Pietta 1858 Remington

The Cabela's 1858 is a fine revolver. I have the one you describe, and love it. That price is way too high though, IMHO. If you can, wait for a sale, or special code, and get it for $200 (typically). Might go on sale soon since they're doing a sale on a couple of the Pietta colts at the moment.

I got one for Christmas. $199 w/ free starter kit and shipping (iirc?).

However I'd have much preferred the Uberti model. Pietta chambers run about 0.446" with a .452" bore.

Dovetailed sight and lever latch are superior, especially as mine shoots a little left.

The hammer nose required a bit of filing to fit into the safety notches.

The hand and bolt had very sharp edges needing smoothed a bit.

I greatly dislike the reddish stain they used and the grip panels didn't fit all that well and were a bit large for my smaller hands so I had to remedy these issues.

I shoot conicals which required the loading port/window to be opened up quite a bit.

Rodwha, Uberti revolvers suffer from the exact same problems. Well, except for the front sight...

I especially like those short barreled Pietta Remingtons, but I agree that price is to high to be considered any kind of bargain. That said, it is a fair price, but you will likely see it much lower on sale sooner or later if you have the time to keep watching and wait.

I have a Uberti which is very nice----the hammer fits the safety notches as is. I recently obtained a Pietta version that was listed by EMF as Sheriff's model, with full fluted cylinder, checkered grips, and a very nice color case hardening on the frame. Maybe Remington never made 'em this way, but they should have. Yes it was expensive. But it is a nice gun!
The hammer doesn't fit the safety notches.... not sure if filing will work as the flutes make the cylinder profile different.
Both Uberti and Pietta models are well made and I'm not sure I could say which is higher quality.

My short barreled Pietta is my favorite, but FYI.....
It is harder to load with the shortened loading lever. Not a real deal breaker.....but you lose some leverage.

Mizar said:

Rodwha, Uberti revolvers suffer from the exact same problems. Well, except for the front sight...

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They don't have the grossly undersized chambers either (.450" from what I've read). Nor do they have a loading window that won't accept anything but a ball without modification. I've not read of anyone needing to file the hammer nose to operate the safety.

I've read that a few people have had the pressed fit sight and lever catch fall off. Not necessarily common though.

The red stain is very much just personal as is the size of the grip.

My take, due to what I've read, is that one would likely need less work on an Uberti NMA or a Pietta Colt.

I have both, a full sized Uberti, and a Pietta sheriff.
The Uberti has the better, more crisp action. The sheriff's model is my favorite.
It's a toss up which one you might like best. Like I said in an earlier post, the shorter loading lever complicates things a bit. It's not too big of a deal when shooting off the bench and using a loading stand. If you will be loading and reloading in the field, I might suggest the full size version.
If you ever use it to compete in an nmlra event, the cap and ball revolvers are *supposed* to be "as issued".

Howdy

I prefer the 8" barrel length. More authentic, plus the loading lever is a little bit longer, giving you a little bit better leverage shoving the balls into the chambers.

What ever you do, don't cheap out and buy a brass frame. Buy a steel frame. Stronger and will not stretch. Particularly if you are considering buying a cartridge conversion cylinder for it.

The short lever does bother the hand after a while. I use the rag I wipe it down with to soften it a bit after a while.

They don't have the grossly undersized chambers either

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They do, actually. It's just that Uberti has a slightly bigger bore - about .454 Vs. .452 for Pietta. All in all, both Uberty and Pietta cylinders must be reamed for optimal performance.

Nor do they have a loading window that won't accept anything but a ball without modification.

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You are correct, but a 5 min. job with a small file and some cold blue solution remedies that in no time. What is more important is that Uberti seems to use a faster rifling twist, better suited for conicals. General wisdom is, that Piettas are better suited for round balls. But, on my own 1858 Pietta I'm using a modified Lee ROA conical mold, shortened with about 0.07", but still longer than the 200 grain .450 Lee offering. I have reamed the cylinder to .453, so the smaller conical does not fit anymore like it should. It shoots like a dream - no sign of bullet tumbling, very good accuracy with max charge of 35 grains of BP... I have shot some pretty decent groups at about 80 yards with no problems. So I think that the rifling twist is more than adequate.

I've read that a few people have had the pressed fit sight and lever catch fall off. Not necessarily common though.

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As you say, it's not common. And you have some Ubertis with grossly oversized dovetails... So I'm not quite sure which is better.

The red stain is very much just personal as is the size of the grip.

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Indeed. Also, both makers use some type of polyurethane varnish for the grips...

In general, Uberti makes a better finished gun. But it's better only on the outside. Inside the frame, both manufacturers show the exact same POS level of execution... One more thing - about 4 months ago I examined two brand new 1860s - Pietta & Uberti. Side by side I could not tell which is which, except looking at the markings - both guns were equal in terms of fit and finish.

I like the look of the Remington 1858 Sheriff's Model but Cabela's retail price is too high. I would wait for it to go on sale.

I have the Pietta 1858 Rem Sheriff (short barrel) and use a Taylor's Conversion Cylinder, reloading my own 45LC with BP. It's very solid and a fun shoot. Like others, I got mine on sale at Cabela's.

Mizar said:

They do, actually. It's just that Uberti has a slightly bigger bore - about .454 Vs. .452 for Pietta. All in all, both Uberty and Pietta cylinders must be reamed for optimal performance.
You are correct, but a 5 min. job with a small file and some cold blue solution remedies that in no time. What is more important is that Uberti seems to use a faster rifling twist, better suited for conicals. General wisdom is, that Piettas are better suited for round balls. But, on my own 1858 Pietta I'm using a modified Lee ROA conical mold, shortened with about 0.07", but still longer than the 200 grain .450 Lee offering. I have reamed the cylinder to .453, so the smaller conical does not fit anymore like it should. It shoots like a dream - no sign of bullet tumbling, very good accuracy with max charge of 35 grains of BP... I have shot some pretty decent groups at about 80 yards with no problems. So I think that the rifling twist is more than adequate.
As you say, it's not common. And you have some Ubertis with grossly oversized dovetails... So I'm not quite sure which is better.
Indeed. Also, both makers use some type of polyurethane varnish for the grips...

In general, Uberti makes a better finished gun. But it's better only on the outside. Inside the frame, both manufacturers show the exact same POS level of execution... One more thing - about 4 months ago I examined two brand new 1860s - Pietta & Uberti. Side by side I could not tell which is which, except looking at the markings - both guns were equal in terms of fit and finish.

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That's the first time I've read of anyone stating the Uberti has a .454" bore and not a .452" bore.

My 2013 Pietta NMA has a 1:16" twist.

That's the first time I've read of anyone stating the Uberti has a .454" bore and not a .452" bore

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Well, OK... Some people state that their 1858 Ubertis even have .456" barrels.

My 2013 Pietta NMA has a 1:16" twist.

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So my information is outdated - thank you for clarifying that.

I had a Howell's conversion for my sheriff's model 1858, but had better accuracy with round ball. The conversion Chambers were .452, as is the barrel. As usual in these, my c&b chambers are a few thousandths smaller, but I still get better accuracy with it. I don't use loading levers, so the stumpy lever on it is no worry for me.

noelf2 said:

I had a Howell's conversion for my sheriff's model 1858, but had better accuracy with round ball. The conversion Chambers were .452, as is the barrel. As usual in these, my c&b chambers are a few thousandths smaller, but I still get better accuracy with it. I don't use loading levers, so the stumpy lever on it is no worry for me.

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Do you use very light loads?

My pistol does equally well with a ball or my 170/195 grn boolits with the same 30 grn charge of 3F Olde E or T7 at 15 yds offhand. Maybe if I found one of those 15-20 grn charges with a ball there'd be enough of a difference to tell.

If Im not mistaken the grip frame (and possibly the entire frame itself?) is smaller on the Ubertis and are more in line with the size of the originals then the Piettas??

I know for a fact that ASMs where smaller... Always have liked them.

I have the Pietta 5.5" and will probably never get rid of it... it was my first BP revolver and it is a GREAT piece. Looking back though, I wish I had started with the Uberti 5.5". Better gripframe for MY hands (yours may be different), and easier sight adjustment. I doubt Uberti has much in the way of better QUALITY these days (make SURE you get a RECENT Pietta if you go that route!), but I think I would have been better off with the smaller grips.

I seriously doubt Ill ever get RID of it, but if I can replace my Pietta 5.5" with an Uberti I will probably end up chopping the frame on Pietta one to three and a half or four inches.. Installing a dovetail sight and possibly a conversion... At which point it will basically be an entirely different gun.. Shrugs..

I also have a Pietta "target" model... Once I get it set up right I will probably keep it the way it is... Unless I start winning gold with the dern thing, THEN I'll switch over to a $2000 German special.... Course.. Im going blinder by the SECOND, so I aint holding my breath on that happening LOL!

With the modifications (my chambers were reamed to 0.449" and chamfered but thinking of going slightly further) I'm pleased enough. My 15 yd offhand groups are only about 1/2" larger than my Ruger. Hard to complain.

I must say I'm rather curious what more modern bores run in the Uberti models these days.

I reamed the chambers on my Pietta (fake 1851 brass .44, not the Remmy) to .4515 with the barrel slugging at between .450/.451. The chambers were .446 or so previously. Made a HUGE difference in accuracy. Went from unenjoyably inaccurate (pie plate at 25 yards "why did it hit over there?!?") to a 3 to 4" group at 25, and feeling that the variation was down to me instead of the gun. Cleaning up/cutting the forcing cone to 11 deg and squaring up the target crown also made improvements, but small in comparison. I reamed mine on a mill to .449, making sure to center up on each chamber, then honed them up to .4515 with a fancy hone machine (access to a machine shop is wonderful). Slight chamfer on each. Using precision diameter bore pins to keep things precise. Definitely have to use either .454 or maybe better .457 balls after this.

I've been toying with the idea of bringing my chambers to .451-3" but those thin walls has given me pause. I was told by a fellow who has that it's plenty. I asked if he was using sporting grade powders with reasonable loads (not light target loads) and he said he did. So I'm still considering it.

What charges do you use?

only up to 30 grains black, but my pistol is brass frame. You are not reducing the wall thickness in any significant way, you are taking maybe 5 to 6 thou off the diameter, but only half that, 2 to 3 thou off the thickness between the chamber and the outside of the cylinder. That is next to nothing. 0.003" = 1/333th of an inch.

Yeah, but they sure do look thin to begin with!

30 grns is what my NMA does well with, though I use an adjustable rifle measure with 10 grn graduations. Eyeing 5 grns isn't too difficult but I've not tried anything else. It could well be that there's a slightly better charge.