Would anyone know who "PB", long-rifle maker, could be? Trying to Identify Family Rifle.

Ugly Sauce

Ugly Sauce

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Hello, This rifle has been in the family since 1846. They traded an ox for it, in Independence Missouri. It has "PB" on the barrel, but I have never been able to connect that to a maker.

The stock is made of oak. The ram-rod is also oak. It's a very plain rifle, sheet metal ram-rod thimbles, a London lock, and misc. brass and German silver (I think) furniture. Butt plate is brass, trigger guard is German silver.

The barrel is 33&1/4", but we know that it was cut down in the 1850's. It is .38 caliber.

If anyone has any idea who "PB" could be, it would be appreciated. (and no, it's not Phillip Beck!!)

Thank you! Also I included the original powder horn, and antler tip measure. The measure holds 25 grains.
 

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Difficult to get good light on the "PB".
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Forgot to include a picture of the tang. Could be a clue.
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And a better pic of the trigger guard, which I'm guessing is German silver, but I don't want to/won't clean it up.
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The lock on the starboard side of the rifle says "London" (assuming my eyes are functioning correctly). I rather shy away from the honorable Beretta. That is not the PB I recognize as the Beretta mark - which may have more to do with time than anything else.
Yeah, "PB" flashes Beretta to me first. However, the guns they have been making since the 1500s are shotguns. My references have me believe the company didn't make handguns until the First World War. No real knowledge of rifles by them, either.
 
Archie said:
The lock on the starboard side of the rifle says "London" (assuming my eyes are functioning correctly). I rather shy away from the honorable Beretta. That is not the PB I recognize as the Beretta mark - which may have more to do with time than anything else.
Yeah, "PB" flashes Beretta to me first. However, the guns they have been making since the 1500s are shotguns. My references have me believe the company didn't make handguns until the First World War. No real knowledge of rifles by them, either.
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I think we better clarify that all the remarks about Beretta were done in jest. Beretta would not have been selling plain-Jane, oak stocked long rifles in Independence Missouri in or before 1846. Especially ones with cheap English locks, which were produced for rifle builders/gunsmiths in the ex-colonies, and trade in general. I'm sure the trigger guard and butt plate were also pre-made parts for the gunsmith trade. However, thank you for your input, good comment and appreciated.
 
243winxb said:
Google "Pomeroy Booth 1800s gunsmith" Click on "American Gun Makers" Looks like info from book? Will be in a PDF type file.
Good luck with your search. Some gun makers made very few rifles.
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Hey thank you very much. I'm somewhat sure that "maker unknown" is probably the answer. Probably was made by someone that just made a couple or a very few. One-off? The quality of the rifle is just not that of any of the well know makers. It's not a "bad" rifle, just wasn't made by a super skilled maker. Certainly was a functional and tough rifle, considering it's history and extensive use. And it is accurate.

"Peter Barret" is also a possibility, as perhaps during his firearms education began with the making of a few rifles when younger, and then later he worked for Colt. I should do some research into him if possible.

Thanks again, good information.
 
Boy, it's hard to get info. Did some research today. I do think the PB "maker unknown" might be as close as I can get. The "marking on some Kentucky rifles" kind of indicates the mystery man made more than a couple. Unfortunately they don't indicate a general time frame or pic of a rifle with that marking. This rifle is an early percussion, so if other such marked rifles are in flint, that screws up the time frame.
 
243winxb said:
What is the word under London?
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Looks like "Warranted" to me. The marking seems to be a bit worse for wear, but may not have been without flaw to begin.
Ugly Sauce said:
I think we better clarify that all the remarks about Beretta were done in jest.
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No. PB initially brings up Beretta, but your notations are valid as well. It does looks a bit 'plain'. But PB brings Pietro Beretta to the front of my mind, even if a second thought rules it out.

An early American maker? Without knowing the caliber that does make sense. (Difference between 8mm and .32 caliber without further information on a rifle that old is hard to detect.) Then again, percussion rifles are not my field.
 
An imported lock doesn't mean anything. A lot of builders used imported locks, barrels and everything else. A lot of builders were just assemblers having bought all their parts premade. The silver trigger guard and brass butt plate is odd. Usually they're both the same.
 
Archie said:
Looks like "Warranted" to me. The marking seems to be a bit worse for wear, but may not have been without flaw to begin.
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Correct!
Archie said:
An early American maker? Without knowing the caliber that does make sense. (Difference between 8mm and .32 caliber without further information on a rifle that old is hard to detect.) Then again, percussion rifles are not my field.
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I've never measured the bore, but it sure shoots the .375" balls nice, and loads nice. I think that brings up the subject about how non-standard bore sizes were back in the day.
 
hawg said:
An imported lock doesn't mean anything. A lot of builders used imported locks, barrels and everything else. A lot of builders were just assemblers having bought all their parts premade. The silver trigger guard and brass butt plate is odd. Usually they're both the same.
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Yes, there was a strong "gunsmith" trade, supplying locks, barrels and furniture. Considering the difficulty and expertise required to make a lock, I think one will see more guns with imported locks from that time and place. (Oregon trail) That trade dates well back to colonial times. The trigger guard may have been a replacement? The rifle did see some hard use, and just before it went seeking revenge for the Whitmans, we know the barrel was cut shorter for horse-back use. The trigger guard could certainly have been a repair, perhaps off some wrecked rifle. I agree, choosing to originally build the rifle with a brass butt and silver trigger guard is odd.

I think that the maker made the barrel and stock on this gun, but obviously the lock came from the trade, and I don't think the rifle was quite well made enough or "fancy" enough to have been done by a master who would be casting his own furniture.
 
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