2nd place on Gunbroker question

[tuckerdog1]

Drew my line in the sand, and was outbid by $1. Okay, I lost the auction. A few days later, the same pistol is listed again ( serial number matched ). Spoke with seller ( LGS ). Plan on bidding again, but concerned the winning bidder backed out for condition issues. No condition issue. Turns out, he was just a non-paying bidder. So I "should" have won that auction. So I'm wondering, when someone doesn't pay, why can't the seller offer the item to the person that was next in line, but WILL pay? Maybe there's some scam two bidders can play, but I couldn't think of any, and could find nothing on Gunbroker rules addressing the issue. Is there a way for two bidders to team up and game the system?

 

[WestKentucky]

There should be (used to be I think) a second chance offer. I think what I got emails about in the past was that the item had a reserve and I was close but didn’t make the reserve, disclosed the reserve and offered it essentially as buy-it-now. I thought the same thing happened if there was a no-pay situation. It may be optional for the seller to make such an offer. Maybe they rolled the dice looking for a better bid. Or maybe they have 2 accounts and were pushing the bid up hoping to get more out of it.

 

[film495]

it seems like that could be used to mess with the system, but - I also be that is a pain to do, and most sellers would not bother. no reason you can't ask if they'll give it to you at the price you bid, but you also could get it for less if they list it again. it is an auction site, anything is possible.

 

[twarr1]

Shill bidder. The buyer gets a friend to bid on his auction to drive the price up. If the friend 'wins', the seller says he has a non-paying bidder and relists the item. I'm not saying your particular seller did this, just saying sometimes it happens. But most auction sites have some sophisticated methods to detect shill bidding. If the seller wouldn't take your bid of $1 less, that would be a big red flag for me.

 

[PzGren]

Your handle does not start with belt....? I had some funny question about a gun I sold last Sunday and relisting a similiar Walther.

 

[44caliberkid]

Since you have spoken to the seller, just offer him the same money to buy the gun directly, saves you the sales tax and him the GB fees.

 

[AJC1]

Since you have spoken to the seller, just offer him the same money to buy the gun directly, saves you the sales tax and him the GB fees.

If the seller is not interested in that deal its definitely a warning

 

[Seedy Character]

Direct sale
Save GB theft
Save Sales Tax State theft
Offer 10% LESS

or

Follow relisting and bid accordingly

 

[tuckerdog1]

Since you have spoken to the seller, just offer him the same money to buy the gun directly, saves you the sales tax and him the GB fees.

This seller has been in business 40+ years and has thousands of positive sales on GB. No way they'd risk that on any shill bidding scheme. When I spoke with them about the condition, and they said it was just a non-paying bidder, I didn't think to ask about offering the sale to a 2nd place bidder. They did say there was already a bid on the new listing, so they had to let the auction run it's course. If there had been no bids, they would have sold it to me over the counter.

 

[twarr1]

This seller has been in business 40+ years and has thousands of positive sales on GB. No way they'd risk that on any shill bidding scheme. When I spoke with them about the condition, and they said it was just a non-paying bidder, I didn't think to ask about offering the sale to a 2nd place bidder. They did say there was already a bid on the new listing, so they had to let the auction run it's course. If there had been no bids, they would have sold it to me over the counter.

Didn’t mention all that in the OP

 

[wiscoaster]

Since you have spoken to the seller, just offer him the same money to buy the gun directly, saves you the sales tax and him the GB fees.

Should have been done immediately after the first auction ended and before it was relisted. The iffy part is convincing the seller you're on the level and not in cahoots with the non-paying auction winner.

 

[Mycin]

Should have been done immediately after the first auction ended and before it was relisted. The iffy part is convincing the seller you're on the level and not in cahoots with the non-paying auction winner.

Two people in cahoots wouldn't bid against each other to raise the price and then pull a stunt to get it slightly less than the last bid. Or am I missing something?

 

[wiscoaster]

Two people in cahoots wouldn't bid against each other to raise the price and then pull a stunt to get it slightly less than the last bid. Or am I missing something?

No, you wouldn't think so, but it's not "slightly less" if it results in a direct sale, it could be considerably less without Gunbroker's cut of the selling price.

 

[CodeSection]

......When I spoke with them about the condition, and they said it was just a non-paying bidder, I didn't think to ask about offering the sale to a 2nd place bidder. They did say there was already a bid on the new listing, so they had to let the auction run it's course. If there had been no bids, they would have sold it to me over the counter.

I'm curious what was the GB's rating on this "non-paying bidder"? Was it "NR"? Did the seller post a negative rating on this "non-paying bidder"?

 

[tuckerdog1]

I'm curious what was the GB's rating on this "non-paying bidder"? Was it "NR"? Did the seller post a negative rating on this "non-paying bidder"?

Ya got me curious. Went back and looked. The non payer has an A+(2) rating. guess the seller isn't going to ding him.

I will likely not win it on this new listing. 2.5 days to go, and it's almost at my max. No biggie, there's always something else popping up.

 

[jmorris]

Drew my line in the sand, and was outbid by $1.

If I had a dollar for every time that has happened…

Thing is they “won” for whatever was just above what I was willing to pay. Could have been $1 over my max or 100,000,000,000,000 over my max. Doesn’t matter. Kind of like you don’t get to see my cards, after you fold.

That’s the point of sellers having auctions vs selling for a price. Only one of two things, get rid of it at any cost and hope to pitch people against one another and desire to win.

I am not much of a gambler, so I too, pick a “top dollar” and forget about it unless I win. I don’t win a lot of them but when I do, they are smoking deals.

 

[Riomouse911]

If I only had a dollar for every gun I was the #2 high bid on.


If you really want it bid the same amount again, or a bit more if you think you’ll get outbid again. If you win you win, if not the other guy goes home with it.

I had this happen on a new model .44 Spl. flat top Ruger. Shill bidder beat me by 5 bucks, within a few days the same seller relisted the same gun, the NR “bidder” got no ding on their feedback.

I bid elsewhere, and win that gun for a total of $50 bucks less than my max bid/shipping would have been on the other one .

Stay safe.

 

[Seedy Character]

It is ONLY a $1 more, is what the auction is pushing.

Set your limit and stick to it.

The company was auctioning off and old truck. (sealed, silent bid). A co-worker asks if I was bidding on it, is was looking at it. Told him no.
He asked if I would bid for him?

Asked what was going on?

He says he really wants the truck. He is bidding $2500 and wants me to bid $1753.82. IF he wins, he asks what the 2nd highest bid is. IF the $1753.82 bid is 2nd, he declines purchase and then purchases from me.

I tell him that would be awesome. I bid $1753.82 and sell to him for $2500.

He got mad and left. I bid $2582.52.

Neither of us won.

 

[230RN]

How can you say you "won" a bid when you were willing to pay the highest possible price for the item?

 

[mshootnit]

lots of non paying "bidders" on GB. BTW it is just a listing site, not a real auction. Their own literature says so. It is a service to connect sellers with buyers. Terms and conditions of individual. sellers may or may not be nforceable.

 

[jmorris]

How can you say you "won" a bid when you were willing to pay the highest possible price for the item?

When no one else placed a bit and I lowballed them as usual.

 

[mshootnit]

If you win with a lowball bid, the seller is under no obligation to complete the transaction. You can leave neg. feedback. But GB can not force a seller to actually sell their item. Nor do they care. All they care about is collecting fees.

 

[wiscoaster]

If you win with a lowball bid, the seller is under no obligation to complete the transaction. You can leave neg. feedback. But GB can not force a seller to actually sell their item. Nor do they care. All they care about is collecting fees.

That's completely untrue, IMO. A bid is a binding financial and contractural obligation on the buyer's part. The bid must meet the seller's bidding restrictions, whether it's a starting bid or a reserve. If the bid meets those and if a bidder wins an auction he is legally obligated to complete the transaction, which has two parties, and therefore the seller, being the party to the transaction, not Gunbroker, is also legally obligated to complete his side of the transaction. A winning bidder that doesn't complete the transaction can and should have their account terminated without recourse per the Gunbroker membership terms. I can't speak from the seller's perspective, but I'm willing to bet that a seller that welshes on their selling obligations also violates the GB membership terms and risks getting terminated. Sorry, but I'll be convinced of the accuracy of your statement only by a direct quote from the GB TOS.

 

[beag_nut]

Just move on....

 

[mshootnit]

That's completely untrue, IMO. A bid is a binding financial and contractural obligation on the buyer's part. The bid must meet the seller's bidding restrictions, whether it's a starting bid or a reserve. If the bid meets those and if a bidder wins an auction he is legally obligated to complete the transaction, which has two parties, and therefore the seller, being the party to the transaction, not Gunbroker, is also legally obligated to complete his side of the transaction. A winning bidder that doesn't complete the transaction can and should have their account terminated without recourse per the Gunbroker membership terms. I can't speak from the seller's perspective, but I'm willing to bet that a seller that welshes on their selling obligations also violates the GB membership terms and risks getting terminated. Sorry, but I'll be convinced of the accuracy of your statement only by a direct quote from the GB TOS.

I have read it before, in the information they post for sellers. And what I have posted is true. I dont get paid to do research for you. And what you have said is true for an auction business, which GB is not. GB is a listing service legally.
A seller might lose their account at GB but that has no bearing on legal requirement to complete the sale. GB cannot force you to sell your item. Period.

Direct Quote, GB website:
"Although disputes between Buyers and Sellers are rare, our Site is only a transaction venue and we will not arbitrate disputes or arguments between Users."

"Seller Refuses to Complete Transaction:
Unfortunately, we are unable to force a seller to complete a transaction. We ask you to notify Customer Support and to post appropriate feedback. See Submitting Feedback.
Note: As the seller, you are obligated to sell the item to a willing winning bidder. We cannot force you to complete the transaction with the winning bidder...."