.45 Schofield in .45LC Revolvers

[FPrice]

Does anyone know if the .45 Schofield round can safely be fired in revolvers chambered for the .45LC? It seems to me that I read that this was one of the advantages of the 1873 Colt SAA over the early S&W Schofield in that the Colt would handle both rounds. Do I remember correctly?

 

[Jim Watson]

Yes.
It was good enough for the Army in the 19th century and good enough for many CAS shooters these days.

HOWEVER, as I understand, Ruger .45s have to have the ratchet cut to clear the larger rims of .45 S&W (Schofield.)

Colts and clones are ok now as then.

 

[J Miller]

FPrice,

If you are shooting actual 45 S&W (Schofield) cartridges they have a larger diameter rim that will prevent loading all six chambers in Colt SAAs, or Rugers SAs.

Smith & Wesson DAs or Schofields will work fine with them.

To use the .45 S&W (Schofield) round in a Colt SAA you need to load every other chamber, as there is insufficient room for the larger rims.
For a Ruger the ratchet has to be relieved and if its an OM or early NM the rebated chamber area has to be opened up as well.

If the brass you are using is made to the .45 Colt Government specs, you can use it in any gun chambered for the .45 Colt or the .45 Schofield.

This is the cartridge that the military came up with to remove the supply confussion in the late 1800s. It is also the cartridge that started the "long Colt" nic name. It was made with the rim of the .45 Colt and the case length, bullet weight and powder charge of the .45 S&W (Schofield) cartridge. Then is was headstamped: .45 Colt.

So check the rims and if they look like .45 Colts they can be used safely in any revolver, (and some rifles) chambered for the .45 Colt.
If they are the larger rims, you will have to use them in S&W guns, or have the Rugers modified to use them.


Joe

 

[Jim Watson]

Interesting, I had heard that of .45 1909 but not Schofield.

However, apparently current production .45 Schofield is of some intermediate specification between S&W and Colt/Government diameter because shooting .45 Schofield in .45 Colt revolvers is common practice in CAS... but the Rugers still have to be cut for it, so the rims are larger than LC but not so large as to interfere in a Colt or clone.

 

[FPrice]

Thanks for the info, but as they say, the point is now moot. As I was walking into my dealer's to put some money down on this revolver, another guy was on the phone saying he wanted it.

He who hesitates, has to buy something else. My dealer does have a nice SS Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 Mag......

 

[Jim K]

Jim Watson is correct on the .45 Schofield, sometimes called the .45 Government or .45 Colt Government. When the S&W was adopted, the government had to adopt new ammo because the standard .45 Colt was too long for the S&W chamber. The rim of the new ".45 Government" was the same as the Colt rim but the case was short enough to fit the S&W. So six rounds could be loaded in the Colt, and only one type of .45 ammo had to be issued for both guns.

When the Model 1909 swing cylinder revolver was adopted, though, its ejection system needed a larger rim than that of the old .45 Colt or the .45 Government. That led to the adoption of the Model 1909 cartridge, which is nearly identical to the .45 Colt except for the larger rim; it can be loaded in the Model 1873 but only in every other chamber. This was of no concern to the army, since by 1909 the old single actions had been withdrawn from service, but it bothered civilian shooters.

Just FWIW, the rim size didn't matter in the SAA Colt, since the rim was only needed for case support in firing. Ejection was by ejector rod. Colt did run into a problem when English dealers wanted SA Colts in .476 Eley* and .455 Eley*, which had normal rim diameters. So Colt took the unusual step of making the cylinder window and the cylinder oversize, then drilling the chambers at an angle, so that the rims would fit without altering the position of the barrel and center pin. It evidently worked; Colt sold a fair number of guns in the two calibers.

*The cartridge is normally called the .476 Enfield. It uses the same case as the .455 Webley (.455 Eley), but a larger diameter heel type bullet. For some reason, Colt called both cartridges "Eley" after the British ammunition maker rather than the gun maker. They even carried this custom into the auto pistol era, when magazines for the .455 Webley Auto caliber contract pistols were marked ".455 Eley".

Jim