Would any of you gents, be interested in opening a small Gun Shop, FL

[george burns]

George Burns.... I don't see, "Right to Bear Arms", on the list. I have dealt with Chris (the owner) over the years. When I want to buy something, he tells me to shop for the best price and have it shipped to his shop for the transfer. He only works by appointment only now.

I know Chris fo 11 years. He had a small shop that was more of a hangout for his friends than a business. I spoke to him several times about letting me help him, but he was stubborn, and eventually closed that one. I followed his progress over the years, and he really was not a business person. Finally after another failed attempt with 10x guns, he split a store with another buddy of his who supposedly was a special ops guy who did big bore revolvers and as far as Chris goes, he told me on several occasions, that he only did class 3 stuff now.
I don't really consider them a gun store, although I haven't been in there for 5 years. There are many things that he put himself through that soured him on business. Most was Opening a beautiful store with the Gentleman who I use for my transfers, Who is a top Pro who makes his own guns, and prototypes for the military, "ended in a matter of months" . He's a good guy, who just got in way over his head and pocket book.
I am 70 years old, had a business with 300 employees, I wish I had me, back then to help me for free, but everyone is different and sometimes you ego allows you to think you know better than some older guy who isn't in the gun business. Even though I have been carrying and shooting for 5 decades, and had a NYC carry permit, shot competitively against the NYPD, and FBI. What could I possibly tell a 21 year old guy who knew everything.
He will do you a favor if he likes you, I even bought a couple of AK's for the store so I could get one at cost. He was underfunded to the point of putting his and his friends guns in the display case. I offered to help but there wasn't enough profit in it for him, so when he closed I really didn't speak to him, other than at gun shows, or when he opened that fully stocked beautiful store with Jennings , which closed as fast as it went in. Not my business what happened. I wished him the best.
Jennings is a quiet gentleman, so something went down, he never spoke about it, Neither did Jennings, and I never asked either of them, I have seen Mr. Jennings several times this year. I really could have helped Chris, but sometimes young guys think they know it all. I wish him the best, just not my way of doing business.
Life has taught me that if you are going to do something, wait until you can do it right. Never buy or open something that you aren't able to afford or fully commit to.
Life is hard enough when you do things properly and you are bound to fail if you don't. My last business was 40,000 square feet, this one will be around 1000. I am not doing this to impress anyone, just to keep busy and make a buck. If it just happens to grow into something larger, I won't complain, but honestly when you go big, your costs and problems are also big. I don't want an overhead that costs 50 thousand a month to open the door. Been there done that, not at this stage of my life, I would entertain a large internet presence if it were doable. Honestly I haven't thought this past finding another guy who I feel I can trust and get along with on a daily basis. That's the most important part.

 

[CaptHank]

I agree that he has his own mindset. The hassle that he had about custody of his daughter, knocked the wind out of his sails. My contact with him, deals solely with Class 3 items.

When I lived in New Jersey and Pennsylvania, my go to gun store, was TargetMaster. Tommy also had an indoor range for pistol and archery in the store. His store, is what you describe as your ideal Gun Store. I would be one of your best customers.

 

[Mad_Max]

shoobe01... thanks for that rundown of do's & dont's... that a very solid list

 

[John_R]

Good luck finding worthwhile employees!

 

[george burns]

I really don't want to have employees, other than a partner, perhaps one or two tops. If it takes off that's a different story, but I have seen some small operations that do very well. That 10x store mentioned before, is a one man store,by appointment, and he slays it. Not that I intend to do what he does, because he is a true craftsman. But you don't need a lot of people to make a lot of money these days. The interactive websites manage inventory, procurement etc., so it's really your day to day walk in traffic, and expaliningg things to folks that may not have the knowledge to make a correct purchase for themselves.

 

[Labguy47]

Come on down to SW Florida, we have 9 gun stores in my little town. 23 if you add the adjoining counties. You cant believe how many are down here.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

Too many people don't want to go and do their shopping at a LGS. They prefer to sit at home and shop the internet. I don't think to many of them consider the cost of transfer fees and or Hazmat shipping coast into their purchase price. That's a shame as I usually buy from LGS or a local range and at the end of the day I don't really pay anymore for anything , because I'm not paying fees. However I believe I'm in the minority and there are a good number of guns stores around my area so competition for business is greater creating competitive prices.

If you can’t save buying online either you’re doing something wrong or you have amazing LGSs in your area. I hope for you and them the later.

I’ve yet to find a shop in Va that can beat online prices. That’s on guns, powder, primers and accessories.

Now granted to save online requires planning and orders that meet the free shipping or are big enough to make hazmat not a big factor.

I have seen some excellent deals on powders and primers at gun shows.

So with this said, it’s why I made the comments above. Meeting a niche, providing excellent service and doing some of the things others have suggested to get loyal customers are key. The bottom line is that running a business is hard, running one in a highly competitive field is very hard, and this is an extremely hard type of business because of regulations, politics, and the market.

Again, it can be done, but it won’t be easy nor will it be done without creativity and some luck (luck is always a factor o matter what anyone says)

 

[Jack B.]

If you can’t save buying online either you’re doing something wrong or you have amazing LGSs in your area. I hope for you and them the later.

I’ve yet to find a shop in Va that can beat online prices. That’s on guns, powder, primers and accessories.

Now granted to save online requires planning and orders that meet the free shipping or are big enough to make hazmat not a big factor.

I have seen some excellent deals on powders and primers at gun shows.

So with this said, it’s why I made the comments above. Meeting a niche, providing excellent service and doing some of the things others have suggested to get loyal customers are key. The bottom line is that running a business is hard, running one in a highly competitive field is very hard, and this is an extremely hard type of business because of regulations, politics, and the market.

Again, it can be done, but it won’t be easy nor will it be done without creativity and some luck (luck is always a factor o matter what anyone says)

Guess I just never bought in bulk. Don't feel the need to nor do I want to. When it comes to bigger and more expensive items ( firearms) I always handle and inspect the item first. I won't buy anything with my hard earned money on something I can't inspect. Don't want to waste my money or time. Just the way I've learn to do things.

 

[george burns]

There is so much to this business, that many times you buy something only to see it the next day for a lot less. It's a prime example of supply and demand. I picked up a Remington R1 Carry Commander, that gun came out 3-4 years ago at 12-1300.Suddenlly I started seeing them at 7-800, then $550, I kept watching them online on slickguns.com. It was $550, with a $100 dollar rebate, so I picked it up for $440, which seems ridiculous for a really nice loaded 1911.I really would have been annoyed had I payed over $1000 dollars for one, which seems to be around the gun store/show price. It bothers me that some gun store and people can be that out of touch with what they sell.
Many a time as I am sure some of you have experienced, at a show I would look at a gun, and ask what's the best you can do on this, and have the guy or gal, give me a price that was $200 over Msrp, or more, then when you hand back the gun, they ask why aren't you buying it. When I have politely said I can get it for less, they get pissed of and one guy actually wanted to fight me. He came out from the table and I said look, Before I knock you on your ass, just google the gun on this website and you will see the price. Plus I don't feel like getting arrested for defending myself. It's ludicrous how a person could treat a potential client like many of them do. Plus many are completely ignorant to what they sell and act like fools. I would consider not going into this business if I saw real competition, and if I don't find another like minded person who also has the funds I won't do it only because my back is so bad, I just had another epidural yesterday, it ain't getting better. If I can pull it off with establishing lines of credit that allowed me to sell online with everything being handled electronically from sourcing to delivery to me, "they can do this now", The software exists, then I will go ahead. I just want to talk to the customer and get them what they want at a fair price, with no bull.

 

[lemaymiami]

Looking at the original question... My answer is... absolutely not... Hobby type stores rarely ever succeed since they're based on what you "want to do" as opposed to what you have to do - if the concern is to not only turn a profit -but grow over time...

Some years back when I knew I would be getting an early retirement from police work I considered starting a shop (in my case, with a strong interest in fishing... ) that was my focus. A friend in that world was kind enough to sit me down and show me on paper -exactly what was involved (money needed, commitment required, risk involved, etc.). In short none of the numbers worked very well at all - and if I'd succeeded I'd have bought myself a job that would leave little time for any other activity -but would only generate a modest income - that would always be at risk... If it's a tackle shop you would have to give up fishing... if a gun shop give up hunting or any similar activity since the store had to come first.... And by the way - the first three years you can't take a penny out of the business except to pay employees. Every extra dollar generated would have to go back into the business without exception... and your entire initial investment would always be at risk from day one (and you'd never be able to control those risks, period....).

Here's how it went - you can make a small fortune in the ______ business - first we'll start with a large fortune... As noted by a very prominent business news type -we're in the retail Ice Age... In short on-line and big box stores are just eating up small retailers. It's a slow quiet process that will fundamentally change that world.

There is a bit of good news that someone else has already touched on... that is by diversifying you can actually start up a small shop and survive. I was fascinated to learn that more than one small shop makes it's entire overhead each month - on sales of t-shirts alone (that's provided you're able to set up shop in an area with high tourist traffic..).

If you do go down that small shop road - post up how it works out for you... Most here have that dream -the reality though isn't very promising from my point of view...

 

[George P]

The thing with an idea like a gun shop is that there are SO many items that folks will expect to see in stock, except the inventory carrying costs will eat you alive. It is all about turning the inventory and generating cash flow. Carrying a lot of stuff that MAY sell now and again is a recipe for disaster.

 

[jdavis123]

A number of years ago a close friend with a strong interest in the gun hobby decided to open a local shop with much the same intention as the OP. He rented a nice building in a good location and stocked it well using most of his savings. He quickly learned that he could not buy as well as the larger and more established shops which meant his margins were smaller on most of his inventory. He made the mistake of never separating the hobby from the business and often took home used collectibles that he took in. In less than a year his rising overhead and little to no margins on slow sales was ringing the death toll. He had to cut his losses and close the shop. New gun shops have a high mortality rate and particularly so in recent times with a soft market and very competitive internet dealers. Many in the business believe that the future of the LGS will be to primarily serve as a transfer agent. In my opinion the OP is treading on shaky ground.

 

[george burns]

Well first I need to find a partner, until then we will see. My other businesses were highly competitive for 30 yrs. It's all about sourcing and procurement, if you know how to do that, and you spend enough on your interactive website, it's not bad. Many folks can't or won't spent 25+ thousand on a website that is today necessary to run an internet business.

 

[boom boom]

Well first I need to find a partner, until then we will see. My other businesses were highly competitive for 30 yrs. It's all about sourcing and procurement, if you know how to do that, and you spend enough on your interactive website, it's not bad. Many folks can't or won't spent 25+ thousand on a website that is today necessary to run an internet business.

Consider opening a pawn shop that sells guns (mainly used or pawned) or buying an existing pawn shop and do that. Finance makes better margins than retail if run right.

 

[George P]

.I really would have been annoyed had I payed over $1000 dollars for one, which seems to be around the gun store/show price. It bothers me that some gun store and people can be that out of touch with what they sell.

Maybe not out of touch; rather maybe they bought them at the then wholesale price of about $800 and can't afford to sell it for less.

 

[Labguy47]

If I was going to open a gun related business I would simply do the transfers for online purchase at $30 a transfer, all you need is a license, a safe, and either compliant form on PC or hard copy, and a log book. No shop here will do a transfer for less than $50, because they want you to buy what they have in inventory. I showed one store owner the only impulse buy weapon I was considering and he was $150 over CDNN. CDNN was lower than his supplier, he couldn't believe I could save $100 even with the transfer. He came down to cost and made the deal, then he resupplied from CDNN. That is my home business plan for when I retire.

 

[dogtown tom]

The thing with an idea like a gun shop is that there are SO many items that folks will expect to see in stock, except the inventory carrying costs will eat you alive. It is all about turning the inventory and generating cash flow. Carrying a lot of stuff that MAY sell now and again is a recipe for disaster.

As evidenced in this thread, you'll have every Tom, Dick and Harry telling you what you should carry...….mil surps, high end scopes, reloading equipment, holsters, black powder, smokeless powder, gun cleaning supplies, O/U shotguns, you name it everyone wants you to stock what they want. Sadly, what they want doesn't always sell or it doesn't sell at a margin high enough to justify you stocking it.

If it can be bought off Amazon...….don't stock it! You'll just become a place where "buyers" come to molest your display items and then go to the parking lot and use their cell phone to buy cheaper elsewhere.

 

[dogtown tom]

Well first I need to find a partner, until then we will see. My other businesses were highly competitive for 30 yrs. It's all about sourcing and procurement,

Well, being that every dealer uses virtually the same manufacturers and distributors that's not really what its all about. Distributor pricing differences are negligible. Volume purchases from the same distro get better pricing tiers. Really large volume purchases may see the dealer dealing direct with the manufacturer.

Thinking that you'll find a better way to source or procure product in the gun biz? No one has ever thought of that until now.

if you know how to do that, and you spend enough on your interactive website, it's not bad. Many folks can't or won't spent 25+ thousand on a website that is today necessary to run an internet business.

1. Spending $25,000 on a website to earn how much $$$$$? If you aren't buying $100,000 worth of product a month you won't beat Buds, Ky Gun Co, Brownells, Palmetto on price.
2. I can have an "interactive website" up and running tomorrow showing live distributor inventory as if it were my own for free.

 

[dogtown tom]

If I was going to open a gun related business I would simply do the transfers for online purchase at $30 a transfer, all you need is a license, a safe, and either compliant form on PC or hard copy, and a log book.

At $30 you'll lose out to guys like me. Your transfer business will never get off the ground.

No shop here will do a transfer for less than $50, because they want you to buy what they have in inventory.

Same here.
At $50 they are telling you it isn't worth their time. I think that logic is faulty.
Instead of basing your transfer fee off what the local brick and mortar storefront charges, investigate what the local kitchen table dealers charge......that's your competition.

I showed one store owner the only impulse buy weapon I was considering and he was $150 over CDNN. CDNN was lower than his supplier, he couldn't believe I could save $100 even with the transfer. He came down to cost and made the deal, then he resupplied from CDNN. That is my home business plan for when I retire.

Your business plan is to stock inventory from CDNN? Good grief.

 

[Labguy47]

Your business plan is to stock inventory from CDNN? Good grief.[/QUOTE]

At $30 you'll lose out to guys like me. Your transfer business will never get off the ground.

Your business plan is to stock inventory from CDNN? Good grief.

No my plan is to simply do transfers as a retirement side business to keep people from ripping people off so they only buy overpriced guns they find in the stores locally. Its not gonna make or break me if I do one or one hundred per year. As stated it is my retirement plan to keep doing something. Its not going to cost me like a brick and mortar store as I am the only employee and I will be doing it out of my home.

 

[George P]

Local stores ripping people off? How so? If folks WILLINGLY pay the store's asking price, they didn't get ripped off. If people do not like the store's asking price, they are free to go elsewhere. If they do not do their due diligence by scouring the Net, that is on them.

 

[boom boom]

The difficult trick is to find a niche that the big box boys simply don't do. Used firearms are one, offering gunsmithing services is another, and another one focuses primarily on prepping with a side of appropriate firearms/parts. The online retailers are getting ready to have to comply with state sales tax laws due to the Supreme Court's 2018 decision in Wayfair and it is uncertain how that will affect their business.

In many cases, add transfer fees, shipping and handling, and the compliance with state/local taxes, online retailing, especially smaller ones, will make price competition more even with brick and mortar stores--it appears 6-10 percent (sales tax )of the cost advantage of online selling will be gone and compliance costs for keeping up with taxing jurisdictions will go up. It was a pain as a brick and mortar retailer to file one sales tax report per month. It will be a logistical nightmare to do so for 50 with different reporting dates, late fines, etc. I suspect that most will have to hire the job out to etailing platforms who will not do so for free.

It is also unclear about the reach of the decision to make sellers comply with other state laws across the 50 states.
Depending if Congress reacts to this or not via legislation, this will be a major headache for online sellers in the near future. It is not unlikely that some states may farm out collecting back sales taxes dating to the Wayfair decision to litigation hungry lawyers--after all, out of state websites have no political clout in a state and states/local government are always hungry for more revenue.

 

[Rogue909]

FWIW...

I won't usually buy guns if they are new. It's gotta be a stupid deal for me to bite. But I know I'm not exactly the standard.

However, their is an RV place near us that sells used RVs. It works like this; the RV is brought to the lot by the owner. The dealer guys clean them up and park them. Customers walk around the lot and get to go in and have a look. Dealer guys keep them maintained and parked for a cost. Ultimately the RV is owned by the owner, the dealer is just there to facilitate the deals and maintain them during the selling process.

I have no idea how that cost breaks down. Maybe a %% of sale? Size of RV? Parking spot? No idea at all.

I do know if there was a shooting range/used gun store in one where I could browse used rifles I'd be all over it.

 

[George P]

It will be a logistical nightmare to do so for 50 with different reporting dates, late fines, etc. I suspect that most will have to hire the job out to etailing platforms who will not do so for free

50? try thousands as every locale has its own slice of the pie. Every County seems to be slightly different, add in local city % points and it can be a headache to kill all but the largest online retailers like Amazon. (Maybe he's behind it)