MCgunner
Member
It's turned to a caliber war. Get with the program...
J/K..don't shoot me.
.357 snubbie or 9mm?
- Thread starter Godsgunman
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It's turned to a caliber war. Get with the program...
J/K..don't shoot me.
Tony_the_tiger
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I had Robert Mika build a pocket holster for my 4" GP100
Mainly just so when I had it around the house I didn't have to keep it in leather.
I carry a snub .38 + P (S&W 442) and a snub .357 magnum (S&W 640-1 pro) from time to time. If I carry one, its in a Mika pocket holster. If I carry both (double J frame - see Mas Ayoob's article) then one is in the pocket and one IWB on the alternate side.
In my experience shooting .38 + P, .357, and .44 special out of comparably lightweight snubs, all of them are painful to shoot on the hand. However, they are not uncontrollable.
I tend to select hotter loads when the firearm can handle them, and I mix and match loads. Generally the first two shots I'll have a mid-power load that I am very accurate with. For the next double tap (shots 3 and 4) I'll load a very hot load or a load with different composition for increased power and penetration. For the last round in a 5 shot snub I'll return to the mid-power load.
The reason for including increased power loads is Trooper Coates. If I must defend my life or the life of someone I love and my first two accurate mid-power loads cannot stop the threat, I'm hoping something stronger or with better penetration or different composition can handle it.
Since the subject here is 9mm and .357, I'll speak for the one I have experience with. I use buffalo-barnes XPB .357 built for short barrels (1225 ft/s advertised out of snub barrel) and Underwoods loading of the 158 grain Speer Gold Dot bullet (1475 ft/s out of ?? Barrel. Some online reports showing 1100 - 1200 range out of snub, but not enough data to know for sure). In almost all test cases the 158 gold dot fails to expand and gives about 24" of penetration. But in the context of loading it in a snub that might not penetrate enough, that might be a good thing. Furthermore, I'm not convinced that ballistic gelatin and synthetic bone accurately predict bullet performance in a self defense scenario.
Shot placement is king; penetration is queen; all else is jack.
Whereas snubs are capable of great accuracy at a range, I have no fantasies about taking head-shots at distance while under return fire. Aim center of mass. Don't fire into crowds. Avoid conflict at all costs. Practice (but be careful of your blood lead levels or tracking it back home, especially if you have children).
In general I stick to Barnes bullets for Corbon or Buffalo or Gold Dots in every caliber.
With handguns you will always be making a compromise. Get something you can carry comfortably and safely. Practice with it. Hope for the best. Follow the law. Post lots of pics
That means you, OP, with your new 9.
Mainly just so when I had it around the house I didn't have to keep it in leather.
I carry a snub .38 + P (S&W 442) and a snub .357 magnum (S&W 640-1 pro) from time to time. If I carry one, its in a Mika pocket holster. If I carry both (double J frame - see Mas Ayoob's article) then one is in the pocket and one IWB on the alternate side.
In my experience shooting .38 + P, .357, and .44 special out of comparably lightweight snubs, all of them are painful to shoot on the hand. However, they are not uncontrollable.
I tend to select hotter loads when the firearm can handle them, and I mix and match loads. Generally the first two shots I'll have a mid-power load that I am very accurate with. For the next double tap (shots 3 and 4) I'll load a very hot load or a load with different composition for increased power and penetration. For the last round in a 5 shot snub I'll return to the mid-power load.
The reason for including increased power loads is Trooper Coates. If I must defend my life or the life of someone I love and my first two accurate mid-power loads cannot stop the threat, I'm hoping something stronger or with better penetration or different composition can handle it.
Since the subject here is 9mm and .357, I'll speak for the one I have experience with. I use buffalo-barnes XPB .357 built for short barrels (1225 ft/s advertised out of snub barrel) and Underwoods loading of the 158 grain Speer Gold Dot bullet (1475 ft/s out of ?? Barrel. Some online reports showing 1100 - 1200 range out of snub, but not enough data to know for sure). In almost all test cases the 158 gold dot fails to expand and gives about 24" of penetration. But in the context of loading it in a snub that might not penetrate enough, that might be a good thing. Furthermore, I'm not convinced that ballistic gelatin and synthetic bone accurately predict bullet performance in a self defense scenario.
Shot placement is king; penetration is queen; all else is jack.
Whereas snubs are capable of great accuracy at a range, I have no fantasies about taking head-shots at distance while under return fire. Aim center of mass. Don't fire into crowds. Avoid conflict at all costs. Practice (but be careful of your blood lead levels or tracking it back home, especially if you have children).
In general I stick to Barnes bullets for Corbon or Buffalo or Gold Dots in every caliber.
With handguns you will always be making a compromise. Get something you can carry comfortably and safely. Practice with it. Hope for the best. Follow the law. Post lots of pics
That means you, OP, with your new 9.
Last edited:
MCgunner
Member
Well, yeah, that's why I own 2 9s and 3 .357s.
I have been arguing for the 9 for carry/self defense for a number of reasons, but .357 magnum is probably my all time favorite round...again, for a number of reasons. I don't own a 2" .357, though. Every time I think about getting one, I remind myself how well the 9 shoots and performs and it's light enough for pocket carry. My smallest .357 carry NOW is a medium frame Taurus 66 3" that weighs over 30 ounces. Sweet to shoot, accurate, and not too bad OWB or even IWB, though I admit the SP101 carried easier IWB with the slimmer 5 shot cylinder.I agree 100%. I have a bunch of each and while I realize the 9 is better for urban SD, the old 357 is pretty good. I like the 3" K-frame size as well. As you said the 357 snubs really shine with 140gr and larger bullets. I still have my 2" SP but I wish it was a 3". I've thought about trading it off but it shoots too good and Bianchi doesn't make the pro 100 iWB holster I love for it.
fastest45ever
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- Joined
- Aug 18, 2012
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- 142
Another with both.
Embrace the maddness.
.357 2" Snub, with medium weight, 150 grain load, at around 1200 fps, with high flash powder. A pocket flash bang grenade in more ways then one.
Someone earlier pointed this out. I believe one of the gunwriters I respect pointed out the possible reason for the high percentage of effectiveness is
most of the shootings with snubs take place in dim light, 70% or so, most under 7 yards, and generally 2-3 attackers. I conjecture that the flash bang effect is enough to get the other guys that haven't been shot to think again, and find easier prey.
If this wasn't the case, the original shooters would not be reporting one shot stops, they would be dead.
Embrace the maddness.
.357 2" Snub, with medium weight, 150 grain load, at around 1200 fps, with high flash powder. A pocket flash bang grenade in more ways then one. Someone earlier pointed this out. I believe one of the gunwriters I respect pointed out the possible reason for the high percentage of effectiveness is
most of the shootings with snubs take place in dim light, 70% or so, most under 7 yards, and generally 2-3 attackers. I conjecture that the flash bang effect is enough to get the other guys that haven't been shot to think again, and find easier prey.
If this wasn't the case, the original shooters would not be reporting one shot stops, they would be dead.
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