Need Advice - Para USA refusing warranty claim because my pistol is Canadian

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BlisteringSilence

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Hey all,

So here's the deal. I have an LDA CCO in .45 GAP that I actually really like. It's a good little pistol, smooth shooting, and plenty accurate for what I need.

In the last 3 months, it's developed 3 terrible habits:

1. Failure to extract - at times, the extractor just either misses the rim, or slides over it. There aren't any tooling marks that I can see via naked eye, but the round is firmly stuck enough in the chamber that I have to poke it back out from the muzzle end.

2. Failure to feed - generally toward the end of the magazine (but not always), and usually this can be fixed with new mag springs. BUT, this is a .45 GAP, and I can't find replacement springs for the life of me.

3. Failure to eject combined with nose up round in the magazine. In these, it's like the extracted brass never hits the ejector, and just gets hung up in the chamber.

I have experienced all 3 with both 185gr and 200gr bullets, and both ball and hollowpoint.

I've tried the tried and true methods of detail strip and cleaning, as well as polishing the feed ramp, and both to no avail.

So, today I gave up and called Para at the 888 number on their website.

The first guy I spoke with directed me to call Sportsworld in Tulsa to talk with a gunsmith.

So, I called him up, and spend 10 or so minutes talking through the issue with him, and he told me that they'd just need to bring it in and look at it. He told me to call Para and get a return authorization, and so back to Para I went.

Now for the fun phone call.

The girl I spoke with was very nice, but refused to issue me an RMA or help me at all. She said that since my gun started it's life north of the border, they don't have parts to fix them anymore.

When I asked her how they intended to honor the lifetime warranty on the gun, she repeated over and over, "I'm sorry sir, there's nothing I can do."

Presumably when Remington bought Para, they also had to buy the liability of the warranty, which means that someone at either Para or Remington should be willing to issue me an RMA to get my gun back up and running.

Does anyone here have any advice on who I should talk to, or what I should do, in order to get my gun fixed?

Thanks in advance!
 
I feel your pain, but you have a Para (out of business) LDA (odd-ball DA 1911 type trigger only used by Para and not even in all their guns) in .45 GAP (odd-ball round that I think only Glock currently produces pistols for). With my fingers crossed (and I'd be super polite), I'd give the Remington customer service a go, but if they told me to "pound sand", I'd shrug my shoulders and move on with my life.

Heck, I have an S&W 4506 that was a major product for a major US company, in their inventory for many years and this gun isn't supported anymore. I believe the guys with Ruger P90/P97/P345 are largely in the same boat as Ruger no longer supports those guns with spare parts either.

You have an odd-ball gun, I'd probably look for somebody that is a collector of such and see if they'd like to buy it, knowing the functional limitations of the gun. You'll probably find a buyer.
 
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Based off Para USA website regarding lifetime warranty if you are original owner and gun bought after January 2001 they will fix it.

“At PARA, we believe that providing you with the best pistol means that we stand behind that pistol 100% for as long as you own it. We will provide the original retail purchaser of any one of our pistols with necessary service, free of charge, for the lifetime of the pistol, where adjustment or repair is required due to any defect in manufacturing material or workmanship. This lifetime service policy is available for all Para pistols purchased after the start of the new millennium on January 1, 2001.”

If yours doesn’t meet this criteria I’d buy something else and scrap the Para.
 
When the customer service representative AT ANY COMPANY, gives you a response that you do not like or agree with try this ONE WIERED TRICK...…

















Ask for their manager or supervisor. That works whether you are calling your cell phone provider, UPS/FedEx/USPS, the cable company, whoever. Simply saying "I understand that, but could I speak to a supervisor?"
 
One more thought. I have a CZ P01 that I bought well used that shot great but after a while acted like yours. I replaced the recoil spring with a new one and it’s been fine ever since. Can you get a recoil spring?
 
JTQ said:
Here's a thread from another forum I'm on, this one is from 2013. Note post #8, but I'd be surprised if the offer is still available.

https://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=407521
Click to expand...

I'm going to go this route, likely just have to get escalated up to a supervisor level that can make that call.

SharpDog said:
I would call these folks:
PARA Ordnance LDA parts:
http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/para-ordnance-lda-parts.aspx
Click to expand...

I've talked with them about parts, and they don't have what I need.

:(

They were the only source anyone could come up with for the mag springs, and they politely chuckled. I'm half tempted to try to track down someone in CA who can send me some engineering diagrams and spec sheets and have some springs bent, if that's what it takes. It can't be that different from the 9mm mag spring.

needmorecowbell said:
Based off Para USA website regarding lifetime warranty if you are original owner and gun bought after January 2001 they will fix it.

“At PARA, we believe that providing you with the best pistol means that we stand behind that pistol 100% for as long as you own it. We will provide the original retail purchaser of any one of our pistols with necessary service, free of charge, for the lifetime of the pistol, where adjustment or repair is required due to any defect in manufacturing material or workmanship. This lifetime service policy is available for all Para pistols purchased after the start of the new millennium on January 1, 2001.”

If yours doesn’t meet this criteria I’d buy something else and scrap the Para.
Click to expand...

Mine definitely fits this criteria, I bought it new in 2006 or 2007, and it's serial dates to 2006.

Also, there's a whole "principle of the thing" argument that, damnit, I paid for a gun with a lifetime warranty, the company is still around (technically), I want my gun to run right.

dogtown tom said:
When the customer service representative AT ANY COMPANY, gives you a response that you do not like or agree with try this ONE WIERED TRICK...…

Ask for their manager or supervisor. That works whether you are calling your cell phone provider, UPS/FedEx/USPS, the cable company, whoever. Simply saying "I understand that, but could I speak to a supervisor?"
Click to expand...

I was a little rushed for time today, I'm going to have to book an hour to fight this all the way through. But this is good advice, thanks!

needmorecowbell said:
One more thought. I have a CZ P01 that I bought well used that shot great but after a while acted like yours. I replaced the recoil spring with a new one and it’s been fine ever since. Can you get a recoil spring?
Click to expand...

Man, I wish I could. Unfortunately, it's a captured recoil spring assembly, and no one has the actual spring, owing to the fact that it's .45GAP.
 
Assuming that Remington also has to honor the previous company’s warranty is just that, an assumption
In reality some do, some dont, but they dont appear to have to
I know of a guy that had a problem with his Auto Ordinance semi auto Thompson. His was made before Kahr bought them out and they do not honor the warranty on guns made before they took over
They arent refusing warranty service because its canadian so much as because it was made by the previous company called Para ordinance
 
I bought all the fire control parts from SARCO for my P12 LDA .45 . Just so I won't have a paper weight. Every thing else is available. In my early 90s P14 I put in all AMU surplus 1911a1 parts 10 years ago. I like my three Canadian made Para .45s, I can use the mags in all three if necessary.
 
If “Canadian” guns were warranted exclusively in a Canada operation that does not exist anymore, then that could be problematic - sounds like Remington may have just purchased US assets and liabilities (but what do I know, I just play a lawyer on TV).
I own three beautiful USFA SSA revolvers that now have a worthless lifetime warranty even though USFA technically exists as a Zip Gun producer - I am hopeful that they never break in my lifetime, that is now my new lifetime warranty.
However if you push hard enough, a repair may be forthcoming - good luck.
 
I would just buy an aftermarket wolf spring set and fix the problem myself. Magazines have springs also that probably should be replaced. Then go enjoy the gun I like at a range somewhere. There is nothing warranted for forever, it’s a gimmick. Those days are long gone.
 
I too have a number of "lifetime warranty" items. The warranty unfortunately was not my lifetime, but the lifetime of the Company. Company gone, warranty gone. It is just that simple.

This is a Kimber rifle:

eL9Egdi.jpg

But that Kimber went away and the new Kimber has no responsibility or obligation to fix anything on this rifle.

This is a Winchester rifle

HB9skFG.jpg

But that Winchester went away and the next version had no responsibility or obligation to fix anything if it broke. And the next version of Winchester after than went bankrupt. I have not called FN, but I doubt they assumed any liability for any previous Winchester.

If you don't have the parts, and don't have the ability to fix what is broken, or cannot find someone who does have the parts and the ability to repair, then your gun is forever no longer fit for purpose.
 
BlisteringSilence said:
Mine definitely fits this criteria, I bought it new in 2006 or 2007, and it's serial dates to 2006.

Also, there's a whole "principle of the thing" argument that, damnit, I paid for a gun with a lifetime warranty, the company is still around (technically), I want my gun to run right.
Click to expand...

You've owned it over a decade and it's just now having issues or has it always had issues?
 
I'm not real familiar with the 45 GAP but if it's the same idea as 40 S&W is a short 10mm auto go for a spring set up for 40 S&W. As far as the captive recoil spring if possible replace it with a GI guide rod and recoil spring cap.
 
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BlisteringSilence said:
These issues have really just cropped up over the last 3 months or so. It generally ran like a top before that.
Click to expand...

Aside from the trigger it's basically a 3.5inch 1911. As noted above you can ditch the captive recoil spring assembly to solve that issue. I'd assume an extractor is also the same as a 1911. If I recall correctly GAP has a shorter OAL than 9mm . Maybe look for some sort or extra power 380 mag springs or even try 9mm?
 
They were the only source anyone could come up with for the mag springs, and they politely chuckled. I'm half tempted to try to track down someone in CA who can send me some engineering diagrams and spec sheets and have some springs bent, if that's what it takes. It can't be that different from the 9mm mag spring.
Click to expand...

Re: mag springs.

If you can find another .45 magazine that is similar in size and capacity (regardless of brand or original gun maker), you can probably make THAT mag spring work in your gun. You may have to tweak the follower a bit to get the spring to set right under it.
 
1KPerDay said:
Question, regardless of Para USA or anything else: why in the frickin' FRICK would you make a 1911 in .45 GAP???????
Click to expand...

They thought they would sell.
In addition to the folks in the civilian market that will if for no other reason buy something in a new chambering "just because", Para may have had presence in markets where guns in "military" chamberings (9mm para and 45ACP topping that list pistol wise) are prohibited. this is the real reason Glock had 45GAP developed, contrary to their US ad copy it wasn't "to have .45 in a 17/19 sized gun" it was to have an additional appealing chambering in those markets where they couldn't sell guns in 9mm Para or .45ACP. same can be said for why Glock continues to make guns in a caliber that is pretty much dead anywhere you can have the two older chamberings.
 
tarosean said:
I'd assume an extractor is also the same as a 1911.
Click to expand...

It varies. Some of the newer Para's went to a standard extractor, but most of the older ones are setup for a proprietary Para "Power Extractor" (which has a reputation for being terrible).

You can buy adapters though. I have a 2011 built with a Para Ordance slide (don't ask - I was trying to hand build the cheapest 2011 I could and got the slide cheap from Sarco) and I just ended up using one of the adaptors to use a regular 1911 extractor.
 
Can you get a standard 1911 barrel for the Para? (And mags?)That may be an alternative path worth investigating. The gun SHOULD shoot the same.

As someone above noted, it's strange to see a full-size 1911 offered in .45 GAP as there's little advantage for that caliber in that frame. (The GAP was originally offered, I think, to make .45 run in guns that couldn't take the longer .45 ACP round.)

(I have a Glock 37 and Glock 38, and I also like the .45 GAP option, but I have a Springfield XDM Competition [.45 ACP] which I absolutely love. I carry the Glock 38 in an IWB holster the XDM is a range or a potential home defense gun.)
 
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