Red dot sight screws broken off

MoreIsLess · Mar 2, 2019

I took my Smith & Wesson M&P CORE to the range see how well I could shoot it with the red dot sight attached (Burris Fast Fire III). On about the 50th round the FF III went flying through the air and landed about 30 feet behind me. The mounting plate (provided by S&W) landed in front of me. Upon inspection, the mounting screws (provided by S&W ) had sheared off and are still stuck in the slide.

Can this be repaired by a gunsmith or should I send this in to Smith and Wesson. If Smith and Wesson, would they likely fix it or replace the slide? I've had the gun just shy of a year, so hopefully this would be warranted.

RKRCPA · Mar 2, 2019

That should be an easy fix by any gunsmith.

Hokie_PhD · Mar 2, 2019

Sometimes you can drive a sheared fashioner out with a small screw driver or punch and a hammer.

Line it up against the edge and go counter clockwise.

If that doesn’t work there are ez outs. Or a drill and tap it out.

Of course if you don5 wan5 to try this as RKRCPA said pay a gunsmith to do it

rpenmanparker · Mar 2, 2019

I have had similar done. It is just a drill exercise to thin out the screw body until the pressure in the hole makes it collapse. Then it can be removed. Often the original threads can be saved and drilling a larger hole and retapping isn’t necessary. I suspect the reason for the event was the screws were overtightened. Use LokTite but don’t overtighten next time. 12 inXlb should be plenty.

rpenmanparker · Mar 2, 2019

The fragile hex openings in many screws makes overtightening impossible, but Torx heads make it very likely.

Otto · Mar 2, 2019

You really need a drill press if you want the holes straight and true...this prevents damage to the threads.
Your local machine shop may be less expensive than a gunsmith.

rpenmanparker · Mar 2, 2019

Otto said:
You really need a drill press if you want the holes straight and true...this prevents damage to the threads.
Your local machine shop may be less expensive than a gunsmith.

I don’t disagree, but many machine shops are set up for larger jobs. Gunsmiths are set up for small jobs for individuals.

I have a similar situation right now. The red dot base on my .45 ACP 1911 is mounted in the dovetail. This has always worked for me in the past, but in this case about 50 rounds loosens up the optic and mounting plate. I’m pretty sure the fine screws are too short to get enough purchase even with thread locker. Longer screws can’t be used because they bottom out on the dovetail floor before tightening. So I am having my gunsmith drill all the holes through the top of the slide to really secure everything with long screws into the slide. $120. Not exactly cheap, but I don’t think you can get most machine shops to take on a small job like that. Just my opinion.

MoreIsLess · Mar 2, 2019

Do you think Smith and Wesson would repair it or give me a new slide? It was their screws that broke off. The gun is less than a year old. I'm concerned that if I have a gunsmith drill it out, then the S&W screws may not fit anymore.

tipoc · Mar 2, 2019

Call S&W they should be able to make the repair easily. The job is a simple one and if they screw it up they have fallback.

Hokie_PhD · Mar 3, 2019

tipoc said:
Call S&W they should be able to make the repair easily. The job is a simple one and if they screw it up they have fallback.

I was going to say the same
It never hurts to call and ask

Worse case they say no

Best case they make good

MoreIsLess · Mar 4, 2019

I called Smith and Wesson. They said to send the slide into them for repair. They sent me a pre-paid Fed-Ex label.

It just occurred to me that I had the Apex trigger kit installed on the gun. Would this likely prevent the repair from being repaired under warranty? The repair work should involve the slide and not the trigger mechanism.

Hokie_PhD · Mar 4, 2019

MoreIsLess said:
I called Smith and Wesson. They said to send the slide into them for repair. They sent me a pre-paid Fed-Ex label.

It just occurred to me that I had the Apex trigger kit installed on the gun. Would this likely prevent the repair from being repaired under warranty? The repair work should involve the slide and not the trigger mechanism.

If you’re sending just the slide back it shouldnt

MoreIsLess · Mar 4, 2019

Hokie_PhD said:
If you’re sending just the slide back it shouldnt

Actually, I sort of mis-spoke. They told me that they could send me a pre-paid label to send the entire gun in. Or, I could just send the slide, in which case there would be no pre-paid label offered and I would have to pay the shipping. I told them to send me the label and I would send the entire gun. Then I got to thinking about the fact that I had the Apex trigger put in my gun and I thought they might be inclined to not cover the warranty if they realized the trigger had been modified. So now I am thinking about just sending the slide, even though I would have to pay the shipping, since they would never know about the Apex trigger if they just had the slide. Not worth risking having to pay for the repair myself just to save the shipping cost. Then again maybe the Apex trigger won't matter to them since it had nothing to do with the slide being damaged.

beag_nut · Mar 4, 2019

The price to ship the slide (which is simply a part or assembly) would likely be much cheaper than a gunsmith.

straightshooterjake · Mar 4, 2019

A full Apex trigger kit includes the firing pin block plunger and spring which are installed in the slide. On most models, these parts fit under the rear sight, and are retained by the sight. But I am not sure if the CORE models retain these parts differently.

So depending on which Apex kit you have, it is possible that the parts in your slide were modified by the Apex kit. If you did not install the Apex kit yourself, you might need to ask the installer whether the slide was modified or not.

doubleh · Mar 5, 2019

MoreIsLess said:
Actually, I sort of mis-spoke. They told me that they could send me a pre-paid label to send the entire gun in. Or, I could just send the slide, in which case there would be no pre-paid label offered and I would have to pay the shipping. I told them to send me the label and I would send the entire gun. Then I got to thinking about the fact that I had the Apex trigger put in my gun and I thought they might be inclined to not cover the warranty if they realized the trigger had been modified. So now I am thinking about just sending the slide, even though I would have to pay the shipping, since they would never know about the Apex trigger if they just had the slide. Not worth risking having to pay for the repair myself just to save the shipping cost. Then again maybe the Apex trigger won't matter to them since it had nothing to do with the slide being damaged.

It should cost very little to ship it yourself. That's the way I would go and be sure to insure it if using USPS.

thomas15 · Mar 5, 2019

I have heard different stories about S&W and repairs with aftermarket triggers. Some say that S&W will remove the aftermarket trigger and install a factory trigger. Others have said that they leave the aftermarket trigger alone. Still others are said to have put a note with the firearm stating that this is their competition firearm and to leave the trigger alone and they have. Maybe the answer is "it depends"?

Personally, since I have a lot of post sale revolversmith work done on my competition revolvers that if I had a problem such as the OP I would pay out of pocket to have a revolversmith do the fix. I don't want to tangle with S&W for possible warranty work just to save a few bucks and have my tuned actions messed around with and their long lead times can be a pain but that is just me.

MoreIsLess · Mar 5, 2019

thomas15 said:
I have heard different stories about S&W and repairs with aftermarket triggers. Some say that S&W will remove the aftermarket trigger and install a factory trigger. Others have said that they leave the aftermarket trigger alone. Still others are said to have put a note with the firearm stating that this is their competition firearm and to leave the trigger alone and they have. Maybe the answer is "it depends"?

Personally, since I have a lot of post sale revolversmith work done on my competition revolvers that if I had a problem such as the OP I would pay out of pocket to have a revolversmith do the fix. I don't want to tangle with S&W for possible warranty work just to save a few bucks and have my tuned actions messed around with and their long lead times can be a pain but that is just me.

That's some good insight. I took my gun to a local gunsmith to get his thoughts and he told me I'd be making a big mistake to send the entire gun to S&W and that once they saw the Apex trigger they would just send it back to me and refuse to do the work even though the work needing to be done was on the slide. According to the gunsmith, if S&W repairs the gun and sends it back to me, they are vouching for the fact that it is now in proper working order and they would be exposing themselves to possible liability for a gun with a trigger not installed by them.

In the meantime, I contacted the gunsmith that put the Apex trigger in and he said to bring to him and he would perform the repair on the slide. I probably should have contacted him in the first place but he lives about 30 miles away. But, I think this is probably the best path to take.

wally · Mar 6, 2019

You really need a drill press if you want the holes straight and true...this prevents damage to the threads.

Actually you may need a milling machine and a very small end mill to make the broken screw surface flat enough so a drill bit doesn't "slide off" at an angle and break or cut up the original threads.

Also these screws are sometimes too small for the smallest ez-out.

Red dot sight screws broken off

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