WRONG response to citizen request for PD

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Josey

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A friend/neighbour had an interesting contact with the PD. His MILs house had sold and he was cleaning out the outbuilding. He found a stash of stolen streetsigns and packaged marijuana!! (I don't know the amount) He called the PD (non-911) to report the streetsigns and drug discovery. When the PD arrived, he was treated like a criminal. He was accused of stealing, the officer wanted to know where the grass came from and he was held. The officer did come around to seeing that the neighbour was innocent after he found no records, wants or warrants hung on his name. A sergeant ordered the neighbour to be released, no formal charges. My neighbour believes that he was treated poorly by the PD. He thinks that they thought he was a cleaning/garbage man due to his appearance. He said it was sure hot in the backseat with temps in the 90s and no air on in the cruiser. Has anybody else been treated like the BG? We can only imagine what would have gone down if my neighbour was CCWing. A property owner reports found proerty and drugs and is treated as the criminal. Not right. BTW, no rookies involved. Veteran LEOs. A corporal-FTO and a sergeant. Weird.:confused: :cuss: :banghead:
 
Sounds about normal..we run warrants on EVERYONE we come into contact with, no exceptions.

As for the drugs/signs, they are contrabsnd, and in his possesion..whos the most obvious suspect? He was released with no charges..no harm done.
 
Umm, I sort of understand running warrants on everyone you meet. Not really but okay. But this guy phoned in the police report himself. What on Earth would make a responding officer who knew this think it might belong to him?

The harm was to the neighbor's attitude toward LE officers. A better response would have a been a simple "thank you" when they arrived at his house.
 
You never know what the dispatcher told the officer responding to take the stuff. You would be amazed at the things that are often left out. All in all, the guy that was doing the cleaning up would look like the most likely suspect and in this business, everybody we meet lies to us from victims to suspects and witnesses. They all have their agendas and sometimes it is hard to sort them out. Victims will claim that they have never done a wrong thing in their life and had nothing to do with their victimization. Suspects will say they are the victims and didn't do anything. Witnesses will either say they saw nothing or that they saw everything in excruciating detail, even things that didn't happen. Usually the truth is someplace in the middle.

True story- Back in Memphrica, a buddy went to take a report on an assault and they needed the victim to report to the hospital for photos and a doctor to document the injuries. The Officer asks if the "victim" needs a ride and the "Victim" says no, that he has a car...he then goes and gets into his STOLEN car which he starts with a screwdriver. Victim...Suspect...Witness.... Sometimes it runs together. It sounds like it worked out though, no arrest and no charges.
 
It's this kind of BS, times 10, actually, that made me hate police as a general rule of thumb during the 1960s.

While my views on a lot of things have changed since the 1960s, my general view of the police certainly has not.

I've had several dealings police in Virginia and New York since the 1980s (traffice accidents, a break in at the hotel I was staying at, etc.).

Arrogant, obnoxious, and generally worthless.
 
liliysdad...

"..no harm done."

Based upon the facts as presented I would have to respectfully disagree. If this individual voluntarily called the police, was able to identify himself as the caller, could prove his purpose for being there, and there are no pertinent facts left out, then why was he placed in the cruiser at all?

Now I can certainly see running his name for warrants but why restrain him in any manner? Was their any evidence or circumstance which made the officer fear for his safety? None that I can see.

Now I normally support the police and take their side in most discussions. BUT, if I see a situation where the officer acted improperly I will point that out.

Too many incidents like this and honest citizens are likely to stop reporting potential crimes.
 
I find it hard to reconcile the IVth Amendment with "routine detention" of a voluntary disclosure of discovered contraband?

But what do I know? :rolleyes:

CZ52'
 
See, here's the thing:

I have seen cops be rude, obnoxious and generally behave in a manner disgracing the uniform. Not often, but I've seen it once or twice.

I have also seen cops behaving in a perfectly reasonable and professional manner, and then be accused of being rude, obnoxious and behaving in a manner that disgraces the uniform. I've seen that a lot.

So, which happened here? No idea. In order to determine what happened you'd need to do a full investigation. Talk to the caller. Talk to the officers. Talk to witnesses. Get all the 411 that the officers had prior to going on the run. This sounds like a job for Internal Affairs. If the caller in this really feels aggrieved, he should call them. I'm serious. I fully agree that 'mere' rudeness complaints are serious. The police should treat people with respect.*

Mike

* there are varying levels of respect, mind you...from the respect shown to an elderly robbery victim, to the respect shown to someone you just arrested for doing the robbery. Not the same thing, obviously. ;)
 
I had a guy call me once to report that his dope had been stolen...so should he not have gotten locked up bc he was the caller? After all, he called the cops... Investigative detention is just that, detention. It is not an arrest and the guy did not go to jail. If the officer on the scene thought the guy that he met upon arrival had something to do with the dope, he was right to investigate and during that investigation, he had better make sure that a potential suspect doen't decide that he is about to get caught and go for a gun or run off...so you put them in the back of the car. That is just simple logic. You can't investigate while a potential suspect is standing behind you..least you end up with an RIP sign after a weapon take away.
 
Whom among us has:

Interviewed the person and officers involved?
Examined the evidence and scene?
Listened to the dispatch tapes of the reporting phone call and radio transmissions?
Personal knowledge of any of the actors and reporter?
Jumped to conclusions? The police in this scenario? The responders in this thread?

If only everything on the street was as cut, dried and simple as it is on the 'net.
 
I had a guy call me once to report that his dope had been stolen...so should he not have gotten locked up bc he was the caller? After all, he called the cops... Investigative detention is just that, detention. It is not an arrest and the guy did not go to jail.

If you can't tell the difference between the two situations, then maybe you need a job where you don't deal with the public.

Detaining someone in that fasion a person who called the police to report that he found illicit items is at best rude. It's also a good way to discourage cooperation from the public.

Why detain him in the car? I understand checking for warrants, but leaving him in the back of a cruiser on a hot day is really rude considering that he did the propper thing by calling the police.

When you dealt with the druggie that called to report his drugs were stolen, it was an extreme case in which the criminal was telling you that he was guilty and that you needed to treat him like a criminal. When you get a call by someone telling you they discovered contraban on their property you have no reason to treat that person as a criminal until you find some evidence showing that they committed a criminal act.

If you can't treat people with respect, you shouldn't deal with the public.

edit: In my recent experiences with the police I have treated them with respect and that respect has been returned. I had a couple past experiences where I treated officers with respect, and was treated extremely rudely.

In the cases where I was treated rudely, the officers also weren't doing their job. Both pulled me over for speeding when I wasn't going the spped they claimed. In the second case the officer never even clocked me like he claimed, and when I pointed out my radar detector (which I purchased after the first incident) he was obviously very surprised that he had just been caught in a lie, stuttered a bit and stumbled off. It was simply late, and I was relatively young, and he was out fishing for "troublemakers".

From my experiences I have little respect for officers who aren't polite and respectful. My experience has shown me that those that can't show respect for the people they are dealing with don't respect their rights, and don't have a refined sense of integrity. In other words it's a warning flag that tells me that this is a person I can't trust, and when that person is a law enforcment officer, that can be a very bad thing.
 
Wow he calls them to report something that was stolen and they come and throw him in a squad car!! I guess that must be the SOP.
 
I had a guy call me once to report that his dope had been stolen...so should he not have gotten locked up bc he was the caller? After all, he called the cops... Investigative detention is just that, detention. It is not an arrest and the guy did not go to jail. If the officer on the scene thought the guy that he met upon arrival had something to do with the dope, he was right to investigate and during that investigation, he had better make sure that a potential suspect doen't decide that he is about to get caught and go for a gun or run off...so you put them in the back of the car. That is just simple logic. You can't investigate while a potential suspect is standing behind you..least you end up with an RIP sign after a weapon take away.

How is this related?? He called in he found drugs in his shed, and was willing to turn the drugs into the cops. Honestly I don't care if the drugs were his and he had quit and forgoten he left them there, if he was trying to get those drugs of the street there was no need for any detention unless he had warrents out.

Sorry, 99.9% of the time I side with the cops, but unless there is some blaring lie in this story I can't think of any small details that would change how I think about it. Cops were wrong!
 
Most LEOs that I know have a rule,

Be polite

Be Courteouse

and most of all, be aware that everyone we meet on duty has the potential to kill you stone dead.

As I said above, you can not investigate while a potential suspect roams around your 6. That is just suicidal. Locking the guy in the car was ok, but the Ofc should have turned on the AC... It sucks to sit in a hot car.
 
Most LEOs that I know have a rule,

Be polite

Be Courteouse

and most of all, be aware that everyone we meet on duty has the potential to kill you stone dead.

As I said above, you can not investigate while a potential suspect roams around your 6. That is just suicidal. Locking the guy in the car was ok, but the Ofc should have turned on the AC... It sucks to sit in a hot car.

Fair enough. If I end up dealing with an officer that follows those rule, then we will get along just fine. I can understand needing to keep the property owner from wandering around behind you while you investigate. However, since this was an outbuilding, maybe asking him to wait in the house would have been a better choice. However, it's quite possible that in that situation putting him in the car made good sense.
 
In this case not only will the person reporting the crime think twice about calling the PD but so will his neighbors once they discover WHY he was held.

As far as the officer responding not knowing the reason for the call,...BS, what are the radios for? He calls in a records check right? Why not clarify WHY he is responding during the records check? He can do this in the car with the AC on. I see officers all the time sit with the car running and the AC on. No reason to treat an upstanding citizen this way.

In the future, this guy will flush the dope and pitch the signs in the nearest dumpster. Can't say I blame him.
 
LEO's are like store clerks, sometimes you get a good one, sometimes you get a bad one (as in attitude, rudeness, etc..).

The best thing to do is call the station and make a report. It goes into their main file (or should, you never know).

I would look on the bright side, at least he wasn't handcuffed and then shot .

Wayne
 
Yeah, usually the only people we shoot once they are cuffed are Meth Addicts that intentionally jump in front of charging Pit Bulls that we are shooting at... But even then, we usually only hit them in the leg;)
 
Good procedure or not, the man probably feels like he was penalized for doing the right thing. You can not blame him if he walks away with a bad taste in his mouth.

Could any members of the law enforcement profession offer a suggestion as to how to notify the police of a find such as this without ending up in the back of a cruiser?
 
Yeah, usually the only people we shoot once they are cuffed are Meth Addicts that intentionally jump in front of charging Pit Bulls that we are shooting at... But even then, we usually only hit them in the leg

LMAO, I saw someone come into North Memorial's ED with a GSW that was accquired exactly in that manner. He didn't want little fluffy getting shot for biting ANOTHER cop so he jumped in the way.
 
FedDC,

Not all "civilians" lie to law enforcement. Some of us just don't talk to them much at all if we can possibly help it. We don't report crimes or disturbances anymore, because we know from our own or others' experiences that once they get there, they'll find something wrong with *us*. The 9-year-old, arthritic dachshund's not tied up just right. The kids don't look happy. Maybe they've been abused or neglected. Maybe the place is not spic-and-span. Maybe the lawn needs mowing. Maybe we drank a beer or a glass of wine with supper, and they can smell it on us. The instant we step out on our porch (or maybe even just open the door a crack) we're "intoxicated in public."

Detaining and running warrant checks on *everybody* you happen to meet, people who *were* trying to cooperate and assist you, is not the way to win or keep friends. *Millions* or people who used to like, respect, and support law enforcement now *fear* and distrust it. Don't think it's just some inner city underclass crack gangstas or backwoods meth cookers who have a problem with law enforcement.

Oh, this is almost off-topic, but something was said about the good citizen who reported some contraband being mistaken for a cleaner or garbage man because of how he was dressed. Does everyone have to go around in an expensive three-piece suit and spit-shined wingtips to be considered an upright citizen now? Who would wear an expensive three-piece suit and spit-shined wingtips to clean out a grage or some outbuildings?

MCB
 
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