Would you carry a customized gun for CCW

[SaxonPig]

Jim- I understand that it can happen (cops demanding that you throw your gun down) and like I said, having a gun in your hand when cops arrive can be dangerous so I think it better to set the gun down before they get there, but what you describe wasn't my actual experience. I think you are giving cops short thrift in assuming they will not behave responsibly.

Mas Ayoob has addressed this issue and his advice is to immediately comply with an officer's order to "drop the gun" by placing it on the ground and stepping back. I think if the cop is so nervous and untrained as to shoot you for doing that then he would likely shoot you no matter what you do.

Personally, I think throwing or dropping a loaded gun is dangerous and if only for the sake of safety I would set the gun down rather than throw it. If that's not good enough, then I guess the cop will have to shoot me.

 

[TexasRifleman]

I'm having trouble figuring out why anyone cares if the gun gets scratched.

If you just used a gun to save your life, or the life of another, having a scratch on the gun would not make it to the list of things to worry about.

If a very expensive custom gun makes you want to carry it more often, or you shoot better with it, who cares if it gets damaged in a lawful defense situation.

That's what they are for.

That's like not wanting to drive a car with airbags because the airbags might get dirty.

 

[thorazine]

Reminds me of the glock with "F THE POLICE" engraved on the slide.

Good idea -- no?

 

[Zerodefect]

I'm going to engrave "Hang King George!" on my next 1911. Then have Obamalamadingdongs face roll stamped next to it!










Just kidding, that would certainly get me jail time knowing todays cracker box judges.

 

[Philip Marlowe]

Yes

I've got a compensated barrel in my PM9, and a solid guide rod. I guess that's sort of customized...

 

[Butter]

Interesting conversation. My brother was once allowed to handle a couple of museum quality swords in a private collection. One was used in the Crusades another was a few hundered years later. So when I look at swords, American Indian war axes, any ancient weapon in a museum, I am struck by a couple of things: 1) that they are utilitarian in their requirements for usage; and 2) that often as not, and probably more so, they have been embellished some how. There are personalized engravings, meticuluous bead work, all sorts of aesthetic accoutrements that get wrapped around these arms. Some seem really functional as well as beautiful.

All I am saying is that if you personalize something, perhaps their is a case for making the weapon more than utilitarian, but also very personally usable. If you feel better about it, use it more often and can handle it well because of the customization, well then, hey go for it.

 

[Ranger Rog]

Yes,
http://www.cylinder-slide.com/index.php?app=ccp0&ns=catshow&ref=SFSkits

 

[33-805]

Interesting views

I carry stock glocks with the exception of tritium sights. But I do this because they work for me that way. I have carried customized Wilsons and Cylinder and Slide guns over the years. At that time, they were best for me. At no time did I ever worry about them getting scratched, as they were work guns. I have had to have a couple work guns refinished due to them getting banged around a bit. S&W Model 28 and an 870, IIRC. I went right back to carrying them both, way back when...

 

[Firewall]

I would definitely carry functionally customized gun, as obviously this just makes it better at what its intended for no matter the cost. I like the look of a gun that's worn from carrying anyways.

I personally have never purchased a gun solely for cosmetic reasons and don't have much intention to. If I did, it'd be because I already have a gun for range & carry so the point is moot.

However, I do avoid carrying my guns which have sentimental value unless there is no other option.

 

[krs]

Personally, I think throwing or dropping a loaded gun is dangerous and if only for the sake of safety I would set the gun down rather than throw it. If that's not good enough, then I guess the cop will have to shoot me.

Yeah, I guess they'll just have to shoot you, and I think that it's exactly what happened to a kid in seattle recently.

This kid, age 22, was an enthusiastic reenactor of German Army WW2 history, and he dressed in full wermacht uniform with rifle for many gatherings and occasions. I talked with him at length one day at the Portland gun show where he'd brought his MG42, a nice version of the Kubelwagen, and was in his equipment so completely that he looked like a scene from "The Great Escape". He was so earnest in his interest that I accepted him as a real enthusiast, if a little strange. But he was a bright young history major in college and his focus was on the German Army. Not the Nazis he carefully made clear, the wermacht.

Anyway, there was some occasion not long ago in which this kid and some of his friends were partying and letting off firecrackers. It was a holiday of some kind. The kid was in uniform and had his Mauser. Someone called the cops and reported shooting in the area of the apartment where one of these kids lived and where they'd all gone inside.. When the cops arrived this kid came out of the apartment, coincidentally - he was just going home apparently. The cops saw him and ordered him to drop the rifle. He turned toward them in the dark to see what was going on, saw cops at the top of the stairs, and then began to set the rifle down carefully as it was a cherished piece to him. As he set it down butt first just like you'd do the muzzle naturally went upward and a cop thought he was aiming at them, or so their story goes. Two of the cops opened fire with M16 rifles and killed the kid before the butt of his rifle reached the ground.

That kid would probably be alive today if he'd cared less for his perfect Mauser and just let it fall to the ground when told to drop it.

 

[Ed Ames]

I don't think that story has much relevance to most of us here.

 

[krs]

I'd agree Ed, except that there was commentary in the thread to the effect that rather than drop a weapon if directed to do so, setting it carefully down would have to suffice for the needs of any law enforcement person who arrives to the scene.

For my part, I'll drop an original Walker Colt like that hot potato if told to do so by a cop who doesn't know what's going on when he arrives to a shooting call. Jim Keenan is right that caring for a weapon will be the smallest consideration in such a case, certainly smaller than seeing to the future safety of all concerned which is what the police are trained to do.

 

[hunter25]

My carry gun has been customized but only for functional purpose. I will spend as much as I can afford for reliability and function.
I would never carry a gun with some of the engravings on them such as the glocks with "smile wait for flash" on the end. I think the legal problems would be much worse If you ever had to use it.

 

[farscott]

All of my carry guns have been extensively customized to help me shoot better, and I accept the fact that if I ever use one "for real", it is likely gone and will need to be replaced. Sounds like a good excuse to buy a new gun, and if I can afford a new gun that means it all ended well.

I treat my carry guns like tools; I use them but do not abuse them. I am not wealthy, but I rather spend money on guns that on expensive vehicles and other "big boy" toys. Just like I would not buy a new vehicle and leave it in the garage, I use my custom guns. My usual carry gun has cost me around $3500, and I have others that range in cost from $900 to $5400. The only one I do not carry is the $5400 one; it is my wife's gun and she carries it.

 

[Ed Ames]

The kid wasn't shot because he didn't immediately drop the rifle. He was shot because he was a social deviant and cops don't handle that at all well. Look at the number of mentally retarded people, people having seizures or other medical problems, etc that result in police officers shooting, beating, or otherwise harming folks who were no threat to them.

Don't count on dropping your plastic pistol to save you from a cop.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAHjhtYZpX0

 

[twigs]

Another thought.

If seized by law enforcement, a gun doesn't stay in the local evidence locker. It gets sent to the lab for ballistic, NIBIN, and possibly DNA and fingerprint testing.

Contrary to CSI, in most states the process takes months, not hours.

I believe that an owner should accept the probability that damage will occur.

 

[krs]

That's true too, Ed. They saw a nazi and killed him. I never saw anything more, like whether that kid's parents tried to get some justice but it really sounded wrong when I read about it the next day. I had met that guy and the news report showed a picture of him in his German uniform so I knew it was the same kid I'd met. Blonde, pinkcheeked young Arian. (LOL!) And although he was somewhat strange for dressing up like he did I'm sure that he really treasured every piece of his collected regalia. The machine gun was a semi-auto replica using original parts and he had the mount and belted ammo - the works. It really was a nice job of reenacting or restoring that gear no matter what you or I or those cops thought about it or him for doing it.

There was another one in some small town near Portland, OR. I get Portland news on the local programming because there's mountains between me and Seattle so I got to watch the hullabaloo over this evidently retarded but harmless according to everyone who knew him guy who was shot. He'd gone to the wrong door thinking it was his home and the people inside called in a prowler. This guy was unarmed but was shot dead mostly because he didn't understand what was going on.
It sounded like a shame, and there were people demanding investigations. The cop involved turned out to be involved in another case in which he'd sexually abused or raped a girl in town. He was fired but they never brought him to account for the retarded guy's death so far as I know. The news stopped covering the story as soon as there was no more sensational stuff to tell, as is typical of news everywhere.

The one in your link is really incredible. We used to live in Alameda and my wife worked in Oakland. The Bart police were never thought of as being as bad as the Oakland PD, but that tape is clear and there's no doubt at all that it was unnecessary to shoot the guy. Whatever he might have done it was obvious that he was completely under their control and that cop just murdered him. Good thing that someone had the presence of mind to get it on tape.


I carry a modified Colt New Agent with Crimson Trace, ambisafeties for my lefthanded self, and EGW sear, disconnector, extractor,and slidestop. I don't really like the silly thing but it is custom and it is dropdead reliable. I'd carry my Sig 220 if it wasn't so chunky because it's even more safe while being just as reliable.

 

[KyJim]

I think people are talking about two different things here. One is a highly customized engraved show piece and the other is tool costomized primarily for function (an maybe a little for looks).

Frankly, I can't imagine why someone would want to get a customized show piece and carry it but to each his own. I can understand why people have tools that are on the expensive side. I don't have any of the customized show pieces but I do have a few guns I would not carry; e.g., a couple of mint Pythons I shoot sometimes but don't carry.

On the other hand, I have some tools that I do carry that are on the expensive side -- a Baer and an Ed Brown. If I have to use one of these guns and the police confiscate and abuse it, so be it. It's served its purpose. If you can't accept this, then you shouldn't carry an expensive gun. BTW, I'm no gun snob. I also carry less expensive guns.

Don't count on dropping your plastic pistol to save you from a cop.

I've seen this before and there is speculation the officer thought he was pulling his taser. I don't know if his response was ever made public. A tragedy, however, no matter how it happened.

 

[Ruggles]

"(yes, you WILL be arrested if you kill someone, whether you think it was justified or not)"

What state do you live in? Not sure where you get your information but that is simple not a true statement.

And yes I carry a $2000+ Ed Brown as my CCW. Do you think I really care what happens to it if I use it successfully to defend myself? It's $2000, I like to think I am worth a bit more than that alive.