25/380 auto

[dave_the_swede]

So I've been seeing quite a bit lately on the russian 5.45x18 on youtube (larry vickers did a video and so did forgotten weapons) I'm a huge fan of Russian weapons and cartridges, and I know that here in the west the 5.45x18 has a lot of mystical properties associated with it because it can penetrate 40+ layers of kevlar (thanks to its steel core and spitzer point) but when you look at it's velocity and bullet weight it's not much more than a .22 lr. The PSM pistol that shoots the 5.45 is pretty cool too but when looking at its dimensions it's very close to the kel tec p-32/p-3at except quite a bit heavier, so I got to thinking, is anyone else interested in .380 or even a 9x18mak necked down to .25? it's similar in concept to the .25naa and .32naa but with a lot more powder behind it. What do you think the hypothetical velocity would be? Put something like that in the lighweight polymer shell of a p-3at or lcp and you'd have a pretty fast little pocket pistol. Whadda ya'll think, am I crazy?

 

[GRIZ22]

The .25 NAA didn't exactly take the country by storm. It was a bit faster than the 5.45x18. What makes you think a 6.35x17 is going to do any better?

IIRC the only reason the Soviets adopted the 5.45x18 is because it would penetrate NATO spec body armor.

 

[ants]

Whadda ya'll think, am I crazy?

You might be, I'm not a psychiatrist.

As far as thinking outside the box, bravo to Dave the Swede!!!
We need people not afraid to think differently. Good on Dave.
If you live near me, we'll spend hours over coffee exchanging unconventional ideas.

What bullets are you going to use? Don't bother with 25acp bullets, I've used them and they're crap.
Speer makes a run of 25acp Gold Dot bullets once every few years, if you can wait for them.
Don't bother with .257" rifle bullets, they are .257" where the 25 caliber handgun is .251".
No need for a super duper 25-380 Auto cartridge if the bullets are pooper.
Or else make it 257-380 so you have a wider selection of 257 rifle bullets.
Not sure where you get a handgun barrel with 257 bore. I guess it's all custom anyway.

Now, if there is interest in a 22 caliber cartridge based on 9mm Luger case, Armscor is already doing that
and my buddy has one. He says it shoots straight and flat for over a hundred yards. That's pretty cool!

If there is interest in a 30 caliber bottleneck handgun cartridge like that, I have a conversion barrel
in my 1911 pistol, chambered for 30 Tokarev. That's one smokin' hot cartridge! Blows out primers regularly!

 

[dave_the_swede]

I live out in the Denver metro area if your around there I am totally game to exchange weird ideas, I got millions of unconventional cartridge and gun ideas. From what I've read, a lot of the reason the russians adopted the PSM and the 5.45 that came with, was because the KGB wanted a conceal carry gun to dispatch subversives, I heard they literally gave them a design constraint that the pistol was to be no wider than a standard box of matches which according to PSM dimensions means a russian matchbox is 17mm wide. According to the lore of the PSM some people believe it was Putin himself who made a request for the tiny pistol. Tochmash probably developed the 5.45 to defeat soft armor, and according to some patterns observed by westerners, 5.45 is the same diameter as their rifle so they in theory could use the same barrel blanks and revert to the time honored tradition of having a pistol in the same bore diameter as their rifle (ie. 7.62x39 is to 7.62x25 or 7.62x54R is to 7.62x38R etc.) soviet firearm development is fascinating. Anyway maybe .251 isn't the best bullet choice, perhaps .224, .204, or even .172 however I was originally thinking for ease of production with my limited civilian equipment and tools it would've been easiest to take a .25 acp barrel and ream it out for a bottlenecked .380