1911 nighthawk
- Thread starter charlie-6
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Well, they're generally accepted as excellent pistols, but not as many folks own one as compared to Colts, Springers, etc, because of the price. A Nighthawk is on the order of Ed Brown, Wilson Combat, Les Baer, etc. Very nice, but very expensive. If I had the disposable income I would own one.
Jason
Jason
JTQ
Member
What Jason G said. If you have the cash, an excellent choice. I wish I had one.
Baneblade
Member
They can make anyone a better shooter. The most accurate handgun I have ever fired. Both in the full size and officer variant.
However, the tolerances are very high, and that is problematic. One (my fathers) has had to be repaired twice at SGC with permission from Nighthawk. The plunger tube started to come off (I know, easy fix) but the other was weird. We couldn't get the slide stop out. We took it into SGC and they gave us the "duh" look. My father handed the gun over and watched with amusement as the arrogant jerk stuggled, and failed, to remove it as well. They called Nighthawk, they told the gunsmith what to do, and now it works fine. They never really said what was wrong. Just that the tolerances were so tight and something was "off."
I love the gun, but because it has been picky I would not trust it as a duty/carry/defense pistol.
It is one of the earlier non-rail Talon's.
However, the tolerances are very high, and that is problematic. One (my fathers) has had to be repaired twice at SGC with permission from Nighthawk. The plunger tube started to come off (I know, easy fix) but the other was weird. We couldn't get the slide stop out. We took it into SGC and they gave us the "duh" look. My father handed the gun over and watched with amusement as the arrogant jerk stuggled, and failed, to remove it as well. They called Nighthawk, they told the gunsmith what to do, and now it works fine. They never really said what was wrong. Just that the tolerances were so tight and something was "off."
I love the gun, but because it has been picky I would not trust it as a duty/carry/defense pistol.
It is one of the earlier non-rail Talon's.
I think you are painting with a big brush there, based solely upon your dad's experience. Most folks that I know of that own one have never had a problem.
Also, tight tolerances would never cause problems (unless the blueprints were incorrect). The tighter the tolerances the better. I think what you mean is that the clearances were too small. Big difference.
Jason
benderx4
Member
Wasn't the Nighthawk company born of former Wilson Combat gunsmiths who thought they could make a better gun?
AK103K
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My buddy has a couple of Talons, one in .45, the other in 9mm. I shot both the day he got them and a couple of times since, and they worked flawlessly. Both are accurate, although the triggers were a tad light to my liking. They are "tight" and almost feel hydraulic when you work them by hand, but it doesent seem to affect them function wise.
Well, maybe. I still out shoot my buddy with either Talon, with a stock P229 in 357SIG or my old out of the box Colt Combat Commander every time we go out. He does look good when he's shooting them though.
Never had a problem with mine. Very accurate and reliable. I "heard" from a couple pistolsmiths that they had a few problems when they first started (with the Talon IV), but later models were corrected. They wanted to check mine I have a later model.
mljdeckard
Member
They're the ultimate $5 milkshake.
I shot one at Impact, and it's fantastic, the alumagrips felt great, but for the life of me, I have no idea what it can do that my Kimber can't.
I shot one at Impact, and it's fantastic, the alumagrips felt great, but for the life of me, I have no idea what it can do that my Kimber can't.
then the workmanship of a Nighthawk would be excessive for your uses
Rob96
Member
If it were me spending the money I would go with a Springfield Custom Carry and spec it out. If I couldn't wait that long for the gun to be completed i would go with Ed Brown.
Baneblade
Member
Jason G, you are right, I am basing my opinion on two particular guns, which is a pretty narrow field of view and not fair to the brand as a whole. All guns are prone to issues, however, when the $2500 super custom uber pistol has the same problem after 250 rounds as the $400 pistol that does not reflect well on the company.
As for the tolerances, I am speaking about problems that arise when a gun gets dirty, builds up lint, or has any external factor added in. That is not as much an issue for a range gun, but is absolutely a consideration for a duty/defense/CC weapon.
We have a picture of one of our officers covered head-to-toe in mud after fighting with a meth user. In particular, his gun is covered in mud. We are confident his Glock would work if needed. Would the tight tolerance 1911 function reliably if covered in mud? I don't know, and I'm not about to cover my Dad's Nighthawk in mud to find out.
As for the tolerances, I am speaking about problems that arise when a gun gets dirty, builds up lint, or has any external factor added in. That is not as much an issue for a range gun, but is absolutely a consideration for a duty/defense/CC weapon.
We have a picture of one of our officers covered head-to-toe in mud after fighting with a meth user. In particular, his gun is covered in mud. We are confident his Glock would work if needed. Would the tight tolerance 1911 function reliably if covered in mud? I don't know, and I'm not about to cover my Dad's Nighthawk in mud to find out.
edSky
Member
I have a Nighthawk Custom Talon and it is fantastic, IMO. Like Baneblade said,
No problems with mine, and I'd go in hock to get another.
No problems with mine, and I'd go in hock to get another.
No, what I'm trying to say is that "tolerances" are the allowed margin of error for the pistol's individual dimensions, and are written into the blueprints. You want the tightest tolerances possible (less error), regardless of the pistol's intended purpose. This makes for a better fitment of parts, and more precision among different pistols that came off the same tooling. "Clearance" is the amount of room between individual parts, and is specified by the prints. I think what you are trying to say is that the Glock has more clearance between moving parts, not looser tolerances (although they may be). Large or "loose" clearances are by design. Overly "loose" tolerance implies sloppy design, machining, and/or gunsmithing.
Nighthawk, Wilson, Ed Brown, etc. are known for having very small tolerances, and some of these also have little clearance between certain moving parts. I've not yet seen where this has caused any reliability issues other than internet hear-say. That's not to say that it doesn't, just that I've never seen it.
Jason
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Now that I have an Ed Brown and a Springfield Custom Shop gun - I can honestly say that I will likely not buy standard production model 1911s again. And, I am far from a rich guy who can accumulate tons of expensive 1911s.
I sold 3 guns in the summer of 2008 for 2/3 the price of the Springfield Custom 1911. And, over the course of the 11 month wait - I saved up the other 1/3 with Christmas, birthday, father's day, anniversary present money... And, it will take me many months to pay off the new Ed Brown.
Now, I want another Ed Brown. I am resisting the urge to sell something else to get me there faster.
In years past - I have been one of those guys to question the value of these high dollar guns... But after years and years of that stance... You eventually find yourself wanting one. If you give in, you will see why they are so nice.
If you are NOT interested in these expensive guns - then you will never understand why they are worth it no matter what people who like them say on these threads...
I sold 3 guns in the summer of 2008 for 2/3 the price of the Springfield Custom 1911. And, over the course of the 11 month wait - I saved up the other 1/3 with Christmas, birthday, father's day, anniversary present money... And, it will take me many months to pay off the new Ed Brown.
Now, I want another Ed Brown. I am resisting the urge to sell something else to get me there faster.
In years past - I have been one of those guys to question the value of these high dollar guns... But after years and years of that stance... You eventually find yourself wanting one. If you give in, you will see why they are so nice.
If you are NOT interested in these expensive guns - then you will never understand why they are worth it no matter what people who like them say on these threads...
benderx4
Member
It took me about 5 or 6 1911s before I bought my first Les Baer. THEN I understood. After that, I got my first Springer Custom - now I just can't go back.
glocks rock
Member
I have a GRP and it is an excellent gun . I also have 2 Baers, a PII and TRS. While the trigger on the GRP is better than the Baers, I believe the Baers are a better all round gun. My Nighthawk deff has a good look to it but the Baers seem to be built a little better.
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