The future of rifle ammunition

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I think that in a few years this ammo will be commonplace for bulk ammo. I really don't see caseless ammo using powder. My opinion is that caseless ammo with be more like a gas or liquid fuel with metered injection and electronic ignition with a separate projectile feed. In my mind I have invented it a couple times. But then I have been wrong before. I think. Or maybe metered powder injection with electronic ignition solving handling and primer issues. Hhhhmmm. got me thinking now.
 
Picher said:
I'd be very concerned about users breathing the consumable case gase
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Which brings us back, full circle, to how and what of polymers.
Hirtenberger made a ton of training 7.62nato with a "plastic" case that emitted no fumes (to EU standards of exposure rules).

Polymers are exactly how you make them. Temperature sensitivity sets the mix one way; out gassing another, strecth and strength yet others still. "Plastic" is no more one thing than "metal" is. The polymer used in a handgun frame would be under-suited to ammunition, as would polystyrene, polyethylene, polyvinylchloride, Amylbutylstyrene, or the like might be--ammunition would be a custom mix, which would be carefully buried in patents for as long as possible.

Most polymers can be thermoformed, but others are injection moulded, which can represents considerable production expense, which, heretofore has meant that draw-forming gilding metal cases has been cheaper, unless a greater need obviates the expense.
 
I like the idea for 223/556 and maybe 308 cause those get used a lot in semi-autos.

I'd like some sort of biodegradable nature or the SW Desert will be littered with spent plastic cases ... May be best to make them UV biodegradable?
 
 
Looks like the military is going ahead with this.

https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/ne...or-lightweight-polymer-50-caliber-ammunition/
The Marine Corps has awarded a $10 million contract for new lightweight polymer .50 caliber ammunition for the M2 Browning Machine Gun ― a staple of the military’s arsenal since World War II.

The contract was awarded Thursday to MAC LLC, a Bay Saint Louis, Mississippi, based company, according to a Marine Corps Press release.

The company is set to provide the Marine Corps with an estimated 2.4 million cartridges throughout the next two years.

The new ammunition will use lightweight polymer to replace the brass on the cartridges as well as the metal on the ammo cans used to transports the bullets.
 
MechAg94 said:
Looks like the military is going ahead with this.

https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/ne...or-lightweight-polymer-50-caliber-ammunition/
The Marine Corps has awarded a $10 million contract for new lightweight polymer .50 caliber ammunition for the M2 Browning Machine Gun ― a staple of the military’s arsenal since World War II.

The contract was awarded Thursday to MAC LLC, a Bay Saint Louis, Mississippi, based company, according to a Marine Corps Press release.

The company is set to provide the Marine Corps with an estimated 2.4 million cartridges throughout the next two years.

The new ammunition will use lightweight polymer to replace the brass on the cartridges as well as the metal on the ammo cans used to transports the bullets.
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That's just for testing.
 
I wonder how it works after you run 1000 rounds through it in quick succession, then stop, leaving a round chambered. If you can “cook off” a brass round in a hot barrel, what happens to plastic?
 
ApacheCoTodd said:
Used to order in PMC poly-cased by the pallet for re-sale and test firing.

ABSO-FRIKKEN-LUTELY LOVED that stuff.
Couldn't keep it in the shop and had to cut customers off every month when we ran low.

I'd love to have a half a pallet in my garage right now.

Semi-auto, full-auto, hot, cold.... Never failed us in any chamber of any gun. Lighter, less expensive and I never kidded myself about saving it for re-loading either.

Yeah I bought a 1000 about whenever that stuff was about and it had it's good and bad points for me. i still have a couple hindred rounds left. It has a metal head to retain the primer and grip the extractor = good.l
It did not feed well in picky ARs I had , the problems showed up at a carbine school and Louis Awerbuck laughed me into some Wolf half way thru .= bad
It was not that accurate in a super accurate 1/12" Remington Varmint I had , getting about 2" groups instead of 1/2" groups with most equivalent good Brass ammo. = Bad
It stuck in the chamber often when I tried to get rid of it in a Savage 24V .223 O?U I have = bad
It smelled like fried eggs when fired = weird
I gave about 200 rounds of it away to a guy with a Mini 14 and he said it did not feed well, and other did = ?

So I lost faith in it. That was about 15 years ago I think, maybe I couple years less.. It was brand new and cheap !
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Re: reloading polymer cases:

Back in the ‘80’s, a company marketed polymer/aluminum case head ammo that could be reloaded.
The specific bullets were plated cast with a protrusion off the base with a knob on it that allowed the bullets to “snap” into the cases.
Resizing the cases involved boiling them for 5 minutes.

I’ve still got an example lying around in a box of odds and ends that I picked up from a range.

The ammo was a good idea but was trademarked and required buying bullets from manufacturer and excluded competitors. About the same time the McLure-Volkmer bill was passed once again allowing powder, primers, and ammo to be shipped to non ffl holders....

I’ve also got a few Activ hulls and wads (12ga all polymer hulls, except for a stainless steel insert).
Nothing really new under the sun...
 
Well, im sure that neither polymer cases or caseless ammo will have replaced brass completely in my lifetime. Maybe for cheap bulk ammo, 22lr.
And i hope for another 50 years on this planet, well maybe not the ways things are going..but still.

Also, certainly it cant be good for the environment to produce more polymer thats supposed to be discarded immediately after one time use.
 
The army is mounting more and more lasers on stuff, maybe we are debating the future of spears, ...or swords.
 
The manufacturer has stated that not being able to re-load their cases is a feature designed to keep the "enemy" from re-using their product.

I hope everyone understands who the enemy is here ;)
 
MechAg94 said:
Looks like the military is going ahead with this.

https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/ne...or-lightweight-polymer-50-caliber-ammunition/
The Marine Corps has awarded a $10 million contract for new lightweight polymer .50 caliber ammunition for the M2 Browning Machine Gun ― a staple of the military’s arsenal since World War II.

The contract was awarded Thursday to MAC LLC, a Bay Saint Louis, Mississippi, based company, according to a Marine Corps Press release.

The company is set to provide the Marine Corps with an estimated 2.4 million cartridges throughout the next two years.

The new ammunition will use lightweight polymer to replace the brass on the cartridges as well as the metal on the ammo cans used to transports the bullets.
Click to expand...
That would be huge savings in weight and cost. As a M2 gunner the ammo was really heavy. Also one day we will run short of brass .It is getting expensive. I hope it works out. Ever carry a loaded .50 cal. ammo container. It will still be heavy but savings in fuel and effort to move it would be considerable.
 
Newtosavage said:
I myself am surprised that we are still pushing bullets out of barrels with gunpowder to be perfectly honest.
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To be fair, we are not using the same gunpowder we used 100 years ago. We have made improvements.

That said, I think it will be a while before we stop using combustion of chemical propellants to push bullets down range.
 
The trick is to design the ammo for existing guns.....since there are tons of those still around. They are a durable good and last near forever.

Electronic ignitions and propellant injections sound like a paradigm shift which is something I will not jump right into and neither will anyone else. I guess that’s where the military comes in.
 
Frankly, I'm still amazed that there are still men behind the guns during an assault.
Some combination of ground-hugging hover drones, mini-tanks and smart mortar munitions should take a good part of the lead.
Then an ammo failure wouldn't be a personal catastrophe... .
 
Newtosavage said:
I myself am surprised that we are still pushing bullets out of barrels with gunpowder to be perfectly honest.
Click to expand...

I agree. Went to my LGS and tried to buy a Phased Plasma Rifle in 40 watt range and he told me, "...only what you see here pal"
 
About 50 years ago they were predicting that the future of ammunition was a hard pellet with the bullet glued to the front and the pellet was fired electronically. No case, no primer and no ejection after the round fired, so what happened to that idea? And, for the next 50 years we were still loading brass cases.
 
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