Joshua Hutchison
Member
Any loader devices, or people who reload here....the shells just cost so much so the tought intrests me...
.410 reloaders?
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Joshua Hutchison
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Does anyone know? 
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MEC is the way to go. Great product and service from the folks at Mayville Engineering Corp.
If you are not sure, start with a single stage. Cost effiecient, easy to learn and and set up. I always competed with loads done by a single stage , had 4 singles and 4 progessives...then a few more wandered in...duplicates of what I already had.
One can always move up to the progessives, one can always convert to another ga, on can alway sell. I suggest keeping single stages around for load testing personally.
Recipes, easy. I use the same recipes forever, I match the AA target load...for instance, all Winchester components.
Pick up a shotshell reloading handbook, will identify hulls and explain the process, will have recipes.
For instance AA Target load: 1/2 oz, 2 3/4 " shell
Win 209 primer
Win 296 powder - 14.0 grains
Win Wad WAA41
Vel 1200 fps
Mec says use bushing #10 to throw 13.7 gr, of powder , use #11 bushing to throw14.6 gr. I tweaked mine to throw 14.0 exactly and mine chrono'd 1200 fps. It is what the pattern board said my gun and choke did best with in an Citori
I marked that bushing spl for tourneys MY # 10.5 bushing and colored that bushing Green...My competition load. Loads for specific guns and tasks...patterns..
HTH and have fun...
If you are not sure, start with a single stage. Cost effiecient, easy to learn and and set up. I always competed with loads done by a single stage , had 4 singles and 4 progessives...then a few more wandered in...duplicates of what I already had.
One can always move up to the progessives, one can always convert to another ga, on can alway sell. I suggest keeping single stages around for load testing personally.
Recipes, easy. I use the same recipes forever, I match the AA target load...for instance, all Winchester components.
Pick up a shotshell reloading handbook, will identify hulls and explain the process, will have recipes.
For instance AA Target load: 1/2 oz, 2 3/4 " shell
Win 209 primer
Win 296 powder - 14.0 grains
Win Wad WAA41
Vel 1200 fps
Mec says use bushing #10 to throw 13.7 gr, of powder , use #11 bushing to throw14.6 gr. I tweaked mine to throw 14.0 exactly and mine chrono'd 1200 fps. It is what the pattern board said my gun and choke did best with in an Citori
I marked that bushing spl for tourneys MY # 10.5 bushing and colored that bushing Green...My competition load. Loads for specific guns and tasks...patterns..
HTH and have fun...
Clark
Member
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.
I saw a Western Fields brand break action .410 for $50 at a gun show, and I could see by how thick the chamber wall was that it was similar to the Handi Rifle 45/70 I had recently done a stress analysis on.
So I bought it for some overload experiemnts.
I found out it was an OEM Stevens.
I worked up allot of crazy loads, but finnally, I used some Win 45 Colt brass, CCI200 large rifle primers, 40 gr of H110, 405 gr [~ one ounce ~] .458" LSWC hard cast bullet 2.1" OAL. That would a 454 Casull double charge if I could get the length down to 1.775", but 2.1" is as short as I can pound the bullet in with a hammer.
That load broke the stock at the wrist.
Any of the loads that day would have broken my collar bone if I held it to my shoulder, so I was pulling the trigger with my right hand and absorbing the recoil with a 2 foot retreat of my left palm on the butt.
Much later, I figured out what broke the stock. I was shooting over a shorty concrete wall, and the butt of the stock must have caught on the wall. With my palm and the stock mass, there were just a few pounds of peak force on the stock wrist, but touching the wall, there could be thousands of pounds of peak force. I will do the math if anyone cares.
Don't try this kind of stuff in your 454 Casull revolver, it could split the thin chamber wall of the cylinder. Not all .410s are built like that one.
I saw a Western Fields brand break action .410 for $50 at a gun show, and I could see by how thick the chamber wall was that it was similar to the Handi Rifle 45/70 I had recently done a stress analysis on.
So I bought it for some overload experiemnts.
I found out it was an OEM Stevens.
I worked up allot of crazy loads, but finnally, I used some Win 45 Colt brass, CCI200 large rifle primers, 40 gr of H110, 405 gr [~ one ounce ~] .458" LSWC hard cast bullet 2.1" OAL. That would a 454 Casull double charge if I could get the length down to 1.775", but 2.1" is as short as I can pound the bullet in with a hammer.
That load broke the stock at the wrist.
Any of the loads that day would have broken my collar bone if I held it to my shoulder, so I was pulling the trigger with my right hand and absorbing the recoil with a 2 foot retreat of my left palm on the butt.
Much later, I figured out what broke the stock. I was shooting over a shorty concrete wall, and the butt of the stock must have caught on the wall. With my palm and the stock mass, there were just a few pounds of peak force on the stock wrist, but touching the wall, there could be thousands of pounds of peak force. I will do the math if anyone cares.
Don't try this kind of stuff in your 454 Casull revolver, it could split the thin chamber wall of the cylinder. Not all .410s are built like that one.
fecmech
Member
Joshua--If this is your first time reloading shot shells I would strongly suggest staying away from the Mec 9000G. This is a progressive press for someone shooting a couple hundred rounds a week. It is a great press but it has an auto advance feature that can ge an inexperienced person in trouble quick. I would second the motion for a single stage press like the Mec 600. If you need a couple hundred rounds a week the Mec Grabber is about 1 box per hour slower than the 9000g ( 9 to 10 boxes per hour) and if you screw up you don't advance it till you clear things up. ( it is essentially the 9000G without auto advance) Good luck Nick
Joshua Hutchison
Member
Oh no, I'm not reloading yet but was curious about reloding .410, and what stuff was needed.
I would like to thank all of the people who have responded to this thread, keep the neat info coming my way ^_^
I would like to thank all of the people who have responded to this thread, keep the neat info coming my way ^_^
Clark
Member
Joshua,
Don't start with the .410.
My shpeal on how to get started:
I got an RCBS Rockchucker kit and an RCBS Video, because I was overwhelmed with how to get started reloading.
If I were to advise someone on how to do it that was a friend, I would show him how, and then loan him enough stuff to do it at his home.
Telling someone how to do it on the internet, I would start out with the tasks that have to be done, and list the cheap tools to get, so the the guy can maintain a mental map of the goals:
38 Special is very easy and cheap to load, most people have one, and the guns have mountains of safety margin. They are a good place to start.
1) Get the old primer out of the case, called depriming or decapping.
2) Make the case small enough in inside diameter to grip a bullet and small enough on the outside to fit in the chamber. This is called resizing.
Both steps 1) & 2) are usually accomplished in one step as the resizing die has a decapping pin. This will require:
a) Shell holder ~$3 Lee #1 shell holder or ~$5 RCBS #6 shell holder.
The same size shell holder can be used later for 357 mag, 256 Win mag, etc.
b) A resizing die. This die will probably be bought in a kit with one, two, or three other dies. In straight wall cartridges, carbide resizing dies are available at an extra cost. It is always worth the extra to get carbide. Adjust the die [how far to screw it into the press] per the instructions that come with the die set.
Lee 3 die set for 38 special; $21 steel, $23 carbide
RCBS 3 die set for 38 special: $36
c) A press. Lee Reloader press $20 is a real cheapee, but will always find a use. RCBS Rockchucker $90 is a workhorse of the highest quality.
3) Clean the case.
This step can be done with a couple twists of the wrist with steel wool, or expensive vibrators. Later when you get more tools, you will clean the primer pocket, but it is not needed.
4) Re prime the case.
a) One can buy a priming tool and do it in 2 seconds or fumble with the primer built into RCBS presses and do it 10 seconds.
Lee Auto prime II $13, RCBS priming tool $26
The two tools I mentioned use the same shell holder as used above in resizing. Beware that Lee also sells another priming system ["Lee auto prime" not "Lee auto primer II"] that uses special shell holders. I would avoid that system to start.
b) One must also buy, beg, borrow, or steal new primers.
To buy them mail order, one would have to pay a Hazardous Materials charge [Haz Mat]. Small purchases would be too expensive. Usually 100 primers can be purchased for $1 or $2 at the local gun store. Primers come in combinations of being; magnum or standard, pistol or rifle, and large or small. For 38 special, small pistol primers are what is needed, and will work with standard or magnum, but most published loads with be with standard primers.
5) Fill the case with powder. This is called charging the case. For this one will need powder and a way to measure powder. With black powder, one just fills the case, but with smokeless powder too much powder will fit. Start out using smokeless powder and measuring it. The amount to use depends on the bullet that will be used. The amount is published in load books, or better still on powder manufacturer's web sites for free.
a) Buy powder. There is the Haz Mat problem again, so off to the neighborhood gunstore. Any "pistol powder" will do. Expect to pay ~$20 for a pound in a gunstore. I like Bullseye or Unique powder made by Alliant, but AA#2 or AA#5 work just as well made by Accurate Arms, or Winchester 231, or Hodgdon HS-6, or Vihtavuori 3N37, or IMR SR7625, or dozens of others.
b) Measure the powder. This can be done with cheap plastic measuring cups with handles from Lee, but I would start out weighing the powder. The weighing scales: Lee Perfect powder measure $20, RCBS Uniflow Powder measure $60 [this tool is really nice]
6) Install the bullet. This is called seating the bullet.
a) Buy bullets. For 38 special, .357" diameter or .358" bullets are normally used. You can buy lead bullets or lead bullets covered with copper called jacketed bullets. I would start out with jacketed bullets. These will cost you 5 to 15 cents each and usually bought in 100's.
b) The seating die should have come in the reloading die kit. Put it in the press and put the primed and charged case in the shell holder. Set the bullet on top of the case and raise the ram [push down on the press lever]
c) Measure the over all length of the cartridge [OAL]. This can be done with a ruler, but is best done with dial calipers. Expect to pay $20 for some Chinese calipers or $100 for American.
7) Crimp the case into the bullet. This means the case must pinch the bullet so hard that recoil will not yank the bullet out when other chambers of the revolver are fired [or so the bullet will not get shoved deeper into the case from recoil in magazine or tube fed cartridge]. The type of crimp depends on the type of cartridge. The rimmed 38 special case should be roll crimped. The rimless 9mm cartridge should be taper crimped. The crimping step can be done in one step with the bullet seating, but I would start out doing it in two separate steps. The two steps look the same [cartridge goes into seating die], but can be different in how the seating die is adjusted. Again, adjust the die [how far to screw it into the press] per the instructions that come with the die set and with the seating die, there is also the adjustment of the seating stem [knurled knob on top of the die].
8) Take notes when you shoot your handloads. Write on the targets. Things like "125 gr. bullets shot way low, but 158 gr. bullets were right on." will come in handy next time you sit down to reload or buy bullets.
>From the above it looks like it will cost $110 to get started.
That is 1/3 of what it cost ME to get started.
There are more steps to loading a bottle shaped rifle cartridge, and even more to get them to be very accurate, but after one masters the 38 special, it will make more sense.
Don't start with the .410.
My shpeal on how to get started:
I got an RCBS Rockchucker kit and an RCBS Video, because I was overwhelmed with how to get started reloading.
If I were to advise someone on how to do it that was a friend, I would show him how, and then loan him enough stuff to do it at his home.
Telling someone how to do it on the internet, I would start out with the tasks that have to be done, and list the cheap tools to get, so the the guy can maintain a mental map of the goals:
38 Special is very easy and cheap to load, most people have one, and the guns have mountains of safety margin. They are a good place to start.
1) Get the old primer out of the case, called depriming or decapping.
2) Make the case small enough in inside diameter to grip a bullet and small enough on the outside to fit in the chamber. This is called resizing.
Both steps 1) & 2) are usually accomplished in one step as the resizing die has a decapping pin. This will require:
a) Shell holder ~$3 Lee #1 shell holder or ~$5 RCBS #6 shell holder.
The same size shell holder can be used later for 357 mag, 256 Win mag, etc.
b) A resizing die. This die will probably be bought in a kit with one, two, or three other dies. In straight wall cartridges, carbide resizing dies are available at an extra cost. It is always worth the extra to get carbide. Adjust the die [how far to screw it into the press] per the instructions that come with the die set.
Lee 3 die set for 38 special; $21 steel, $23 carbide
RCBS 3 die set for 38 special: $36
c) A press. Lee Reloader press $20 is a real cheapee, but will always find a use. RCBS Rockchucker $90 is a workhorse of the highest quality.
3) Clean the case.
This step can be done with a couple twists of the wrist with steel wool, or expensive vibrators. Later when you get more tools, you will clean the primer pocket, but it is not needed.
4) Re prime the case.
a) One can buy a priming tool and do it in 2 seconds or fumble with the primer built into RCBS presses and do it 10 seconds.
Lee Auto prime II $13, RCBS priming tool $26
The two tools I mentioned use the same shell holder as used above in resizing. Beware that Lee also sells another priming system ["Lee auto prime" not "Lee auto primer II"] that uses special shell holders. I would avoid that system to start.
b) One must also buy, beg, borrow, or steal new primers.
To buy them mail order, one would have to pay a Hazardous Materials charge [Haz Mat]. Small purchases would be too expensive. Usually 100 primers can be purchased for $1 or $2 at the local gun store. Primers come in combinations of being; magnum or standard, pistol or rifle, and large or small. For 38 special, small pistol primers are what is needed, and will work with standard or magnum, but most published loads with be with standard primers.
5) Fill the case with powder. This is called charging the case. For this one will need powder and a way to measure powder. With black powder, one just fills the case, but with smokeless powder too much powder will fit. Start out using smokeless powder and measuring it. The amount to use depends on the bullet that will be used. The amount is published in load books, or better still on powder manufacturer's web sites for free.
a) Buy powder. There is the Haz Mat problem again, so off to the neighborhood gunstore. Any "pistol powder" will do. Expect to pay ~$20 for a pound in a gunstore. I like Bullseye or Unique powder made by Alliant, but AA#2 or AA#5 work just as well made by Accurate Arms, or Winchester 231, or Hodgdon HS-6, or Vihtavuori 3N37, or IMR SR7625, or dozens of others.
b) Measure the powder. This can be done with cheap plastic measuring cups with handles from Lee, but I would start out weighing the powder. The weighing scales: Lee Perfect powder measure $20, RCBS Uniflow Powder measure $60 [this tool is really nice]
6) Install the bullet. This is called seating the bullet.
a) Buy bullets. For 38 special, .357" diameter or .358" bullets are normally used. You can buy lead bullets or lead bullets covered with copper called jacketed bullets. I would start out with jacketed bullets. These will cost you 5 to 15 cents each and usually bought in 100's.
b) The seating die should have come in the reloading die kit. Put it in the press and put the primed and charged case in the shell holder. Set the bullet on top of the case and raise the ram [push down on the press lever]
c) Measure the over all length of the cartridge [OAL]. This can be done with a ruler, but is best done with dial calipers. Expect to pay $20 for some Chinese calipers or $100 for American.
7) Crimp the case into the bullet. This means the case must pinch the bullet so hard that recoil will not yank the bullet out when other chambers of the revolver are fired [or so the bullet will not get shoved deeper into the case from recoil in magazine or tube fed cartridge]. The type of crimp depends on the type of cartridge. The rimmed 38 special case should be roll crimped. The rimless 9mm cartridge should be taper crimped. The crimping step can be done in one step with the bullet seating, but I would start out doing it in two separate steps. The two steps look the same [cartridge goes into seating die], but can be different in how the seating die is adjusted. Again, adjust the die [how far to screw it into the press] per the instructions that come with the die set and with the seating die, there is also the adjustment of the seating stem [knurled knob on top of the die].
8) Take notes when you shoot your handloads. Write on the targets. Things like "125 gr. bullets shot way low, but 158 gr. bullets were right on." will come in handy next time you sit down to reload or buy bullets.
>From the above it looks like it will cost $110 to get started.
That is 1/3 of what it cost ME to get started.
There are more steps to loading a bottle shaped rifle cartridge, and even more to get them to be very accurate, but after one masters the 38 special, it will make more sense.
Joshua Hutchison
Member
WOW...thats cheaper than I thought to get started.And what a through guide
thanks (I think I will save that as a text file! ^_^ )
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