast bullet load data, but in the Lyman Pistol and Revolver Handbook (copyright 1978) it has 215 grain cast with 2400. Starting load: 20 grains for 986 fps. (Max: 25 grains; 1310 fps.)

The bullets are plated with no cannelure and I’ve used them many times for several calibers. They’re fine at low velocities with a nominal crimp.

I’m asking the brain trust because I’m using data for 215 cast while I’ll actually be shooting 220 grain plated.

Thnx

 

[Charlie98]

Generally, you use cast data for plated bullets... unless they are heavy plated (like Extreme Plated, etc...) Your data should be fine.

 

[crestoncowboy]

The difference in 5 grains of bullet is negligible in a 200 GR bullet. If you weigh bullets you will find more difference than that. I know my hi tek coated 240s average far closer to 220 than 240.

Id use the 215 data and work up a load from there

 

[daverich4]

This is for Ruger Redhawk and a Ruger 3 screw Super Blackhawk.

The bullet: Berry’s 220 grain standard plated flat point; max velocity (according the Berry’s) = 1250 fps.

I cannot find 220 grain cast bullet load data, but in the Lyman Pistol and Revolver Handbook (copyright 1978) it has 215 grain cast with 2400. Starting load: 20 grains for 986 fps. (Max: 25 grains; 1310 fps.)

Thnx

You can tell just by looking at it that the starting fps. as shown is off a ton. This is Alliants load of 21 grains for a similar weight bullet. I don’t have one of my Lyman books in front of me but if I remember correctly, they have a similar error using AA9 and a 240 grain bullet.

https://www.alliantpowder.com/reloa...=1&weight=225&shellid=33&bulletid=45&bdid=153

 

[Bazoo]

The slight increase in weight isn’t an issue. But you need to use data that has the same amount of bullet in the case; used case volume. If your bullet seats deeper than that of the bullet in the data you have, it can drastically effect pressure.

How ya going to crimp it? Just crimp Into the side of the bullet? That’ll work I guess but isn’t really ideal. A full power load needs a healthy crimp to keep the bullets from moving under recoil.

Being plated causes a difference in pressure, and I’m not sure what. I believe, not much, but have no experience with plated.

 

[AJC1]

Cast bullets vary in weight and almost always drop heavy, before adding a gas check and then lube. Prudence is smart but your speed limit keeps you out of the tall grass imo.

 

[crestoncowboy]

The slight increase in weight isn’t an issue. But you need to use data that has the same amount of bullet in the case; used case volume. If your bullet seats deeper than that of the bullet in the data you have, it can drastically effect pressure.

How ya going to crimp it? Just crimp Into the side of the bullet? That’ll work I guess but isn’t really ideal. A full power load needs a healthy crimp to keep the bullets from moving under recoil.

Being plated causes a difference in pressure, and I’m not sure what. I believe, not much, but have no experience with plated.

Assuming he is using the 44 mag (with a max
Load of 25 grains of 2400 under a 215 it better be at least a magnum) then he has enough case capacity that a 220 won't be any issue as far as depth. Ive used berry's plated bullets plenty with no cannelure. Both the rugers are heavy guns and creep shouldn't be much of an issue

To the OP....id double check my data against more sources. 25 grains of 2400 with a 220 should be a lot more than 1300 fps. And I'd think over max load for cast too.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

You can tell just by looking at it that the starting fps. as shown is off a ton. This is Alliants load of 21 grains for a similar weight bullet. I don’t have one of my Lyman books in front of me but if I remember correctly, they have a similar error using AA9 and a 240 grain bullet.

https://www.alliantpowder.com/reloa...=1&weight=225&shellid=33&bulletid=45&bdid=153

I agree. This is from Lyman’s 48th:


I’m going to suggest starting at 19.5gr and working up from there to an accurate load. @SunnySlopes You could start lower at around 18.0gr very easily with 2400 since it downloads nicely and isn’t spikey when given too much head-room like some other ball powders. Just be clear about your goal going in: are you looking for long range accuracy, close-range knock-down, pin/silhouette gaming loads...? What’re you after with this load combo?

 

[SunnySlopes]

What’re you after with this load combo?

Strictly plinking/paper punching. It's a new-to-me Redhawk 44 and I've never fired it.

 

[crestoncowboy]

Strictly plinking/paper punching. It's a new-to-me Redhawk 44 and I've never fired it.

I use unique for paper punching loads. You get over twice as many rounds per lb. Its also a super versatile powder. I believe i could get by with just varget and unique.

Either way looking at my notes and the pictures from my books that I have on my phone, 25 is over max of 2400 all the way back to my old books. Most have it at 22 or less.

 

[Lee Q. Loader]

As others have said, that data is way off.
I shoot 20.8 grains of 2400 under a 240 gr. JSP Zero bullet. That gets me about 1320 fps out of my 5.5" Redhawk.
My most accurate load. That's pretty close to a max load for me.

 

[.308 Norma]

What’re you after with this load combo?

Strictly plinking/paper punching.

Wow! That seems like a lot of load for paper punching.
Back in the '80s, when my wife and I (mostly my wife) were into IHMSA shooting, she was using 22.0grs of 2400 behind Sierra 220gr FPJ (Flat Point Jacketed) bullets in her 10.5" Ruger Super Blackhawks. We never did shoot that load over a chronograph, but my wife literally tipped over hundreds of 200-meter steel rams with it.

 

[SunnySlopes]

I’m going to suggest starting at 19.5gr and working up from there to an accurate load. @SunnySlopes You could start lower at around 18.0gr very easily

Thanks. I'll start with 18 grains 2400 and work up.

 

[BIZERKO666]

Funny how data changes, this is from an older third edition Lyman manual.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

View attachment 1120020View attachment 1120021 Funny how data changes, this is from an older third edition Lyman manual.

Also shows it cast 5gr heavier using the same mold and alloy. That’s not much change in the starting load but 3gr is a significant change in the maximum load. Which is why we always start at the starting load and work up to the most accurate load for a specific firearm.

 

[BIZERKO666]

Also shows it cast 5gr heavier using the same mold and alloy. That’s not much change in the starting load but 3gr is a significant change in the maximum load. Which is why we always start at the starting load and work up to the most accurate load for a specific firearm.

That’s why I posted it. I’m familiar with that mold and I knew something was different from my memory. Always check multiple resources and work up your loads

 

[SunnySlopes]

Funny how data changes, this is from an older third edition Lyman manual.

Same manual I referenced in my OP. Copyright 1978; ninth printing.

Years ago I read how that the published data changes because the formulations of powder change. If I'm remembering that correctly, then Alliant 2400 of 1978 is not as hot as Alliant 2400 of 2022?

 

[derek45]

I would select some faster burning powder, like 231, unique, for the barry's, load them up to about 1050fps

I would save the good old 2400 for jacketed, or hardcast & coated.

( I'm not a fan of berrys bullets)

 

[AJC1]

Same manual I referenced in my OP. Copyright 1978; ninth printing.

Years ago I read how that the published data changes because the formulations of powder change. If I'm remembering that correctly, then Alliant 2400 of 1978 is not as hot as Alliant 2400 of 2022?

Powder formulations change but so did the data collection. A lot of older data was cup and the new data is psi measured with a digital strain Guage. Some classic charges were tested above established numbers. Did that make the millions of loads before the new test unsafe, I don't think so. But that's the major reason limits were lowered not lawyers.

 

[CraigC]

You could start at 18.0gr but you'll probably hit your velocity ceiling before it starts burning clean. A little faster powder might be a better solution. I would probably use 10.0gr Unique and leave it there.

 

[BWS]

Paper and coke can ventilation;

10g of Unique is hard to beat...just sayin.

 

[Bfh_auto]

Since everyone is suggesting unique instead of 2400. I'll suggest universal if you can't find unique.
I do agree with everyone on a faster powder for plinking. If you need to burn the 2400. Have fun.

 

[crestoncowboy]

View attachment 1120020View attachment 1120021 Funny how data changes, this is from an older third edition Lyman manual.

No doubt. Me and the late RC had a conversation over my max load of 296 in 44 mag. Lol. He pm me telling me how over max it was. I showed him my book and I was .5 under for that book (a Hornady book and I was using their own bullet) But a couple grains over in several others. Worked great for years in my Ruger and Dan Wesson. I couldn't get close to it in my smith though.

Even in that book though, 25 GR of 2400 under that 215 is 3 grains over max

 

[SunnySlopes]

I would probably use 10.0gr Unique and leave it there.

10g of Unique is hard to beat...just sayin.

Since everyone is suggesting unique instead of 2400. I'll suggest universal if you can't find unique.

Here's an idea. I think I'll just use Unique. I have plenty of it. 231, too. Glad I thought of it.

By the way, on the Hodgdon 231 load data site, it's "BERB FP 220 GR." I'm assuming they are talking about "Berry's Bullets?" It's at the very bottom of the chart as if it were an afterthought.

Oh, and thanks so much to all who responded. That's why I appreciate the High Road brain trust.

 

[Rule3]

Here's an idea. I think I'll just use Unique. I have plenty of it. 231, too. Glad I thought of it.

By the way, on the Hodgdon 231 load data site, it's "BERB FP 220 GR." I'm assuming they are talking about "Berry's Bullets?" It's at the very bottom of the chart as if it were an afterthought.

Oh, and thanks so much to all who responded. That's why I appreciate the High Road brain trust.

Yes a BERB is a Berry

for 2400 powder I would use the data from Alliant for the 225 or 250 cast bullet. They list max so reduce it by 10%
(if you do not have data, you can use the next higher bullet data)

https://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/powderlist.aspx?type=1&powderid=9&cartridge=33