.45 Colt Cowboy Load...Powder Choice?

[anythingelse]

Hello. I'm looking to load .45 Colt with a 200 grain cast bullet going somewhere in the 800-850 FPS range. I have a ton of Clays powder and would like to use this if possible. However a few posts online warned about double charges with the big case. I briefly considered Cowboy special brass to mitigate the double charge worry but the cost is prohibitive...I could buy factory .45 Colt for what they're asking, not to mention one of the new bulky powders.

Speaking of powder everyone recommends trail boss but it's sold out everywhere and apparently will be for the next few weeks. I can only find one guy with any in stock and the price is so absurd I'd have to order at least three containers for it to be anywhere near reasonable. And I'm really not trying to spend much money when it gets right down to it, especially with a lifetime supply of Clays available.

My father has quite a bit of reloading experience, mostly shotgun and rifle, and he'll be doing all the loading once things are dialed in. It's a single stage press and he seems good about minding the P's and Q's. I just don't want to wind up in the hospital because I was being cheap.

For those with experience can I go with Clays while maintaining a reasonable margin for safety or should I bite the bullet and fork over for trail boss? If I go with Clays would it be possible to weigh loaded rounds to verify charge or will variances in casing and bullet weight make it difficult to detect a 5-6 grain double charge?

 

[ljnowell]

I understand that you already have clays, but thats not something that I use. If you would like I could share some data I have for WST, its a great choice for what you are doing, its just difficult to find data.

 

[TooManyToys]

As long as you are careful to keep track of what you are doing and handling, you should be just fine.
When using a single stage press, double charging is caused by mental mistakes and bad habits
Following good habits will keep you safe no mater what powder you are using.

For instance;
Start with all your prepared & ready to load empty cases on your left in a loading block primer end up. One at a time you pull an empty case from the left side, charge it with a measure powder, visually check it, then place it in a loading block on your right side open end up.
If you follow simple steps like this, you shouldn't get into trouble with any powder you choose.

 

[45lcshooter]

If your worried about people telling you about double charging cases. Before your ready to seat your bullet, dump your cases 1 by 1 on the scale to make sure your didn't double charge. Also 45LC is a big case, you can look down it and see if there is 1 or more than charge in there.

I don't know if it is where i have the lighting on my bench or not. but when i'm charging my cases i can see the very top of the line of powder from no matter where i sit.


Trail Boss, Clays, Unique are all good 45LC powders. I use my Trail Boss mainly for my cast bullet rifles.

 

[USSR]

As long as you are careful to keep track of what you are doing and handling, you should be just fine.
When using a single stage press, double charging is caused by mental mistakes and bad habits
Following good habits will keep you safe no mater what powder you are using.

+1. Drop the powder in the case, look into the case, and then seat the bullet. Some of the best powders for light .45 Colt loads CAN be double charged in cases if you're not paying attention to what you're doing. But paying attention is rule number 1 in reloading.

Don

 

[41 Mag]

For other powders you could consider Universal, AA-2, 5, or possibly 7 even. You might also look for some loads possibly using Red Dot, or Green Dot.

The biggest issue besides a double charge will be finding data for the lighter bullets for this caliber. Most use the 250gr loads. Not that you CAN"T find data just it will be less than with other weights.

 

[Kurastduuks]

Ive been using clays in light loads for years with no kabooms and great results. I always dump one at a time then seat with powders like that tho...if your really concerned trail boss will always serve you well however and was developed with just your application in mind

 

[buck460XVR]

For .45 Colt, shooting lead cowboy loads goin' 800-850 FPS, you cannot beat TrailBoss. Kinda what it is made for. As long as you don't compress it, impossible to double or even overcharge.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Even though I agree Clays is not what I would choose to load the .45 Colt if it's what you have that's what you use as long as it's safe. According to Hodgdon it is safe and they list a charge range of 4.6gr to 5.9gr Clays under a 200gr Cast LRNFP bullet. With a charge range that wide you should be able to achieve your goal without reaching the Max charge. I agree with those who warned you about double charges so be careful.

I load for the 45 Colt with a 250/255gr bullet and I have used W231/HP-38, Red Dot, Unique, Universal, Trail Boss and HS-6. My current favorite powder in the 45 Colt is HS-6(W540). (which is MUCH slower than Clays)

 

[MEHavey]

Just to let folks know there's more than one way to skin a mental cat, I always put the empty
cases in a soup bowl two feet to the right of the measure. I pick a case up, fill from the measure,
and put the case straight down into a loading block. It is then a highly repetitive process
with no breaks between steps. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 -- and all using the same movements
in the same manner.

When the block is filled, I tip it into the light so that the powder levels hit the same place
inside the case walls. and eyeball them side-to-side, row-by row.

THEN I go into the bullet-seating routine, getting a second look inside each case as I pick it up to move it to the press.

Whichever way you do it, repetitive disciple and second/third order checks along the way are essential.
SO IS NOT GETTING INTERRUPTED... for any cause other than the house on fire.

 

[James2]

My routine is similar to MEHavey's. I fill the loading block with casings with powder in them, then before seating bullets I tilt the block towards the light so I can look into each one and make sure there is powder in every one and no doubles. Then the block goes over by the press, and I make sure there are no other brass within reach, then seat bullets.

The problem with loading single stage is the repetition is kinda boring and one's attention span may drift, so you skip a step, or do a step twice, without even thinking about it. Or you have two piles of brass within reach and grab one from the wrong lot. All these things can happen so easily. (Don't ask me how I know.) The procedure I outlined above removes these possibilities.

Whatever routine you choose, make sure to do the check every time and you will be fine.

 

[zxcvbob]

Clays should be about perfect (I haven't tried it, but I like International Clays for its few handgun uses, and regular Clays is even faster) I generally use Promo or American Select when I load 'em light.

According to Hodgdon it is safe and they list a charge range of 4.6gr to 5.9gr Clays under a 200gr Cast LRNFP bullet. With a charge range that wide you should be able to achieve your goal without reaching the Max charge. I agree with those who warned you about double charges so be careful.

There ya go.

 

[MEHavey]

As far as I know, Clays is Clays
(See http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=9208743&postcount=13)

'International' is a totally different powder.
(I do wish Hodgdon had been more clear in their labeling. Someone's gonna hurt one day.)

ADI (Australia) is the actual manufacturer of all three (different) powders
AS30N.................Clays
AS50N.................International
AP70N.................Universal

 

[ArchAngelCD]

As far as I know, Clays is Clays
(See http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=9208743&postcount=13)

'International' is a totally different powder.
(I do wish Hodgdon had been more clear in their labeling. Someone's gonna hurt one day.)

ADI (Australia) is the actual manufacturer of all three (different) powders
AS30N.................Clays
AS50N.................International
AP70N.................Universal

I don't see the post where someone said International Clays and Clays were the same???

Just a side note: Hodgdon has recommended against using International in handgun cartridges. Clays and Universal are just fine though. I think that might have changed recently but for me, if it was unsafe at one time I see no reason to use it now...

 

[Bud0505]

I use Trail Boss and Red Dot with good results. I prefer Red Dot but it seems as though Trail Boss is more readily available.

 

[AethelstanAegen]

*cough* Blackpowder *cough* So much more fun then smokeless in a "cowboy" gun and you don't have to worry about double charging.

 

[MEHavey]

I don't see the post where someone said International Clays and Clays were the same???

Every time I see the words "International Clays" and/or "Universal Clays" associated with the word "Clays" I get very concerned.
Someone is going to confuse "Clays" with International, and/or Universal.

They are completely different powders.
Potentially disasterously so if confused.

 

[Jim Watson]

Yet nobody worries about confusion of names among Red Dot, Green Dot, Blue Dot, and now Clay Dot. Or numbers close together like Reloder 15 and 17, or 4756 and 4759.
Read the label, read the book.

 

[ReloaderFred]

TrailBoss is specifically made for this application. I've been loading 200 gr. RNFP bullets with it for both rifle and pistol, and not only has it proven satisfactory, but it's also proven to be very accurate out of both firearms.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[MEHavey]

There's a reason stoplights are in coLor, not words.

As for 4759, and 4756, even that's that's too close for my dyslexic comfort.

 

[GaryL]

An old fart I know used to say 6gr of Red Dot behind a 250L bullet was THE 45 Colt load. That's a max load in my old Alliant manual. So take it for what its worth - that and a buck will get you a cup of coffee somewhere if you look around enough.

 

[AethelstanAegen]

There's a reason stoplights are in coLor, not words.

Much to the chagrin of those of us that are red/green colorblind. Why in the world they would design those that way when over 10% of males are red/green colorblind is beyond me.

 

[MEHavey]

Personally, I'd use TiteGroup, but if Clays is what the OP has, then the Hodgdon Site has the suggestion:

200 GR. CAST LRNFP
Hodgdon Clays
OAL: 1.600"
7¼" barrel
Min 4.6gr / 777fps / 5,900 CUP
Max 5.9gr / 931fps /13,100 CUP

Everything I've read says stay toward the high end if you want consistent ignition.

 

[anythingelse]

Hey guys I managed to find a local source for Trail Boss. Since ~$17 is much more palatable than ~$70 for a 9oz jar I'll give it a try for the peace of mind alone.

 

[ReloaderFred]

Be careful when you open that 9 ounce bottle of TrailBoss. It's completely full, right up to the brim....... You will get lots of loads out of it, though.

Hope this helps.

Fred